The bombing has begun...greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread |
...on antiaircraft and radar positions in Belgrade and Kosovo.Clinton is expected to make a statement by 2:30EST
(NPR & CBS)
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999
CBS correspondant abruptly went of the air in the middle of a report.Cruise missles and tomahawks going after air command centers.
"Lots of outdated but servicable Soviet hardware."
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999.
Brett (sp) Sadler on Fox News now. 11:15 am PST.Diane
-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
Mark Phillips (CBS) in Belgrade hearing air raid sirens and seeing flashes.No blackout, everything in town is lit up.
Air raid sirens stopped. Lots of traffic in the streets.
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999.
Pristina, Kosovo blacked out, not sure if it's precaution or from bombing...Here comes Clinton...
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999.
News ppl fleeing en masse. See
What do you think of todays world events?We are actively at war now in a very dangerous situation.
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-- Leska (allaha@earthlink.net), March 24, 1999.
Clinton -Blaming Milosovic
More Serbs moving into Kosovo right now
Three objectives - To demonstrate NATO's seriousness, Send a message to Milosovic, Damage Serb ability.
Not risk-free
Allies must stand against ethnic atrocities.
Will say more tonight...
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999.
Dan Rather -"characterized as massive."
6 or 8 B-52's
Cruise missles from submarines
Followed by 4 or 5 B-2's and tactical aircraft
Targeting communications, power grid, air support system.
Drawing a line at the 44th parallel
Objective - semi-autonomous government in Kosovo, keep stability of region, fear of larger powers getting "sucked in."
Clinton will address nation at 8pm.
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999.
Dan Rathers comments a moment ago on CBS ...This is not a movie. This is not a videogame. This is a form of war.
-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
That's it for the networks.Back to "As the World Turns."
(nice little bit of irony, huh?)
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999.
Stay tuned ... time for a commercial break, from our sponsor.*Sigh*
Diane
-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
Where are the polls? The much vaunted polls that we were drowned in during the impeachment hearings? Why no polls now? But wait, and see: after Bill's speech tonight ("listen to me"), the spinmeisters will get to work with the 'man in the street,' and in two days they will have manufactured consensus that this 'needs to be done.' What a joke. The CIA sets up the KLA, finances them through the Italian heroin market (think Contras/cocaine), then pushes them forward as a legitimate seccesionist people claiming nationhood. Perpetual war for perpetual peace. Not to mention a lovely distraction from the Chinese weapon theft/treason scandal........say a prayer for the children our bombs are killing right now.
-- Spidey (in@jam.com), March 24, 1999.
spidey, I heard on NPR (Clinton lovers) that there was a telephone poll and that the overwhelming majority of Amercans polled were against the bombing. No other details...
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999.
Interesting timing -Didn't Hungary (Serbia neighbor) and Slovenia (?) just join NATO last week?
-- pshannon (pshannon@inch.com), March 24, 1999.
S.F. poll on this page. At the ever shifting moment ...Bomb the Serbs?
Yes, it's to prevent genocide -- 63%
No, it's a messy civil war -- 32%
Where's Kosovo? -- 3%
U.S., allied planes, ships launch attack on Serbs
ROBERT BURNS, AP Military Writer
Wednesday, March 24, 1999
Breaking News Sections
(03-24) 11:16 PST WASHINGTON (AP) -- American and allied warships and bombers today launched the first wave of airstrikes against Yugoslav targets, as President Clinton cast the confrontation as a stand against ``racial, ethnic, religious and cultural'' aggression. ...
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/ article.cgi?file=/news/archive/1999/03/24/national1416EST0687.DTL
-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
Here's Clinton's statement:WJC
-- Lisa (lisa@work.now), March 24, 1999.
CNN top level web-site devoted to Kosovo ...
http://www.cnn.com/Link to DETAILS, video and Live: CNN coverage Real or Windows Media ...
http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/europe/9903/24/nato.attack.bullet/CNN Transcripts: Breaking News (refresh/reload frequently) ...
http://cnn.com/ TRANSCRIPTS/bn.html
-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
I'm sorry, but this is just a little too convenient for WJC. The last two times the cruise missles were launched came at crucial points in the Monicagate scandal and it has since been shown that both attacks were essentially manufactured for the purpose -- an aspirin factory in sudan (owner now suing US) and manuvering Saddam into a corner. Now just as the china spy scandal heats up, we're suddenly devoted to saving Kosovo from the evil Serbs. And why US? This is the Balkans, in Europe, historically the biggest baddest quagmire in the world. the various ethnic groups there have been killing each other for centuries and sucking in the rest of the continent to boot. Not our fight, in my opinion.
-- Cash (cash@andcarry.com), March 24, 1999.
Sticking our nose in where it doesn't belong AGAIN. One of these days we're going to get it chopped off, doing that. Anybody who believes the CNN/ABC/CBS/NBC slant on this is a damn fool - there is NO GENOCIDE going on over there. Hell, do we bomb Israel when they decide to dust southern Lebanon because terrorists did something? NO! This is the same situation. Who gets bombed depends on who we're intent on demonizing at the moment.
-- sickatheart (govt@murderers.suck), March 24, 1999.
Where was Clinton when 500,000 Rwandans were being massacred? This is another ploy to divert attention from a brewing scandal (Chinagate).
-- Nabi Davidson (nabi7@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
Cash and Nabi-You guys are kidding, right? I can't stand Clinton, but this Kosovo attack has zero to do with Chinagate. Moreover, this is a NATO attack. Or do you think Clinton and the Illuminati run NATO as well?
This forum is really beginning to show its true colors. We have threads about deadly sunspots that will wipe out most of the life on earth, martial law camps being built around Southern California, Black helicopters, and I'm sure that I've missed a plethora of others. I think from now on, rather than checking out this forum, I'll just watch the X-Files.
Besides, what the hell does this have to do with Y2K?
-- bored with it (conspiracies@everywhere.com), March 24, 1999.
bored,It's about living in an interconnected world and dominoes.
Diane
-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
President Clinton to address nation at 8:00 p.m. eastern time.
-- Deborah (infowars@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
bored,Don't let the cyber-door hit you in the butt on your way out... Good riddance!
-- Nabi Davidson (nabi7@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
I just saw a guy on CNN Talk-Back Live say we MUST intervene in Kosovo. He compared what's going on there to the Holocaust. GIVE ME A FRIGGIN' BREAK!!!If we as a nation are supposed to protect every oppressed group in the world, where were we when half a million Rwandans were massacred? This action is POLITICAL, not humanitarian. I wish some of you folks would get a clue about how the world really works.
-- Nabi Davidson (nabi7@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
This from Drudge:Vladimir Ryzhkov, leader of the lower house of the Russian parliament said Wednesday that if NATO delivers strikes against the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia, the situation in the Balkans may run out of control and will be "a source of military instability". A date for such a strike "would go down in history as the end of the post-war international relations", he warned...
-- Deborah (infowars@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
Oh $#!+, it's moving too fast!
Yeltsin slams airstrikes, recalls NATO envoyRUSSIA OUT OF NATO, RUSSIA OUT OF NATO, RUSSIA OUT OF NATO !!
[ For Educational Purposes Only ]
3/24/99 -- 4:18 PM
MOSCOW (AP) - Boris Yeltsin pulled Russia out of its partnership with NATO on Wednesday and warned of possible further steps to protest the airstrikes against Yugoslavia - attacks that he called deeply troubling.
If the conflict grows, Russia reserves the right to take ``adequate measures, including of a military character, to ensure its own and general European security,'' Yeltsin said after airstrikes began. His statement did not elaborate.
``Russia is deeply upset by NATO's military action against sovereign Yugoslavia, which is nothing more than open aggression,'' Yeltsin said.
NATO strikes began a few hours after Yeltsin spoke with President Clinton for more than half an hour by phone, urging him not to take the ``tragic step'' of bombing.
Yeltsin also called for an immediate session of the U.N. Security Council.
Russia halted cooperation with NATO and pulled out of the alliance's Partnership for Peace, a program designed to promote military and political cooperation between the West and former Soviet bloc countries.
Yeltsin, who has been ailing, was in the Kremlin on Wednesday for the first time in nearly a month. He ordered the recall of Russia's chief military envoy to NATO, Lt. Gen. Viktor Zavarzin, and the closure of Russia's offices at NATO headquarters in Belgium.
Russia has vehemently opposed the use of force against its ally Yugoslavia for a military crackdown on ethnic Albanians in the province of Kosovo.
The Russian leader said it was ``incomprehensible'' that NATO would carry out an attack without receiving authorization from the U.N. Security Council.
Meanwhile, Yugoslavia's ambassador to Russia, Borislav Milosevic, claimed his country was ready to resume peace talks with U.S. special envoy Richard Holbrooke.
Yugoslavia wants to ``peacefully solve the problems and continue talks on the political agreement,'' said Milosevic, the brother of Yugoslav President Slobodan Milosevic.
Russia has given no sign it wants to get involved militarily in Yugoslavia, although Russia's foreign minister hinted that Moscow may push for the lifting of the international arms embargo against the country.
Russia might even consider withdrawing from the arms embargo unilaterally, Foreign Minister Igor Ivanov said.
Communist leader Gennady Zyuganov, whose party dominates Russia's parliament, said Russia should withdraw from the embargo now and provide arms to Yugoslavia. He also told the Interfax news agency that Russia should step up its nuclear missile programs.
Despite Russia's opposition to NATO strikes, its options appear limited.
Russia is desperately seeking new loans from the International Monetary Fund to revive an economy that's been in deep recession.
Prime Minister Yevgeny Primakov's primary aim on a trip to Washington this week was to secure the loans. But Primakov ordered his plane to turn around over the Atlantic Ocean on Tuesday night when it became clear that peace talks in Yugoslavia had failed.
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-- Leska (allaha@earthlink.net), March 24, 1999.
NATO makes its first attack on a sovereign nation
up on Breaking News
-- Leska (allaha@earthlink.net), March 24, 1999.
Right on Nabi. Where were the cruise missiles when Indonesia took down East Timor ? This is a distraction from ChinaGate.
-- Blue Himalayan (bh@k2.y), March 24, 1999.
Some NATO attack. Italy refuses to play along, right across the Adriatic. The point about Rwanda is a good one. The same thing is going on in East Timor, but there the genocide benefits US/British oil interests. Whenever I see an "ethnic-Albanian refugee," I think of the movie 'Wag the Dog.' Who knows what's real? The 'massacre' of ethnic Albanians that supposedly took place in February was questioned by Le Monde, Le Figaro, and Die Welt, who indicated that the men were KLA guerillas killed in a firefight with Serb regulars, with the propaganda spin laid on thick for U.S. audiences. The Serbs simply refuse to play the NWO game, so we're the hired muscle to kick their faces in.
-- Spidey (in@jam.com), March 24, 1999.
From Yahoo news: <:(=ROME, March 24 (Reuters) - A NATO plane was shot down over northern Kosovo on Wednesday as the 19-member Western alliance unleashed air attacks across Yugoslavia, a NATO spokesman at the Vicenza airbase in Italy said.
``It happened in the northern region (of Kosovo),'' the spokesman told Reuters by telephone. ``We do not know what kind of plane or from which base it came from.''
-- Sysman (y2kboard@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
See also threads ...Russia Threatens NATO!
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id= 000e5xSupport Our Troops
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id= 000eEQ
-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
Bored,You moron. Who do YOU think runs NATO? Out of the three hundred aircraft involved in this, who do you think owns 250? U.S.
If the United States said NO. This would not be happening.
Who do you think is going to pay 95% of the bill? We will.
So, Moron this IS a U.S. thing under the guise of NATO.
Go back to sleep.
-- Kato, Deborah's husband (infowars@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
Kato,You need to do a bit more research. The US will not be footing the bill for this. The US war industry will be making a lot of money out of this. European money floods into the US war industry at ever- increasing amounts.
-- US (makinglotsofmoney@war.com), March 24, 1999.
pshannon,""characterized as massive."
"6 or 8 B-52's..."
Were they B-52's or B-2's? If they're flying 52's over there already, the surgical strike thing is not happening, they're carpet bombing. I'm just trying to get a handle on things. Do you have a link for that quote?
-- d (d@dgi.old), March 24, 1999.
Since I grew up with WJC and have watched him operate, I think I can give you four reasons why he chose now to start bombing:The news media will be too busy with Kosovo headlines to pay much attention to these issues.
1) - Susan McDougal is about to be cross-examined by Starr in her perjury trial this week.
2) - The Cox Report is due to be released any day now.
3) - Juanita Broderick's story is gaining credibility.
4) - The March 31/April 1 fiscal calendars are about to do a tap- dance on all those gov't claims of Y2K compliance.
-- Planebuilder (Y2KOldgeek@aol.com), March 24, 1999.
US,If that's the case why was our economy in the toilet after the Gulf War? (it's the economy stupid?) Was our economy so great in the 70's after Viet Nam?
Yes, everyone in NATO supports $$$ in some small way. Is the US billing NATO allies for every cruise missle fired from our ships, or smart bombs & cruise missles dropped by the Stealth bombers & B52 bombers?
To date so far in news coverage there were 4 German planes involved, which marks the first time since WWII they've flown a military mission. 6 French Mirage fighters involved. Not yet reported how many English Tornados. Without our involvement is this enough to sustain an extended campaign? I have yet to hear of European appropriated funds to replentish OUR stockpiles.
Is Germany expending enough ordinance to open new munitions factories in the US? No.
My opinion is that it should be the reverse. It should be 6 US F16's & the rest European. Let them foot the bill, let them expend their men. Russia should be there.
What would we do if Russia came & started bombing Mexico? We would be on the edge of fighting Russia. What about the Cuban missle crisis? We came how close to war because they put a few missles at our back door? What is Russia thinking right now? This is not a UN thing. NATO has been the arch enemy of Russia for years, now were at their back door? They're pissed. This has the makings of WWIII.
Besides the fact that you ignored my point in response to Tired's statement:
"Moreover, this is a NATO attack. Or do you think Clinton and the Illuminati run NATO as well?"
I don't believe in the Illuminati but YES I do think Clinton runs NATO or any sitting U.S. Commander and Chief. We are NATO. NATO countries wouldn't sneeze without asking the US. We are the UN. We are the worlds 'police force'.
I don't think we should be over there, we have no business over there. We shouldn't be in the middle of a civil war between people who have hated each other for hundreds of years. Risk WWIII for that?
I respect our troops courage, I would never spit in their face for serving their country, but we should bring them home.
-- Kato (infowars@yahoo.com), March 24, 1999.
pshannon...the B-52's are firing stand-off cruise missiles from 600 miles away right now, haven't switched to carpet bombing yet. Two B-2 bombers did enter the country and dropped 16 two thousand pound satelite guided bombs each, then returned safely.I don't think this is a wag the dog thing. Clinton still hasn't changed our Nuclear response stance back to a mode where we could survive a first strike, or at least be able to retaliate. I personally think he is trying to provoke the Russians and Chinese into nuking us. He wants the U.S. destroyed. I think he is criminally insane.
-- Nikoli Krushev (doomsday@y2000.com), March 24, 1999.
Nikoli,Thanks for the answer about the 52's. I wasn't thinking in line with the plane's versatility.
I can't grasp the motive behind this action. If a person wanted to think about conspiracy, that person could look at this action and the sale of secrets to China and imagine the many $$$ involved with another cold war. Could this mark the new beginning of the Russian Bear? The Red Chinese menace? Wag the dog? What's going on?
-- d (d@dgi.old), March 24, 1999.
Uh-oh, Donna Barthuley is going to get mad - this isn't a Y2K post.
-- @ (@@@.@), March 24, 1999.
Nikoli: You think Clinton WANTS us nuked? Isn't that a terrible waste of babes?
-- Spidey (in@jam.com), March 25, 1999.
Back before TSHTF in Sarajevo (this time), I watched a Marine Brigadier General and a Navy Rear Admiral from the military intelligence community testify before a congressional committee on the Balkans (it was televised on one of the CSPAN networks).The essence of their testimony was that the people in this region had been waging ethnic war on each other for fourteen centuries with a fervor and ferocity that is matched only by the Arabs and the Jews, the Irish and the English, the Blacks and the Whites, etc.
The only exception to this was said to be the 70 some odd years when the Soviets held the area in an iron fist.
Both the General and the Admiral urged the congressmen in as strong language as they were able (being restrained by protocol, courtesy and their duty as officers and gentlemen) to keep America out of the entire situation. They predicted that if America got involved, history would repeat itself with a somewhat different cast of characters and that America would be the one with the "iron fist".
As I recall the particulars of their briefing, each and every prediction that they made about US involvement, funding, political ramifications, and difficulty of extraction once involved, has come to pass.
As much as I detest the current president, it is unfair to place all the blame on him. He has, of course, all the responsibility for taking the actions he has, but the congress has known the facts of the situation for going on a decade (at least) and they have not acted either.
Lest we get too smug about it all however, what the Constitution makes clear is that the conduct of this nation is ultimately the responsibility of the people. We all bitch and moan an awful lot about the government (and I do my share and a few others' as well), but most of us do not vote. Those of us who do vote (and I do vote), get the same quality of government as those who don't.
This latest manifestation of America as Maker of all Rules and Enforcer of All Standards is no more or no less criminal and reprehensible than the oppression of her own people through destruction and disregard of the Constitution. Is it really any surprise that the same government that gave the Indians smallpox, massacred nearly 100 human beings at Waco and decorated the murderers of Randy Weaver's family now embarks on raw aggression of a sovereign nation?
It's not "they", it's us! We the people! We're the ones who are supposed to be in charge!
Remember that when you wonder why the world hates us.
-- Hardliner (searcher@internet.com), March 25, 1999.
OBOY !!!!!
-- Dog (desert dog @-sand.com), March 29, 1999.
NEW BOMB ?? Y2K-LIKE BOMB ??
XXX[ For Educational Purposes Only ]
RUSSIAN MILITARY ACCUSES USA OF TESTING NEW SECRET BOMB IN YUGOSLAVIA!
XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX MONDAY, MARCH 29, 1999 23:09:55 UTC XXXXX
RUSSIAN MILITARY ACCUSES USA OF TESTING NEW SECRET BOMB IN YUGOSLAVIA
Russian military officials late on Monday night accused the United States of testing a new secret weapon in Yugoslavia -- a weapon that is somewhere between conventional and nuclear!
"The United States is using Yugoslavia as a test range for its latest secret means of destruction," representatives of the Russian Defense ministry told reporters late Monday night.
The Pentagon refused immediate comment.
Russia claims that a bomb tested in Yugoslavia radically differs from conventional weapons. "It was created in Los Alamos and is aimed to destroy radio electronic equipment," the TASS newswire reported in Tuesday flashes.
The military said that the bomb generates an electric impulse similar to electromagnetic fluctuations caused by a nuclear explosion.
They added that the bombs are being carried by two strategic B-2 bombers of the Stealth technology. Russian military officials provided no other details.
FOOTNOTE: This late night report from Russia's newswire service continues a strange trend that has developed in the past week. By night, the ITAR-TASS wire moves provocative scare stories -- many on Russia's plans for military maneuvers. [On the first night of NATO bombings in Kosovo, TASS shocked with a report that Moscow was considering moving nuclear weapons to southern regions of Russia. Late night reports that Russian ships were on the move also created intrigue.] But during daylight hours, TASS, the official state news agency for Russia, turns more diplomatic, most military talk vanishes. ...
.... [snip]
------------------------------------------------------------------What do you all make of this?
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-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), March 29, 1999.
Ashton & Leska,When you say, ". . .by night. . ." and ". . .during daylight hours. . .", do you mean night or day where you are, where Tass is or GMT or what?
The reason for the type of programming might be more understandable if we knew who it was aimed at and that might be more apparent if we knew whether it was day or night where such aduience was. . .
-- Hardliner (searcher@internet.com), March 30, 1999.
Hardliner, the night & day was commentary by Drudge. When we post an article, we type ---------------------------- to show end of article, and often don't have any of our own commentary afterwards because the whole post is a question: we're hoping others more knowledgeable of the subject will explain for the benefit of all Forum callers.When Arlin confirmed on another thread that theoretically such a weapon was possible, we responded with: "Thanks, Arlin. We were wondering because of the similarities in effects -- Y2K, EMPs, terrorism -- radio + phones + electricity + ?? all out. And those solar flares. So when it's dark and cold next January, the blame will be diffused and everybody will be debating the causes, in between hunt & forage sprees. What a future "
Hardliner, we were hoping you would enlighten us as to the possibility of an EMP bomb and what its effects would be. Now there's three threads slowly turning this over ...
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-- Leska (allaha@earthlink.net), March 30, 1999.
Leska,Sorry, but I'm afraid that I can't add anything. I understand what an EMP does, and that one's produced by a nuclear explosion, but that's the extent of my knowledge.
-- Hardliner (searcher@internet.com), March 30, 1999.
Thanks for responding, Hardliner. Now there's more threads, with an explanation posted. Reading it slowly, trying to understand. Very scary. We're learning a lot. This Forum is good for that! Thanks for all your posts. Hope you don't get called up; hope you are retired!xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxx
-- Leska (allaha@earthlink.net), March 30, 1999.