A Terrifying Rumor...

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This is MinnesotaSmith, the author of the Y2K website www.y2ksafeminnesota.com. I do not know if the following is true, but if it is...

[From J. Whalen] Saw this unconfirmed report (actually no report like this is every going to be confirmable, of course) on the DCY2K email list.

Get out of the city.

Message: 3 Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 10:14:29 CDT From: "Phillip Morris" Subject: FW: Stay the course

>From my friend Ron... sobering.

-----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, August 16, 1999 7:35 AM To: Y2K Mail (E-mail) Subject: Stay the course

Wife and I suffering Y2K burnout again. Just talking about it this morning (I'm checking my work email from home right now). So much money, so much time, so many unknowns. Sometimes I feel that I have absolutely lost my marbles. Other times the fear is almost overwhelming. I think perhaps the root problem is that the more educated a person is the more they can think in the abstract. If you do that.... and you accept as gospel that the failure of systems will cascade to fail other systems.... if you accept that the government has shown itself not only untrustworthy but incompetent to handle any major undertaking.... if you accept that perhaps as much as 50 percent of the population is totally reliant on "just in time" production and delivery of the goods and services they require for daily living... Then the conclusion is unavoidable. We cannot cope with disruption, everything is too interdependent. There is no redundancy for critical systems or services in case of failure. Failure would (will?) bring catastrophic results, the likes of which could be unparalleled in man's history. A friend of mine related a story two days ago which I have no reason to doubt. To "cut to the chase", an acquaintance is a full Colonel in the U.S. Army's elite "Delta Force". Highly responsive, fairly small, lightly armed unit to combat terrorists who may be employed in larger numbers versus onesey, twosey. This Colonel is quoted as saying that his Delta Force unit is now on alert, and has orders to "secure" metropolitan Atlanta no later than 28 Dec 99 with martial law. No one in. No one out for three weeks (approximately January 15, 00). The National Guard units around the country are to secure the other major cities with martial law at the same time - this could come much earlier if say, bank runs began, or other civil chaos as the rollover approaches (people are unpredictable). This also confirms a report I had some months ago from a Captain in the local National Guard here in Panama City. He stated that his unit commander had informed the troops that they would be deploying at the end of December, however, the destination had not been set yet. This Colonel had ordered his son to move out of Atlanta now, while things are stable - that's how we found out about it - the son has a looser tongue that his Dad might have suspected. Containing cities apparently means that the intent is to allow them to "implode", the piranha eating one another, if you ill...instead of trying to ship emergency supplies in or preposition enough supplies. There aren't enough supplies in the world to overcome failure of Just In Time delivery. Once I bring myself through the thought logic again, I always ending up buying more ammunition, or food, or clothing, or anything that I think I might miss. If the new year brings in nothing more than business as usual, I, for one, will dance in the streets, open up a gun shop to try and sell most of the weapons, donate massive quantities of food to the needy, and still be the best prepared household in Florida for the next hurricane. The potential is SO serious, I cannot take chances with the lives of those closest to me. Even then, we may not survive, however it will not be from my neglect or lack of action, it will be because there is yet another event out there that I had not foretold or protected my family from. Stay the course - the worst that can happen to you is that you have more of things you need. Ron.

-- MinnesotaSmith (y2ksafeminnesota@hotmail.com), September 18, 1999


the bible speaks of a great-economic-crash-wherein the merchant,s of the world cry & wail. oh my HOW could the great whore -fail? if y2k ain,t it, it,s coming.

-- not-surprised. (dogs@zianet.com), September 18, 1999.

Sure does sound like c4i's assessment ...

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), September 18, 1999.

Don't sell your supplies if there is no collapse. There are always plenty of uncertain situations in which the contingency equipment might be needed.

As you observe, Elmer can't be depended on, so it is up to us to help our families and neighbors, at least to the extent we are able.

Oh, BTW, there is enough food to feed everyone. It is in elevators and granaries around the nation. JIT won't get it to the stores, but people can buy from the elevators and feed stores. It'll take more work and time to fix meals, but what are we going to do otherwise?

Don't forget blankets and wool clothing.

keepin' on,


-- gene (ekbaker@essex1.com), September 18, 1999.

Are we to take it that you actually believe this Terrifying Rumor Minn. Smith?

-- CD (not@here.com), September 18, 1999.

Another attempt by hucksterSmith to sell product through FUD.

Of course the rumor is TERRIFYING. It wouldn't be worthy of the Tinfoil Sect if it was not. They wet there undies over each little thing.

-- Super Polly (Fu_Q_y2kfreaks@hotmail.com), September 18, 1999.

what about this=rumor.JESUS is coming back to destroy his enemy,s.his FATHER-GOD promised that HE would make HIS enemy,s his footstool. CAREFUL what you say now,ALL MEN,S WORDS ARE RECORDED.

-- good-golly-super-polly. (dogs@zianet.com), September 18, 1999.


Why in the world would it have been decided that martial law will be declared no later than December 28 in Atlanta?

Why Atlanta? Why December 28?

The only reason would be severe infrastructure failure. That would have to mean, I think, things like electricity and/or natural gas and/or water.

What reason -- what evidence and thinking applied thereto -- would anybody have at this date to conclude that such failures are inevitable? Moreover, why would they happen BEFORE January?

Terrifying rumors aren't true just because they're terrifying.

-- Lane Core Jr. (elcore@sgi.net), September 18, 1999.

Lane, I believe CNN is headquartered in Atlanta.

I believe they are a MAJOR part of this Administrations infrastructure!!


-- Ray (ray@totacc.com), September 18, 1999.

Gee, I wonder who could start such a rumor? It could'nt possibly be you, Minnisota Smith, the Y2K Huckster Inc., no of course, not what would be your motive?

-- Watcher7 (anon@anon.com), September 18, 1999.

Don't know gang...according to my intel it sounds dubious to say the least. Known facts about Delta:

1)less than 2500 troopies in Delta total, 2/3's service/support/intel wieniesthat only leaves approx 800 operators

2)Operators are primarily trained in counter-terrorism/hostage rescue/assasination(?), not police issues and crowd control.

3)Very little is known about Delta's ops, only that when they go in somewhere, not many witnesses, and no prisoners that we know of.

4)Unrealistic idea that 800+/- troopies could take and hold a city as big as Atlanta without being augmented by regular Army troops.

I'm still tied into the Special Ops community and the Regular Army community all over the world, specifically at McDill,Bragg,Germany,Ft Lewis, and Ft Hood. Nary a rumble on this. And the idea of using National Guard troops is ludicous. The Federal Gov knows better than to use those clowns.(No offense intended to any Guard boys out there)

-- Billy-Boy (Rakkasn@Yahoo.com), September 18, 1999.

I would have thought that Omaha, NE would be one of the first cities to be zipped up. Lots of stuff goes on in Omaha. One major industry is Union Pacific Railroad, that's where they dispatch trains all across the US. Aren't there underground nuclear silos there too?

-- zulu14 (zulu14@zulu14.com), September 18, 1999.

On the one hand, Ray, you do have a point. On the other hand, that would be a reason for the administration to not let Atlanta "implode".

-- Lane Core Jr. (elcore@sgi.net), September 18, 1999.

Lane, I think an interesting precedent was set with hurricane Floyd. Clinton declared several states "disaster" areas before the hurricane even got there.

-- Gayla (privacy@please.com), September 18, 1999.

I could see the rationale behind selecting Dec. 28 to impose martial law. Late enough to avoid disrupting the holiday shopping season, yet early enough for the media to still be around to propagate instructions to the masses.

Regarding the suggestion that MinnesotaSmith has a vested interest in spreading Y2K horror stories, at least he scrupulously qualified its veracity, which is more than I can say for the Feds.

-- David L (bumpkin@dnet.net), September 18, 1999.

A freind recently told my daughter that her pastor has a very good friend in the Army, high ranking. This guy supposedly told the pastor that things were going to be bad and to prepare. The pastor in his Sunday sermon, told the congragation, that he felt it might be time to prepare and encouraged them to do so. This pastor had been receiving printed material about Y2k that was passed from my daughter to her friend and on to him for months. After his conversation with his Army friend was the first time the pastor had spoken to his church about Y2k. Heresay and rumor, but it appears it is consistent to what others are hearing.

-- Linda A. (adahi@muhlon.com), September 18, 1999.

c4i's assessment is the first post on this thread:

Why Paul Milne is a Polly

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), September 18, 1999.

Thanks, A&L. I had forgotten the specifics of that.

I think it's a rather bizarre fantasy, though.

-- Lane Core Jr. (elcore@sgi.net), September 18, 1999.

the idea that the national guard will seal off the cities to let them implode due to riot and amyhem is the stupidiest thing i have ever heard.

1. the guard works for the governor

2. they are your neighbors, co-workers, and sometimes friends.

3. they are not highly trained in mob control and urban tactics.

4. a national guards men will never open fire on his neighbor unless severly provoked.

5. the police have a much higher level of training in handeling disturbances. and most of the time they use tear gas and at the extreme rubber bullets.

6. if all of the citizens of any city wanted to get out, there would be no way to stop the tidal wave short of a nuke.

7. the politicians serve the majority of the population and will do everything in there power to pacify this population.

there are too many scary thinkers who beleive everything they hear!!!!

-- Guns, Grub & Gold (home@the city.com), September 18, 1999.

Bizarre, but not as much as before. Fantasy we hope! But not as much as before.

When one thinks something is off the wall, just look at what is actually happening in many countries. The reality in other parts of the world makes c4i look mild. We think circumstances may tilt toward "it happening here."

America will be blamed as the Great Computer Satan.

Hope the Current Cabinet Magicians can keep the illusion stronger than reality in 3 1/2 months.

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), September 18, 1999.

The Guard can be controlled by by state or federal authority, so maybe the Governer won't be calling the shots.

Maybe that's why they call it the "National" Guard.

-- Mr. T (treader@dawn.net), September 18, 1999.

Gang...these continual "friend of a friend of a friend" stories just do NOT add up. Unless you get it yourself from the horses mouth, figure it had to come from the other end! Unless the very people I have worked with and slaved with in some of the shittiest parts of the world have been taken over by the 'pod people' then believe me...It might be bad...but "they" are not planning (at this time) to take over ANYTHING! -groan- If we were truly looking at a Y2K issue, and the military was planning on cracking the martial law whip, then why was 3rd Brigade (Blackjack)of the 1st Cavalry Division (Heavy)relieved in Bosnia by a high speed Rapid Deployment Force unit from 2nd Brigade 10th Mountain Division (Light)? You'd want the tenth here in the states...but they aren't...they in Bosnia playing police for the Serbs and Croats et al. so stop worring about it and just be ready for the *other* stuff.

-- Billy-Boy (Rakkasn@Yahoo.com), September 18, 1999.

Lane Core asked, "Why Atlanta?"

The CDC is headquartered in Atlanta.

-- Lynn Ratcliffe (mcgrew@ntr.net), September 18, 1999.

May I suggest reading the following:


date:1998-08-25 subject: The largest 100 cities in the U.S.:primary targets


date:1998-08-29 subject: Cyberterroism:List of 120 cities thought most vulnerable


date:1998-09-28 subject:120 cities:simultaneous failure.Forget it.


date:1999-01-30 subject:National gaurd is planning for public panic


date:1999-05-17 subject:Six partners in U.S. goverment's preparedness


date:1999-07-23 subject:Special forces are special:not used for handing out canned goods at the local retirement home

-- maggie (aaa@aaa.com), September 18, 1999.

we have heard these kinds of rumors before. not to say they couldn't come true, if things get bad enough but i find it hard to believe the gov't wants to declare martial law and get the ball rolling without first having a reason. why stir up the sheep without a reason? i do also believe that people should stay where they decide to be--i certainly don't want folks from DC visiting the suburbs for supplies and I am quite sure that the suburbs won't go to DC. I would rather see that controlled if need be.

actually i was heartened this week--all the local utilities, communities, govts put out a paper to all of Northern VA on Preparing for Emergency Situations and Y2K--it told people to prepare. It actually was not all sweetness and light, it mentioned that if the weather is the cause of the disruption then you should prepare for 3-5 days but that for Y2K--"no one knows what disruptions will occur nor for how long"!!!!!!! Good for them. READ BETWEEN THE LINES NORTHERN VA.

-- tt (cuddluppy@yahoo.com), September 19, 1999.

Billy has some good points and has some connections who are not saying the same things. Just use that to counterbalance the rumors.

One thing for sure, there is no military in the world which will last very long after it is used on its own people (if those people own guns). Thee are not enough US military to control this country out right. There is only one way they can do this and that is to get everyone to believe there is an external enemy who is attacking us. Then they can portray the mils in the street as heros and helpers of the peace. Only if they get virtually everyone to herd into a group who buy into the scenario will those people be willing to be controlled.

It seems to me that the gov has been subtly injecting the 'terrorist' threat into the media message as a means of preping people for this kind of message.

Just some random thoughts.

-- ..- (dit@dot.dash), September 19, 1999.

You think all of the talk from the prez wanting to do more about the gun issue is becuse he cares about your safety.. yea right!!!!

go back to sleep its ok nothing to see. go back to sleep,pay no attention to the man behind the curtian.....

remember center mass and put steel on target!!! mongo, OCT 2 IN DC FOR THE MARCH ON WASHINGTON!!!E ME FOR DETAILS!!

-- Ron (mongo2@prodigy.net), September 19, 1999.

Unless the very people I have worked with and slaved with in some of the shittiest parts of the world have been taken over by the 'pod people' then believe me...

uNLeSs??????? uNLeSS?????? hEe hEE HeE!!!!!!

-- Dieter (questions@toask.com), September 19, 1999.

I tell you, I thought my skin had thickened up and that there wasn't anything I could read anymore that would make my heart drop. But when I read this I felt a chill rush down from my hair folicles to my toenails. Why? last night I dreamed I was begging a friend of mine who lives in downtwon Atlanta to get out. I tried to convince her she was in danger. She laughed. When I woke up I had a an icky feeling and then read this post. *big sigh* .

-- April (Alwzapril@home.com), September 19, 1999.


Reading Between The Lines is unquestionably the most critical skill one needs, in these last days of 1999. The gov't, and quite a few other people and entities are playing a game called "If it gets bad I can claim I warned you, and if nothing happens I can say 'I never said that'".

-- Bokonon (bok0non@my-Deja.com), September 19, 1999.

April, we empathize. It's a weird weird feeling. Especially if it manifests in the physical world. Has happened to us, so we pay attention to stuff like that.

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), September 19, 1999.

*WARNING-Politically Incorrect thought contained in the following message.* Children, those with medical problems, acute liberals, denialists, and any others who might get uncomfortable contemplating changes in your life are advised not to read this thread. The author refuses to be held accountable for your reactions if you choose to read on-they are your own responsibility, so if you dont like the thoughts and speculations contained herein, get over it- this message is presented for consideration only and useful debate is welcome.

Martial Law scenarios presented in this and other forums have taken into consideration only the active personnel available in the standing armed forces and National Guard. Most readers will, I believe, agree that there are too few Men in Green to control the population and protect the physical infrastructure of the American cites should there be widespread failures secondary to the rollover.

Few members of these forums speculating on the ability of goverment forces to actually effect Martial Law have taken into consideration the likelyhood that these miliatry forces would be augmented by local personnel. Police, firefighters, EMS personnel, and others could be drafted into the offical ranks. While these personnel might not normally be considered as potential for this, recent Presidential EO's which allow the goverment to take control and commandeer manpower and supplies and just about any damn thing they want, give precedent that this could occur.

If you consider that a 5,000 troop force would have trouble controlling a city the size of Atlanta, then think about the number of personnel that would be available to do so under a state of emergency that has augmented that force with the police, fire, sherrifs highway patrol, state police, corrections department personnel, etc, with a few thousand national guard thrown in. Suddenly, it seems much more do-able.

So, the local fireman doesnt have the training to fight off active looters-realistically, the personnel would be utilized to support and staff areas and concerns leaving the active and more trained individuals on the firing line. Think it though.

I am not familiar with Atlanta. Those that are could pinpoint the areas that would be expected to riot and burn, should civil unrest break out. I dont believe entire cities would be left to burn, but rather just such areas-as the more affluent portions would be protected if possible because of the valuable physical infrastructure they contain.

While we can all recall TV coverage of rioting-much of this in our lifetime has been expedient-based on the breakout of a segment of the population taking advantage of physical or political opportunities. It has been relatively short lived, and has almost always occured during warm weather.

There are some differences in civil unrest potentials in the upcoming rollover. Some scattered riots that are like those touched off by group psychology-think large groups of emotonally charged people, as riots at sporting events have shown are possible. NYE 1999 Times Square is a powderkeg, IMHO. But its the civil unrest engendered by infrastructure failure and the reactions of the unprepared that are of longer lasting concern, and what we generally speculate about. Most of the US cities will face this is freezing temps, which may discourage large groups of people facing the elements for long periods of time. Should riots occur, about the time the fires burn down the food/water/alcohol/drugs will run out. Promises to provide warm shelter and sustinence will likely result in many abandoning civil unrest for relative comfort and survival in shelters under goverment control. Those remaining should prove less trouble to neutralize to the trained and prepared troops who would probably be utilized for mopping up resistance. Especially under emergency order and/or martial law, when live ammunition is used. You dont need a search order to shoot a looter.

If you think that your loved one or neighbor or friend who is a goverment employee would never countenance participation in such a scenario-think again. Few of these people are prepared to face infrastructure failure of more than a few days. If their families and property are at risk, and the guys in green are standing there with big guns, I doubt that many would fail to comply, at least for some weeks. And most for much longer, if their loved ones are relying/residing in shelters controlled by the same officials. When youve got them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow.

How long this would work, I dont know, I suppose it would depend on many factors that we cant forsee. But the juicy part is that it gets the DC people at least partially off the hook as being the ultimate bad guys-because the locals would be a large part of any such force. And the locals may the ones most likely to make mistakes that would cause public uproar, like shooting people that they shouldnt because of their lack of training and the psychological trauma of having the world turned upside down.

There are other factors to consider. This scenario is much less likely if infrastructure failures dont occur or are short lived. Much might be affected by how widespread any failures are, and if they are total or only partial in nature. If only a few cities fail and go postal, troops could be deployed in larger numbers to fewer areas. Public reaction is a huge variant, as is the time of control necessary before local rule returns. Media coverage-or the lack of it, or the spin used, is a big variable here too.

As a group, modern Americans are not used to being hungry, cold and threatened by the failures that are potential come 1/1/00. We are used to following rules, we expect the cavalry to ride to the disaster scene and help. All of us have seen the tent cities after Andrew, and much TV coverage of the aid thats provided. I think most will cooperate, at least until the spring. I also think that the rough and tumble scenarios will provide just cause under EO or Martial Law for the uncooperative and violent element to be controlled-or eliminated.

It isnt pretty, people, it isnt the America we know. Is it possible? Yes, I think so. Should widespread failures lasting longer than a few weeks occur, I think its likely. If the grid goes Infomajic, there would be few other options to play out-unless we end up like Somalia. I dont like the options, but think it beats the Somalia alternative. Would we be able to sustain it for long-I have no clue, but the wild card of blaming terrorists-which might not need to be manufactured, and creating a spin that leads to more control might happen.

Bottom line? It can happen here. There are the resources to accomplish it, if you think outside the box you will see them. I have been told that the fire department and the EMS in my municipality have been warned that they may be kept on alert for other than normal duties, under the control of emergency management. The legal precedents are in place by the already signed EO's created in the last year or so. There are probably a million or more quasi military goverment workers that could be tapped-and few of them, like the general populace, are prepared to survive infrastructure failure. With their families and loved ones well being at the hands of the goverment ordering them to comply,(psychological hostages if not actual ones) and with a mind set that has not yet acknowledged that the world has changed and thinking that they are putting their post emergency employment at risk, (anticipating all will return to normal soon) I doubt too many would refuse.

An unprepared and dependant populace is a controllable populace. Rogue elements could be eliminated, and that would further cement control. Lack of physical and mental preparation by the majority of our country makes this even more possible. I have bemoaned the failure of DC to warn and prepare the people. For a long time I wondered that they would worry more about the stock market reaction, or of the media response, or they were afraid of looking foolish if nothing really bad happened than if they counseled reasonable preparation. But when you look at the EO's, the little bits of news that have leaked out, and stories about what people have heard (even if much of it can be discounted as FUD or hearsay, some of it is likely to have basis in fact), and critically look at what is being kept from the public, the closed meetings, the sealed reports of the banks, etc,it may be a whiff of smoke.

If so, the failure to prepare the population takes on new meaning-if nothing big happens, great, we go on as before, and we didnt rock the boat too much. But if the house comes tumbling down, TPTB can control the unprepared soooo much easier than those that are relatively self reliant. Looked at in this light, Washingtons continued silence takes on more ominous implications.

I hope Im wrong. I'd much rather be proved paranoid than right on this one. The cure would be much more palatable. A few weeks crocheting doilies and watching movies at the local funny farm, mellowed by good drugs is infinitely preferable. Let's pray we don't find out.

-- LauraA (Laadedah@aol.com), September 19, 1999.

LauraA, yes, yes, and yes.

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), September 19, 1999.

A & L, you don't even want to hear about my recent dream of the big mushroom cloud over the city - while we were all out watching fireworks! LOL And yes, I do pay attention to my dreams - and to my DD's dreams -she is amazing!

BTW, I know Atlanta well. Hub of many things -IBM, UPS, CNN, CDC, AT&T, BellSouth. Do I believe Atlanta is a timebomb, oh yeah!

Close friend is high up in BellSouth - has been attending the weekly Year 2000 meetings in DC since late last year. He will not talk about the meetings. We don't press him or put him in a bad position but he's building a home in Florida - with a well and generator. (not what they say but do) He did mention one snip about a high up natural gas exec claiming all was fine with his system and then another asked a question about some valve or other crucial relay being date sensitive and what would happen if that didn't work. What impressed our friend was that this question put the whole room into silent reflection.

Wonder where Ted and Jane will spend December?

Laura - great post!

-- April (Alwzapril@home.com), September 19, 1999.

I give it a 6 on the nonsense scale, I've seen better fiction. For perspective, the Beach Bug is a 10.


-- FactFinder (FactFinder@bzn.com), September 19, 1999.

Dear Siskal, Eibert and FactFinder:

LOL, so now youre a critic??? Hey, a six isnt too bad! But more useful would be some real info to shoot holes in it. Please, feel free to prove it wrong-as I said, I'd like it to be wrong. I dont present this as fact, nor am I paranoid enough to think its likely to happen-but putting together the talks Ive had in RL and online with the .mil crowd, and some of the thoughts they have presented, has given me the set of possibilities Ive assembled here. A special forces guy was the one to bring up the control of the local issues, something Id never thought of. Think it through-find out where its wrong-Ill be glad to see it if you show me. But just saying you reject it cause you dont like it doesnt prove it impossible.With any luck, it will remain fiction.

-- LauraA (Laadedah@aol.com), September 19, 1999.

Laura, thanks for your insightful analysis.

I may want to borrow your opening paragraph, it's a classic!!


-- Ray (ray@tottacc.com), September 19, 1999.

Guys - Consider DC, it has been working on contingency plans for 14 months now. And they aren't finsihed yet, nor put into place, nor "practiced", but at5 least they are funded, discussed, and are being executed.

Atlanta did not complete any survey report on what systems were vunerable, what systems were even installed, much less what systems were in great treat of failure until April, 1999. Then that report was tied up in a lawsuit when the mayor refused to pay the company because they did not hire a minority contractor from the mayor's "approved" list of contractors (ie, they refused to hire his buddies so his buddies could pay off the mayor.) As far as I can tell, that initial y2k survey report is still ties up in court.

What does that imply about the status of remediation and testing?

Virtually all transportation in this area comes through (or around) Atlanta, or is warehoused here and shipped via a warehouse and trucking company in Atlanta. Also, phones service, the Southern Company head qtrs, GA natural gas distribution, the airport, and most trains service go thorugh here.

I won't say Atlanta can't be "isolated" but it would be impossible to do it and NOT immediately create tremedous trouble economically.

BUT - that also indicates that "cutting off" trouble by martial law before, during and after the turnover is a good way to make sure that infrastructure failure allows "stuff" to keep going through Atlanta without being interrupted by riots and civil disorder. Does the difference make sense?

I agree, Clinton showed his compassionate hand (and how he responds to impending trouble) by declaring disaster areas BEFORE the hurricane started inland - even while it was offshore Central Florida, then Coastal GA, then SC, then NC, then inland areas were each declared a disaster area. Evacuations were preemptive and mandatory - regardless of what each small town wanted, the police and sheriff's office listened ONLY to the state and federal FEMA orders and kept people OUT until days later.

The local police followed suite.

Declare an emergency, train people to respond to "emergency orders" for "good of everybody" - and they will follow. Train law enforcement that those who complain or who resist are "terrorists" - and they will execute orders - as at Ruby Ridge and Waco, as at dozens of ATF attacks since then - particularly if you can increase the propaganda by phony "weapons charges." You don't need a lot of guards to secure many thousand prisoners of war if the prisoners have "surrendered" already......I've seen photos of ten thousand (former) soldiers meekly standing in line waiting for trucks, for food, or simply waiting for the war to end, when only a few (armed) victorious soldiers stood nearby.

If hope is gone, the numbers don't count. If hope and courage remain, numbers don't count.

Question: Wouldn't you expect (demand!) that the military get plans ready ahead of time if certain cities were likely suffer extreme disruption? For example, look a few blocks away from Times Square on December 30, 31. The police, riot squads, and National Guard (?) will be nearby, but not in the square itself.

Warning: Allow a LOT of room for rumors and false statements, and simply bad guesses. Be conservative in any assumption you make.

-- Robert A. Cook, PE (Marietta, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), September 19, 1999.

Oh - the city of Atlanta has "expressed concern" that it may not have enough time to write contingency plans for all its departments (any of its departmetns?) before the end of December - much less approve them, fund them, implement them, or "practice them" with drills or exercises.....

-- Robert A. Cook, PE (Marietta, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), September 19, 1999.

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