Can someone tell me why the Bible does not reference anything about the Dinosaur ERA. It seems to cover just about everything, however there is no mention of the great Dinosaurs that roamed the earth millions of years ago in the old testament.

James

-- James (Anonymous@anonymous.com), March 14, 2005

Answers

Well for startes the word "dinosaur: didnt exist untgil the 19th Cenury.Likewise, the Bibel doesnt cxover everthhing. The story of Genesis rapidly gets to the craiton of adam an eve so it can swifky pass thta by and tell abouthte fall. We don know many things, such as every speicies of Aniaml God created. or how long adam and eve where int he Garden.

The Bible gives basic understandign fo the eents of creation, its not a symposium of all known knowledge.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), March 14, 2005.

The Bible is not a book of zoology. There is absolutely no reason why it would mention dinosaurs or sharks or butterflies or starfishes or zebras, and it doesn't. What would any of these animals have to do with salvation history?

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), March 15, 2005.

Speaking of dinosaurs, has anyone ever wondered what it would have taken to bring one of the big plant eaters down? Say a Brontosaurus (yes, I know they changed it's name, but I can't remember the new one).

70 tons or so of meat, walking by on 4 massive legs lifting the mountain of a beast at least 15 feet off the ground...

It would have taken at least a hundred humans hurling ashen or flint tipped spears, chopping wildly at its ankles with primitive flint axes... hours to bleed it to death. But then...man, what a feast!

Or would they have just aimed for the head - snared it somehow and poked its eyes out? Cut off its air pipe?

I remember reading a thread somewhere among gun enthusiasts who ran a scenario about what you would take if you had to cross an island filled with dinosaurs...on foot.

Rifles and machine guns of various calibers were mentioned...until one guy suggested bringing a flame thrower - the principle being that all animals fear fire.

Thank God the dinosaurs were gone before Adam and Eve left the garden though.

-- Joe (joestong@yahoo.com), March 15, 2005.

Joe

i'd set Eugene on it. it wouldn't last very long.

Eugene would have been in his prime back then too!!!

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), March 15, 2005.

The dinosairs arent gone today...they elive as Birds...

Likewise, why woudld you need to take down an apatosaurus? (Brontosaurus was nto merel an name change, btu two dinosaurs in one, a Bracheosaurus head on an apatosaurus body.)

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), March 15, 2005.

Job 40 - the Behemoth.

-- anon (anon@anon.com), March 15, 2005.

Given the details of the habits of "behemoth" it is apparent that the writer was describing an animal he had personally observed. No human being ever saw a living dinosaur; and when early cultures occasionally discovered such giant bones exposed in various locations, they invariably thought they belonged either to a race of giant humans, or to a carnivorous monster like a dragon. The description of "behemoth" as eating grass and living in the river strongly suggests that the animal being described by the writer is the hippopotamus.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), March 15, 2005.

I dont suppose "behemoth" could be translated. It sounds big.

-- abc (abc@d.e), March 15, 2005.

to answer your question, joe, not much could probably bring down an apatosaur. modern scientists recognize that the apatosaur was large enough that there probably wasnt a predator (t-rex included) capable of killing it. essentially, like you said, the animals legs would have been larger than trees. they travelled in heards and a swing of their tail would break the back of a t-rex, certainly crushing anything smaller. as to what weapons could bring one down? well, if you're a good shot, i'd go with a 50 caliber rifle. if you arent that accurate, i'd probably load up with a LAW rocket launcher.

-- paul h (dontSendMeMail@notAnAddress.com), March 15, 2005.

The reptilian age was finished in Jurrasic times; as well as millions more succeeding years when flora and fauna covered the earth's surface and lived in the seas. All of that prehistoric world was covered over and turning to carbon and petroleum and gas; a whole new mantel of earth --possibly many layers; upon the residue of that organic life.

When the Spirit of God perceived all that was below, Genesis tells us it was in chaos. It was waste and void. He knew everything about that past laying now waste. He just saw no reason to reveal it to the prophets, as he revealed the Garden of Eden to them. Nevertheless, it was all his Creation, because not even one molecule can exist in time, nor is time even in existence, without Him. He allowed men to discover much later, what he was aware of from eternity. This includes dinosaurs!

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), March 15, 2005.

James, The bible does have record of a "behemoth" - Job 40 as anon first pointed out. It certainly sounds like a dinosaur based on all large creates which we know exist or existed. It could have been an elephant I think if not for this line in the passage: "17-He moveth his tail like a cedar"

An elephant or hippopotamus neither have a tail fitting this description. Scientists say that based on carbon dating the dinosaurs went extinct long before man came on the scene (some 65 million years ago). But the Bible says that He (God) created all the land animals on the 6th day of creation, the same day that he created mankind.

Man and dinosaurs may have lived at the same time. There was never a time when dinosaurs ruled the earth. From the very beginning of creation, God gave man dominion over all that was made, even over the dinosaurs.

-- kijana (kijanaking@gmail.com), March 15, 2005.

Dinosaurs are really impressive though. I think they are a testament to the magnificence of God's creation. The Apatosaurus certainly very popular. But the biggest from what I've read appears to be the Argentinosaurus which was more than twice the weight of the Apatosaurus.

-- kijana (kijanaking@gmail.com), March 15, 2005.

1: Creatacious, not jurrassic.This si the end of the age of dinosaurs.

2: Dinosaurs wheret rptiles, and arent extinct.

3: men see dinosaurs every day. I saw them today. Their birds.

4: behemoth was a Beast. a mammal. Not a bird or reptile. Clearly not a dinosaur.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), March 15, 2005.

actually, zarove, today's birds are probably not the direct descendants of land dwelling dinosaurs but rather of sea dwelling animals. you read too much jurassic park. essentially, i used to believe that dinosaurs had evolved into birds, as that book suggested and seems plausable...

however, a simple calculation in my mechanics class revealed that the asteroid which eliminated the dinosaurs displaced and rained down more than 600 billion tons of ash on planet surface. this would be enough to kill every land dwelling plant and animal in a matter of a few days and anything that survived would have starved to death very quickly. while it is never certain, it is reasonably safe to say that every single land dwelling animal with only few exceptions (like cocroaches or animals which lived underground similar to mice or moles) died in that cataclysmic event. thus all evolution met again at animals which left the water again and the few select species which survived by not being on the surface of the planet.

-- paul h (dontSendMeMail@notAnAddress.com), March 15, 2005.

assuming several things. Tbe firts beign the asteroid theory is acurate...

Not everyone beleives the asteroid theory. and even among its adherants, the exact size odf te object is disputed.

Birds whree accordign to the latest boosk I have read descenced form, and are, Terapod dinosaurs. Check a skeleton of a velociraptor and compare to an egle or falcon. Same basic design.

All evidence suggests the therapods are Birds, and the Birds therapods.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), March 15, 2005.

Why can Behemoth not be a dinosaur?
Why can a dinosaur not be counted as a beast?
Why must Behemoth be a reptile?
There were many plant eating dinosaurs.
Apart from a kangaroo, what other living creature today has a tail that could even remotely be compared to a cedar tree?


-- anon (anon@anon.com), March 15, 2005.

Why can Behemoth not be a dinosaur?

For starters, the creature is desurbed as a mammal.

another interstign facxt. Not all dinosaurs whwere huge... and not all extinct large anumasl where dinosaurs. IE, The dimetrodon.

Why can a dinosaur not be counted as a beast?

Beats usually refers to mammals. not reptiles. Not Birds...

Why must Behemoth be a reptile?

The poin is Behemoht is neither rpetile nor Burd. Thereofre behemoht cannot be a Dinosaur.

There were many plant eating dinosaurs.

and many small ones the size of chickens... no oen ever thinks of those...

Apart from a kangaroo, what other living creature today has a tail that could even remotely be compared to a cedar tree?

sinc the pasge is fogurative, plenty... enephants if you press thdem... and even csome oppossums...cROCODILES ARE ANOTEHR EXAMPLE, AS ARE kOMODO DRAGONS... since you said "Living creatues".

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@juno.com), March 15, 2005.

Actually the crocodile is also described in scripture, where it is referred to as "leviathan" (Job 41:1; Ps 74:14; Is 27:1). But "behemoth" certainly is not the crocodile, given its vegetarian habits.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), March 15, 2005.

I didnt say Behemoth was a crocodile, merley that crocs have tials that can be compaed to ceders...

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), March 15, 2005.

Zarove:
You know so very much that we don't know. Why did God give us dogs? Why is the dog a creature with an immortal soul who begs for a treat from his best friend?

Why do dogs sleep half the time, bark and urinate (mark) another quarter of the time and chew on bones or eat Skippy the other quarter of the time? Why do we have to train a dog to roll over? Or to catch a ball (or lead a blind person?) Do dogs pray?

I love dogs. Dogs love me. But a dog never trained me, or prayed to me. Sometimes they bark at me, but I never really understand what's in their dog-mind. It must be something lacking in me. But YOU know, don't you?

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), March 15, 2005.

No dog has written a book. But Kafka wrote the story of a dog; who thought all living creatures were also dogs. He wondered why some of those dogs walked around on two feet. And why their sciences were different from his own, which means watering the ground and fertilizing it so food will grow. The title is ''Investigations of a Dog.'' Interesting and beautiful story.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), March 15, 2005.

A bot off topic for the thread, dont yo htink?

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), March 15, 2005.

When you first start out with the presumption that man never lived during the time that dinosaurs did--that dinosaurs lived billions of years ago.., then certainly you cannot reconcile the clear verses that tell us otherwise.

Taking God at His Word--man certainly did see dinosaur.

And Tyranasaurus Rex, for example-- before the fall--was a vegetarian. Genesis 1:30 tells us that: And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground-everything that has the breath of life in it-I give every green plant for food." And it was so.

Given that understanding, it becomes a little easier to believe that man could have survived such a possibility that he roamed the earth alongside dinosaurs.

We've all heard the word "dragon." We usually associate that image with the legendary dragons of mythical stories. Dragon legends are numerous around the world. Legends tell us that the Chinese bred dragons. Many of the descriptions of these "dragons" fit dinosaurs. Could the stories about dragons actually be accounts of encounters with what we now call dinosaurs?

Even the Bible contains mention of beasts called dragons.

Isaiah 43:20

The beast of the field shall honour me, the dragons and the owls: because I give waters in the wilderness, and rivers in the desert, to give drink to my people, my chosen.

-- (faith01@myway.com), March 15, 2005.

The topic was your expert opinions just a post ago. But don't answer if you dislike going in that direction. Just wanted to offer you food for thought.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), March 15, 2005.

continued...

How about the Leviathon? Couldn't that be what we call the Kronosaurus--a marine reptile/dinosur like creature the measured 42 feet in length?

Job 41:1-34

Canst thou draw out leviathan with an hook? or his tongue with a cord which thou lettest down?

Canst thou put an hook into his nose? or bore his jaw through with a thorn?

Will he make many supplications unto thee? will he speak soft words unto thee?

Will he make a covenant with thee? wilt thou take him for a servant for ever?

Wilt thou play with him as with a bird? or wilt thou bind him for thy maidens?

Shall the companions make a banquet of him? shall they part him among the merchants?

Canst thou fill his skin with barbed irons? or his head with fish spears?

Lay thine hand upon him, remember the battle, do no more.

-- (faith01@myway.com), March 15, 2005.

Job 41 continued...

Behold, the hope of him is in vain: shall not one be cast down even at the sight of him?

None is so fierce that dare stir him up: who then is able to stand before me?

Who hath prevented me, that I should repay him? whatsoever is under the whole heaven is mine.

I will not conceal his parts, nor his power, nor his comely proportion.

Who can discover the face of his garment? or who can come to him with his double bridle?

Who can open the doors of his face? his teeth are terrible round about.

His scales are his pride, shut up together as with a close seal.

One is so near to another, that no air can come between them.

They are joined one to another, they stick together, that they cannot be sundered.

By his neesings a light doth shine, and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning.

Out of his mouth go burning lamps, and sparks of fire leap out.

Out of his nostrils goeth smoke, as out of a seething pot or caldron.

His breath kindleth coals, and a flame goeth out of his mouth.

In his neck remaineth strength, and sorrow is turned into joy before him.

-- (faith01@myway.com), March 15, 2005.

Job 41 continued...

The flakes of his flesh are joined together: they are firm in themselves; they cannot be moved.

His heart is as firm as a stone; yea, as hard as a piece of the nether millstone.

When he raiseth up himself, the mighty are afraid: by reason of breakings they purify themselves.

The sword of him that layeth at him cannot hold: the spear, the dart, nor the habergeon.

He esteemeth iron as straw, and brass as rotten wood.

The arrow cannot make him flee: slingstones are turned with him into stubble.

Darts are counted as stubble: he laugheth at the shaking of a spear.

Sharp stones are under him: he spreadeth sharp pointed things upon the mire.

He maketh the deep to boil like a pot: he maketh the sea like a pot of ointment.

He maketh a path to shine after him; one would think the deep to be hoary.

Upon earth there is not his like, who is made without fear.

He beholdeth all high things: he is a king over all the children of pride.

-- (faith01@myway.com), March 15, 2005.

What about the Pteranodon?

Can a verse like Isaiah 30:6 be a reference to such a dino-bird like creature?

Isaiah 30:6:

The burden of the beasts of the south: into the land of trouble and anguish, from whence come the young and old lion, the viper and fiery flying serpent, they will carry their riches upon the shoulders of young asses, and their treasures upon the bunches of camels, to a people that shall not profit them. And of course, there is always the Bohemeth, which fits the description of a Braciosaurus:

Job 40:15-25:

Behold now behemoth, which I made with thee; he eateth grass as an ox.

Lo now, his strength is in his loins, and his force is in the navel of his belly.

He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together.

His bones are as strong pieces of brass; his bones are like bars of iron.

He is the chief of the ways of God: he that made him can make his sword to approach unto him.

Surely the mountains bring him forth food, where all the beasts of the field play.

He lieth under the shady trees, in the covert of the reed, and fens.

The shady trees cover him with their shadow; the willows of the brook compass him about.

Behold, he drinketh up a river, and hasteth not: he trusteth that he can draw up Jordan into his mouth.

He taketh it with his eyes: his nose pierceth through snares.

Anyone who thinks that this Bohemeth is a description of an elephant or hippo....does so because he has not considered the better fit--due to a preconceived idea that man never saw dinosaurs.

-- (faith01@myway.com), March 15, 2005.

Zarove: Why did God give us dogs? Why is the dog a creature with an immortal soul who begs for a treat from his best friend? Why do dogs sleep half the time, bark and urinate (mark) another quarter of the time and chew on bones or eat Skippy the other quarter of the time? Why do we have to train a dog to roll over? Or to catch a ball (or lead a blind person?) I forgot to add HUNT. Dogs are hunters. Maybe that's alll they dream of, when they're asleep.

Yes, I love dogs. Dogs love me. But a dog never trained me, or prayed to me. And name one dog who has built a doghouse? Dogs can sing and act, in a way. They're smart. But why do you feel they have immortal souls? Thanks, Zarove, for putting up with my foolishness. Ciao--!

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), March 15, 2005.

Oh come on Paul--

You think the description of Leviathon sounds like some little crocodile?

You said:

Actually the crocodile is also described in scripture, where it is referred to as "leviathan" (Job 41:1; Ps 74:14; Is 27:1). But "behemoth" certainly is not the crocodile, given its vegetarian habits.

Have you read Job 41 lately?

I posted it up above--but it wouldn't fit, so it looks like I was spamming or something. I think Greenspun has made some new rule about the length of a post.

-- (faith01@myway.com), March 15, 2005.

Zarove, nothing you have said proves anything. Simply because beast usually refers to mammals doesn't negate the possibility of it referring to reptiles.

Hippos and elephants do NOT have tails that can be compared to cedar trees. Check the context of Job with all the different animals listed, you'll notice the advance in their stature, power, etc.

Also the description of leviathan shows that it is a creature that is big and ferocious.

-- anon (anon@anon.com), March 15, 2005.

I believe he was a wooly mammoth. This extinct species lived well after the final ice age, and was still alive in small numbers during Job's day. If the massive trunk were seen at a distance, the ''tail'' may have become part of man's distorted image of Leviathan. He was the abominable snowman of his day.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), March 15, 2005.

Dinosaurs wherent reptiles though...they where warm blooded.

Daith, Pteranodon may be a popular Pterosaur, but come on, a serpent? Their bodies are far form serpintine, and areny you speculatinvg a bit too much here by assiging a SPACIIF creature to spacific verses? I mena, even if the feiry Flying seprent was a Pterosaur, it obviously wasnt Pteranodon, which lived in North America, not th emiddle east...

why not another Pterosaur at leats?

Leviathon was likelly a crocodile.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), March 15, 2005.

Behold, the hope of him is in vain: shall not one be cast down even at the sight of him?

None is so fierce that dare stir him up: who then is able to stand before me?

If the leviathan were a crocodile, then the above verses are a load of croc. Obviously the bible isn't a load of croc, so the leviathan is not a crocodile

-- anon (anon@anon.com), March 15, 2005.

Yes, those authors just didn't know about Steve, from Crocodile Hunter?? Lol!!

-- (faith01@myway.com), March 15, 2005.

And no rational sicnetists says Dinosaurs lived Billions of years ago, but millions...

yiu forget the fact that htis text is anient, and the ancients feared the crocodile.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), March 15, 2005.

Yes, because a crocodile boils up the ocean and breathes fire from his nostrils all the time. Of course they were afaid of it. I would be too!! Lol!! Who could dare stir this crocodile up? Well, except for Steve, no one. heheh!!!!

-- (faith01@myway.com), March 15, 2005.

In fact the crocodile was the most fearsome and feared creature most people of the time could possibly encounter. They did not have piped-in water. They had to go to the river to wash their clothing and to bathe, and unless there was a well nearby, to obtain water for cooking and other home use. This made them common prey for leviathan, and their natural fear of the beast made it the obvious candidate to represent evil incarnate. Even today crocodiles kill more human beings annually than any other animal.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), March 16, 2005.

"Even today crocodiles kill more human beings annually than any other animal."

I heard it was the hippopotamus that did. Seriously; I read that a couple weeks ago somewhere.

-- Emerald (em@cox.nett), March 16, 2005.