please explian Purgatory for me.... thanx

kt

XxX

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 18, 2005

Answers

Instead of reinventing the wheel (starting a new thread about something that has already been discussed countless times at the forum), please go to the proper "category folder" in the archives, and look for old threads about purgatory. You can read them and then post new messages on them if you wish.

Click here.

To see all the "category folders" in which you can do research, instead of starting new threads, go to the forum's home page and scroll down to the "Older Messages" section near the bottom.

-- Typist (asdf@jkl.com), February 18, 2005.

Here's a point that you probably won't find in the archives:

The real tragedy is that since Protestants don't believe in purgatory they don't pray for the dead. They'll pray for the living but they won't pray for the dead because they figure that since the dead are already in heaven or hell, why pray for them? And that's a shame.

Why? Because God knows every prayer that will ever be said. Even if you say a prayer for a person who died 100 years ago that prayer does not take God by surprise. God doesn't say, "Gee, I wish I would have known that earlier, then I would have given that person the graces necessary to be saved." It's possible that that person was saved precisely because of prayers that were offered on his behalf years after he died.

You don't have to believe in purgatory to believe in praying for the dead.

-- Bonzo's Cousin (bonzoscuz@yahoo.com), February 18, 2005.

bonzo's cousin...i thought you weren't catholic?

-- sdqa (sdqa@sdqa.Com), February 18, 2005.

can god condemn/save someone based on prayers of other people? what has this to do with the person himself? does this makes him better or worse? this makes no sense to me

-- sdqa (sdqa@sdqa.Com), February 18, 2005.

also mormans can baptise on behalf of the dead person... do catholics agree with this?

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 18, 2005.

> can god condemn/save someone based on prayers of other people?

A: If you believe that God answers prayers, then that would include prayers of intercession for others. We know that God often heals people as a result of the prayers of others on their behalf. This includes not only physical and emotional healing but also spiritual healing. Spiritual healing affects a person's chances of being saved. Therefore the prayers of one person can, at least indirectly, affect the salvation of another person.

> "mormans can baptise on behalf of the dead person ...do catholics agree with this?"

A: No. The Catholic Church does not accept either post-mortem baptism or baptism by proxy.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), February 18, 2005.

bonzo's cousin...i thought you weren't catholic?

Your right. I don't know what got into me. :)

can god condemn/save someone based on prayers of other people? what has this to do with the person himself? does this makes him better or worse? this makes no sense to me

"Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects." (James 5:16)

also mormans can baptise on behalf of the dead person... do catholics agree with this?

Of course not. You can't baptize a dead body. But you can pray that God grant that person the graces necessary to be baptized when he was alive, or whatever other graces are necessary to be saved.

Let's say that your uncle was an atheist who lived a debauched life and died 10 years ago in the bed of a woman who was not his wife. But in the last few seconds before he died your uncle repented of his sins and accepted Jesus into his heart as his personal Savior. He did this because God gave him the graces to do it.

Why did God give your uncle the graces to repent and accept Jesus? Because God responded to the prayer that you, a righteous person in God's eyes, now fervently pray 10 years later beseeching God to save your uncle.

Of course, as a Protestant, if you knew that your uncle repented, etc., then you would assume that he was in heaven and you wouldn't pray for him. And if you didn't know that he repented, then you would assume that he was in hell and you wouldn't pray for him, either. So either way your poor uncle doesn't get any prayers for him. Therefore God is less likely to grant your uncle the graces to repent because any prayers for your uncle ceased when he died.

But if you were a Catholic your uncle would still get a ton of prayers after he died because no matter what a Catholic always assumes that his relatives are in purgatory.

-- Bonzo's Cousin (bonzoscuz@yahoo.com), February 18, 2005.

"Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects."

[does this mean if we don't pray for the ppl in purgatory that they ain't gonna get in heaven?,i am responsible for my deeds,noone else]-sdqa

-- sdqa (sdqa@sdqa.Com), February 18, 2005.

"Why did God give your uncle the graces to repent and accept Jesus? Because God responded to the prayer that you, a righteous person in God's eyes, now fervently pray 10 years later beseeching God to save your uncle. "

but as it is said above he has been forgiven and i cant effect that... he is dead...

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 18, 2005.

But God is not affected by our "time."

We human beings have past, present, and future, because we are finite creatures who once did not exist. God, however, is eternal. He never wasn't, if I may use that awkward phrase. God has only one huge "present," in which He can constantly see everything that has ever happened, everything that is happening, and everything that will happen.

Therefore, if we pray for a great-great-grandmother whose body has long been dead ("long" in our sense of time), that prayer can be seen by God as having just as much immediacy and "present-ness" as a prayer that was said for the lady when her body was still alive.

-- Typist (asdf@jkl.com), February 18, 2005.

woah..... i had this convo (not the dead peeps bit) with my phylospy (cant spell) teach... he's mind blowing! (god that is!)

-- kt (jc_died_4_me@hotmail.com), February 18, 2005.

Bonzo's Cousin, aren't you an athiest? *confused*

-- Jason (enchantedfire5@yahoo.com), February 20, 2005.