Readers,

Unfortunately this forum closed due to maintence problems with the server.

If you are interested in continuing a discussion, you can go to this board:

http://p221.ezboard.com/bthechristianforum

The Christian Forum

Or try our URL Forwarder www.bluespun.com

www.Bluespun.com

This was our back up board, but now we all relocated here.

Hope to see you there! All links lead to the same place!

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@gmail.com), November 28, 2005.

Below is a basic stateent about written works and there authority. Lets see who can agree on what points.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), January 08, 2005

Answers

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

All Books commonly held in the Hebrew cannon as used by the Jews, this being the 39 Books called by Christians the “Old Testament”, are scripture, and thus to be included.

Those works, included in the Catholic Church, and Orthodox church, called “Apocrypha” by those not within these groups, but also “Deuterocannonical works”, shall by me be called “he Contested Books”, or “The Inter-testimonial works”, and are not to be seen on the same level as scriptures he Old Testament, But are an authority of Ancient documents, which are to be studied and leaned form, and fair to set doctrine form, provided care is given to them, as they are not as reliable as the above.

Those works Called by the Commons the New testament, consisting of the 27 Books in common lists, shall be considered as equally valid to the Old Testament and are to be given all authority, above the listed Inter-testimonial works, and equal to the Old Testament

The Koran, written by the Prophet Mohammad, is seen as a false work, built upon the theology of Mohammad, and s rejected. Nonetheless, it can be read for cultural instruction and or its moral value, it will simply not be recognised a an authority.

Those books collected called the “Book of Mormon”, purporting to be an Ancient record of the American Peoples, shall be rejected as sacred scripture, and is believed false. Nonetheless, it can be used as Instructive fiction, where need be, provided it is recognised as invalid Scripture and only Instructive fiction. This work shall not be recognised as an authority. Neither shall the accompanying Mormon scriptures, the Pearl of Great Price and the doctrine and covenants, but Both can be read as a mean of instruction in wisdom and Virtue where they apply, and thus t inspire genuine affection and build character.

The writings of the Early Church Fathers are seen as authoritative in the way they understand and expound Knowledge of the Faith, but are not scripture, and can be questioned and probed and disagreed with, provided the point in contestation is not itself in scripture. They shall no be so highly prised, though, as the Contested works.

They shall be of greater regard than the Mormon works, and the Koran, but less than the New testament.

with the writings of the early Church fathers, Include works form such Theologians as Thomas Aquinas, and Modern helical thinkers such as C.S. Lewis. A complete list is not afforded here, but rather offered only in brief, to be elaborated later.

These men help to teach and clarify what is written and had valuable insights, and are as authoritative to me as the early church Fathers. They are not, however, infallible and can be disagreed with safely, provided they did not repeat a clear teaching in Scripture. Nonetheless, they are an authority above the Book of Mormon or the Koran, and les than the scriptures.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

Zarove, I agree with everything except your rejection of the deuterocanonicals, which I hold to be Scripture (along with my church, the Catholic Church). I am not sure, however, what is the purpose of this exercise?

-- Emily ("jesusfollower7@yahoo.com"), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

Well it is a discussion board.

and I didnt reject the deuterocannons outright, I said they where useful, and een placed them above the authority of the Church Fathers. I just palced htem a step below the Accepted Hebrew Cannon, of which the New Testament is equel.

so, they are sort of quasi-Scripture, important ot rea for Hisotrical and thelogical reasosn, js not infallable as the rest.

Im surprised htugh sicne I put modern writters liek Lewis withe Fathers...

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

By "rejection" I meant your rejection of their authority as Scripture. And why are you surprised? C.S. Lewis was indeed very intelligent and offered many good insights for our faith. Lewis and Aquinas I can accept, although I can't say for certain about any others since I do not know to whom you are referring.

-- Emily ("jesusfollower7@yahoo.com"), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

Did not think I had oom for na exhautigve lst, those are examples of the types I mean.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

How about St. Terese of Liseaux? She is a Doctor of the Church. I am currently reading her book, The Story of a Soul.

-- Emily ("jesusfollower7@yahoo.com"), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

Having never read ehr works, I dont know.DOes she have a weblibrary I can paruse?

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

Sorry, make that St. Therese of Lisieux.

-- Emily ("jesusfollower7@yahoo.com"), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

Zarove, let me clarify my position on the Early Church Fathers. They are more valuable than modern writings because they allow us to see what the early Church believed, those who were closest in time to Christ and the apostles. However, they have no more authority than any other writer, except when given by the Catholic Church. (Eg. quoted in Papal documents; or persons declared to be Doctors of the Church.) Nonetheless, this is not authority in the document itself, but assigned by an outside source.

In this way, I can say that the writings of someone like C.S. Lewis may be just as valuable or more valuable for its insights, than say the writings of some early Church father. The writings of neither have no authority in and of themselves. This is in contrast to Sacred Scripture, authored by God Himself.

-- Emily ("jesusfollower7@yahoo.com"), January 08, 2005.

Response to WROTTEN WORKS AND VLAUE. "IT IS WRITTEN"

I tend to agree, form a hisotircal and academic veiw, HOWEVER, speakign form a scriptrual and spiritual level, where we cna learn to practivllay apply these principles, I find Lewis on par withthe curhc Fathers, sicne he makes sence of the scriptures, and helps us to do the same.

On this level, I count him of equel Import as such men liek augustine, Origen, and clement.

Not in the sence of historical research.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), January 08, 2005.