Some people have asked me before what books I accept or reject. Here is a list to clarify these questions.

From the Old Testament accepted by all Christians , Jews, Jehovah's witnesses, and Mormons

The Way-The Church of Yahweh in Christ Jesus

accepts the following:

Old Testament Pentateuch - 5 books Genesis (question mark on Genesis 1-5), Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy

Historical Books - 12 books Joshua, Judges, Ruth, First Samuel, Second Samuel, First Kings, Second Kings, First Chronicles, Second Chronicles, Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther.

Poetical - of these 5 books those in red are questionable as sacred.

Job

, Psalms, Proverbs,

Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon

Prophetical - 17 books Major Prophets - Isaiah, Jeremiah, Lamentations, Ezekiel, Daniel Minor Prophets - Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah, Haggai, Zechariah, Malachi

Also accept these found in Catholic (Roman, Orthodox Bibles...) in the Old Testament

Jesus Ben Sirach

also known as Sirach or Ecclesiasticus (historical and didactical purposes),

I and II Maccabees

(also for historical purposes.)

Don't accept:

additions to Daniel, Baruch, Prayer of Manasseh, Judit, Tobit,The Wisdom of Solomon,The letter of Jeremiah,

From the Orthodox

I Esdras, II Esdras, III and IV Maccabees, Psalm 151

From the Ethiopian

I Enoch and Jubilees

New Testament

Gospels - 5 books Matthew, Mark, Luke, John (except long additions which were not originally in that Gospel. Order of events has been changed too),

Acts

plus

Gospel of Thomas

Pauline Epistles - 13 books Romans, 1 Corinthians, 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 Thessalonians, 2 Thessalonians. 1 Timothy, 2 Timothy, Titus, Philemon

Catholic or Non-Pauline Epistles - 9 books Hebrews (I believe from Barnabas or John Mark , but some authors attribute Hebrews to Paul), James, 1 Peter, 2 Peter, 1 John , 2 John, 3 John, Jude, Revelation (except for Gnostic sections)

So if in red I don't accept as canonical, but in blue yes.

Now, holy is another matter. Not all books qualify as Holy. To be Holy

the Words of Yahweh

must be in them.

So there is a distiction in scripture: Holy books

have Yahweh's words

, Canonical (useful for teaching, historical importance in salvation like Esther which never uses not even God's name), didactic, but not canonical (Job and Ecclesiastes fall in this category), and good for reading but with caution additions to Daniel, Tobit, Judit,....)

The Christian Yahwist

From:

The Way-The Church of Yahweh in Christ Jesus

PS: From modern Churches we also reject

the Book of Mormon

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 11, 2004

Answers

Ad you jus Unilaterlly decided this? On what grounds?

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), October 11, 2004.

As you can see there are too many canons of scripture :The Samaritan, The Jewish, The Old Syriac, The Protestant (Luther's version), The Protestant , The Romqn Catholic, The Orthodox Catholic, the Russian (Slavonic),The Ethiopian,...The Mormon...

Christians and other believers in the God of Abraham:El Shaddai, later known as Yahweh have never been on agreement.

As faith has shown before in a dialogue with Paul, there are books like 2 Peter ch. 3 which talk about Paul's letters.

Also Jesus Ben Sirach mentions all the books of the Old Testament except for Job, Esther, and Daniel (Chapters 44-51).

So using them as guides, and checking for true doctrine, I came up with this canon.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 11, 2004.

My belief system, Zarove, is closer to Christadelphianism

What Christadelphians believe

Christadelphians Worldwide

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 11, 2004.

Catholics did not settle the matter until the Council of Trent.

Here is a linkWhich compares the Old testament among most Christians

Which Churches accept them

There is no unanimous agreement. Never was any in the past either.

Even in Jesus days, there were two canons of the Hebrew scriptures: One in Hebrew and one in Greek. The writers of the New Testament use both.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 11, 2004.

Actually Pope St. Damasus first "settled" the matter in 382 AD, when He engaged St. Jerome to produce the latin Vulgate version, the finest, most accurate translation of the Bible ever produced in any language. The Pope informed Jerome exactly which books were to be included, and those books are precisely the same 73 that have constituted the Canon of Scripture ever since. However, that action did not make the Canon infallibly binding on the universal Christian Church. The Council of Hippo was convened in 394 to review the Canon of Damasus and to make proposals regarding any possible adjustments before official promulgation. The Council was unable to complete the task, so the Third Council of Carthage was called in 394 to complete the work. This Council fully approved the Canon as determined by Pope Damasus, and sent their findings to the Pope for ratification, like the findings of any Council, after which the canon was officially promulgated as binding on the universal Church. Some concerns remained among some prominent clergy, which were addressed at the Fourth Council of Carthage in 419, resulting again in exact reaffirmation of the Canon of Carthage III. The exact same Canon was once again affirmed without change at the Ecumenical Council of Florence in 1441, after which there should have been no reason for any Council to ever address the issue again. However, 115 years later a rebellious Catholic priest spawned a tradition which rejected a great part of what Jesus Christ had given to the world, including His Own authoritative Church, His persobally appointed vicar on earth, infallible doctrine of divine origin, and portions of His Holy Word. The Church of God responded by once again reaffirming, at the Council of trent in 1556, the true Canon of Scripture, precisely as it had been defined at Carthage. So, it is ludicrous to say that the Canon was never settled until Trent. It was officially defined for all time after the Council of Carthage in 397, and it never would have been addressed at Trent at all if it were not for the fact that the Canon was under attack at that time from the Protestant Rebellion.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), October 11, 2004.

Regional councils are not binding on the whole Catholic Church, Paul M.

We have many of them like Puebla, Medellin,... whose canons were not taken by the Church in recent times.

Hippo, Carthage...also fall in that category. They were not binding on the whole church.

Besides, as faith had pointed out earlier, Jerome preferred the Jewish Canon to the Greek (Septuagint) canon.

Also the Church has treated the Didache, the Protoevangelium,...as scripture not in the Bible.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 12, 2004.

Local decisions of regional Councils are not binding on the universal Church as such; however, the Councils of Hippo and Carthage, while having the form of Regional Councils, were specifically convened by the Pope for the express purpose of defining the Canon of Scripture for the universal Church. They were Ragional in structure, but not in purpose. The Council reported its findings directly to the Pope, and the resultant papal propagation of the Canon was, still is, and always will be binding upon the universal Church. However, to address just such spurious objections as you are raising, the 73 books of the Canon of Carthage were reaffirmed without change by the the Council of Florence, which WAS an Ecumenical Council. So now the Canon of Carthage is clearly binding upon even those who wrongfully question the authority of the Council of Carthage.

Some local churches treated the Didache, the Protoevangelium and many other apocryphal writings as Scriptural prior to the formal definition of the Canon at Carthage. That was precisely the reason that Hippo and Carthage were convened. Once Carthage finished its work, such writings were forever excluded from the Canon, and that decision was and is binding on all Christians.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), October 12, 2004.

Like you said Paul, Trent accepted the decisions of Carthage and Athanasius letter to have a precedent. But the Popes never convened these regional councils. Even the decisions of ecumenical councils were later rejected . There was one in 362 which affirmed the arian position. It was dropped once Emperor Theodosius made the Catholic position the only position.

The was another in the 700s dealing with images. That one has never been accepted in the West.

Now, if Jerome preferred the Jewish canon, then why did the Church reject him on this? Because many reading from the New Testament come from the Septuagint (The Jewish Greek Canon).

Accepting The Jewish will do away with many erroneous beliefs:

Mary is no longer a virgin (parthenos) but a neannis.(Matthew 1). Almah is neannis not Parthenos in Greek. Thus, the Virgin myth is gone. Besides, Isaiah 7:14 deals with King Hezekiah's birth. He was the son of Ahaz to whom the prophecy was directed. The prophecy of the virgin birth was never about Jesus. Not even Paul mentions it in his letters.

Jesus is no longer the counselor,mighty God of Isaiah and Hebrews. By the way, this refers to a king, like Hezekiah. God is also a word for judge. .....

Also, God's name will be there: Yahweh, thus avoiding the confusion of Lord = Adonai (Yahweh) and Lord =Adoni = Mar in Aramaic (Jesus) of Psalm 110.

It wasn't until way back in 1982 my Catholic priest, father Francis conkle told me God's name is Yahweh that my eyes began to open to the truth.

We used to have long dialogues. Once I asked him. Why teach something you don't believe in....

he answered: "when I chose this path, I wanted to help people. If I teach something the Church doesn't agree with, then I lose my job...."

Our topic was whether Jesus was Yahweh.

2 months before a friend , Juan de Lucas, had said , "Jesus died, God cannot die." This led me into a path foor the truth. I don't regret ever being a Roman catholic. But God Yahweh chose this path for me on July 23, 2000. He showed me too that Jesus is the one showing us the way to salvation.

The Christian Yahwist

The Man of Yahweh

In the end,

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 12, 2004.

Why use ye the Gospel of Thomas though?

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), October 13, 2004.

Zarove, Thomas Gospel contains sayings of Jesus in a more purified form. Unlike the Gospels where you find them already as part of a story. 78 sayings are found in Matthew , Mark, and Luke. 2 in John. Thomas Gospel has 114 sayings. Only about 13 are Gnostic. I find Revelation and John's Gospel more Gnostic than Thomas. Examples: Jesus goes through the closed doors in John after his resurrection. Jesus never touches lepers in John but he does in Mark.

Thomas in many English Translations

Gospel of Thomas saying by saying.

See in detail: Thomas Gospel and its parallel passages with Matthew, Mark, and Luke

Here is an excerpt from the previous link on Thomas:

Look at saying 6 and compare it with Matthew's chapter 6. (Mathew's Ch. 5-7 , the sermon on the mount, is a collection of Thomas Gospel's sayings ordered in such a way that they resemble Moses sermon on the 10 commandments....in Exodus and Deutronomy. Matthew treats Jesus as the New Moses.

I chose this section from Tomas because of the question of prayer and fasting you made.

Nag Hammadi Coptic Text BLATZ

(6) His disciples asked him (and) said to him:

Do you want us to fast? And how shall we pray (and) give alms? What diet should we observe? Jesus said: Do not lie, and what you abhor, do not do;

for all things are manifest in the sight of heaven; for there is nothing hidden which will not be revealed, and there is nothing covered which will remain without being uncovered. LAYTON

(6) His disciples questioned him and said to him, "Do you want us to fast? And how shall we pray? Shall we give alms? And what kind of diet shall we follow?" Jesus said, "Do not lie, and do not do what you hate. For all things are disclosed before heaven. For there is nothing obscure that will not be shown forth, and there is nothing covered that will remain without being disclosed." DORESSE

6 [6]. His disciples asked and said to him: "Do you want us to fast? How shall we pray, how shall we give alms, what rules concerning eating shall we follow?" Jesus says: "Tell no lie, and whatever you hate, do not do: for all these things are manifest to the face of heaven; nothing hidden will fail to be revealed and nothing disguised will fail before long to be made public!" Oxyrhynchus Greek Fragment DORESSE - Oxyrhynchus

[His disciples] asked [and] say to him: "How shall we fa[st and how shall we pr]ay, and how [. . .], and what rules shall [we] follow [concerning eating"] Jesus says: [". . .] do not [. . .] of truth [. . .] hidden [. . ."] ATTRIDGE - Oxyrhynchus

(6) [His disciples] questioned him [and said], "How [shall we] fast? [How shall we pray]? How [shall we give alms]? What [diet] shall [we] observe?" Jesus said, "[Do not tell lies, and] do not do what you [hate, for all things are plain in the sight] of truth. [For nothing] hidden [will not become manifest]." Funk's Parallels

POxy654 6, GThom 14:1, POxy1 27, GThom 27, GThom 104, POxy654 5:2-3, GThom 5:2, Tob 4:15, Luke 11:1-4, Luke 6:31, Luke 8:16-17, Luke 12:1- 3, Matt 6:2-4, Matt 6:5-15, Matt 6:16-18, Matt 7:12, Matt 10:26-33, Mark 4:21-22, Did 8:1-3, POxy1224 2, Did 1:1-2.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 13, 2004.

Shouldn't you call a council to decide upon a new canon?

Or maybe I'm just ignorant.

-- Max Darity (arrowtouch@yahoo.com), October 19, 2004.

When did the Orthodox call an Ecumenical council to decide on scripture, Max?

At least we know Jesus disciples called a general (first ecumenical) council in AD 50 to deal with foods, Sabbaths,...

But as far as I know there has never been an ecumenical council for the sole pupose of creating an accepted canon, Max. Or are you ignorant of this, too?

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 19, 2004.