is a hate filled man.

-- anti (you@me.com), October 04, 2004

Answers

Hi, wlcome tot he forum. One wonders, though, why your hwere isince its clear you both Hate God and ghave a poor grasp pf theology. ( God is not a man...Numbers 23:19.

19. God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?)

Nor is God hate filled. Indeed, a famous passage in the Bibel is in 1 John 4:8- " He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love."

I see you have no real difficulty desemenatign Hatred though, so perhaps you shodi; meet God?

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), October 04, 2004.

Jesus is not God.

Also, he did not preach hate.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 05, 2004.

Elp- Neither Anti nor I mentioend Jesus. However, Jesus was God, but even if he wasnt, Anti's comments where abotu God, and my scriptiures where as well.

-- ZAR (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), October 05, 2004.

"Since our knowledge of God is limited, our language about him is equally so"

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), October 05, 2004.

God is the supreme being who always was and always will be.

I've wanted to answer that question ever since my grand dad messed it up about 104 years ago, and I was never called on during my confirmation about 40 years ago. The only catechism question I felt sure of.

I've finally made right with it for the Ryan's (grandfather) and the Furst's (me)

-- Jim (furst@flash.net), October 05, 2004.

That's true, Ian. Our knowledge of God is limited.

This person, zarove and Ian is the same from Science VS God thread. There is @*.com.

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 05, 2004.

maybe if you view God as being hateful it is because your life contains conduct that God does hate. There are acts of immorality that God states that he hates.

-- Luke Juarez (hubertdorm@yahoo.com), October 05, 2004.

Did somebody stick in the word "hate" in the Scriptures because that's what they imagined? I thought God is love. How in all of creation can God hate if He is perfection?

I still maintain that "hates" is a substitute word for "rejects".

................

-- rod (elreyrod@yahoo.com), October 05, 2004.

Rod, maybe less loved or someone you have given up already. That is what seems to have happened to Esau (Esav in Hebrew).

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 06, 2004.

Despite what modern Arians like to proclaim, Jesus is truly God, truly one with the Father from Eternity.

"The Word became flesh and made His home with us"

And yes, Jesus is filled with hate... hate for the evil that causes suffering and hurt in humanity and His wrath will be revealed one day on those who cause and spread this suffering and hurt, especially those who attack His Bride.

Pop culture is so full of icons that try to act tough and big - even mocking God. People today don't know what "tough" and "big" is. They're starving for the Real Lord, the Almighty King, who can destroy His ememies with one word if He wants, but He refrains until the Last Day. They're locked in sin, afraid to turn to Him because they don't realize He loves them and has died for them, that their sin is paid for and they can return to the Shepherd if they want.

The Lord Jesus is surely full of love and grace, but if you throw your lot in with Satan, expect to suffer pain and wrath in your soul AND body along with Satan and all those evil spirits He despises come the day of judgment.

-- Max Darity (arrowtouch@yahoo.com), October 07, 2004.

Max, I am not an Arian. Jehovah's witnesses are Arians.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 07, 2004.

What is ... ??

Just my opinion:

Something I will never accept in ALL the ways of everything , it's made-up by mankind , so it can be real !!

But also I got a question:

Why is that this keeps on going for centuries , on & on , why & how ??

Salut & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:

-- Laurent LUG (.@...), October 12, 2004.

Laurent

careful, you will become Christian if you follow that question through to its conclusion.

i would start at the beginning and ask why so many people died for the faith - in circumstances hwere it would have been easier to tow the line.

the Jews persecuted Christians, the Romans persecuted Christians. that didn't stop the martyrs.

or ask why within only 20 years every major city had Christianity.

then look out the window and convince yourself that the world and creation just happened - from NOTHING. now that's magic.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), October 12, 2004.

Improvement:

Just my opinion:

Something I will never accept in ALL the ways of everything , it's made-up by mankind , so it can't be real !!

Salut & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:

-- Laurent LUG (.@...), October 12, 2004.

the Jews persecuted Christians, the Romans persecuted Christians. that didn't stop the martyrs.

For example , 4 different religions , which of them is the best ?? __ Why there are so many religions , if the conclusions is , they all have the same "leader": their creator , mankind ??

or ask why within only 20 years every major city had Christianity.

then look out the window and convince yourself that the world and creation just happened - from NOTHING. now that's magic.

Nobody seems to know the right answer !!

Salut & Cheers from a NON BELIEVER:

-- Laurent LUG (.@...), October 12, 2004.

Laurent

there are so many religions because there are so many humans, each capable of error.

it is entirely possible to sift through the religions of the world to compare and contrast. that might sound difficult but one might start by bunching Christianity, Judaism and Islam together as they are inter-connected to some extent.

you will quickly be able to dismiss many of the exotic faith systems and identify those "religions" that are in fact life styles or ways of living your life.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), October 12, 2004.

>Max, I am not an Arian.<

You believe Christ is a created being. That makes you a modern version of the old Arians in your Christology... unless I've misinterpreted your many posts.

Christ is Eternal Life. Only God is Eternal. If you don't have the Eternal (uncreated/unending) Jesus, you don't have Eternal Life.

-- Max Darity (arrowtouch@yahoo.com), October 21, 2004.

Arians believed in the virgin birth. Even Jehovah's Witnesses the modern version do.

I am more of an Ebionite on that: I flatly reject the virgin birth on 2 grounds.

1) The prophecy in Isaiah ch. 7 is about the birth of King Hezekiah, the son of Ahaz. The prophecy was for Ahaz rto verify. Ahaz could not verify what happened about Jesus 730 years later.

2) Hebrew uses Almah (neannis in Greek)instead of Bethulah (parthenos in Greek). It was thids mistake in Greek that the writer of matthew used, thus creating the myth of the virgin birth of Jesus.

But the Apostle Paul in Ch. 1 of Romans clearly states for the ages that Jesus was the product of a sexual union between Joseph and his wife Mary. That is the meaning of from david the flesh

Even Nestorian, as Ian has called me before believe in the virgin birth. Protestants are the modern Nestorians since they denied mary is the mother of God. I believe Mary was the true modern 100% of the human Jesus in the flesh.

So I am Jamesian-Petrine-pauline sort of Christian.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 21, 2004.

Elpidio

the Blessed Virgin was most certainly 100% the Mother of God.

you said: "I believe Mary was the true modern 100% of the human Jesus in the flesh".

where's the issue?

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), October 21, 2004.

Elpidio,

Who was "the human Jesus"? Was there more than one? I see only one Jesus mentioned in Scripture - the one Mary gave birth to. Or are you suggesting that Mary was the mother of only "part" of her Son? If so, can you explain how a woman can give birth to part of a person?

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), October 21, 2004.

Your thought process has been already programmed to see 2 facets to Jesus: one divine and one human. This comes from The Chalcedonian council of 451 when the Tome of Leo in which Jesus 2 natures were accepted by the majority of those present.

The Copts , Armenians, syrians,.... did not. This led to the Monophosyte controversy.

Do I believe Jesus had 2 natures, one divine and one human? Yes. But not the way Catholics (Roman and Orthodox) do.

When God Yahweh already predetermines someone in this world, Paul, he does one of 2 things: sends his spirit to make the Child Holy (This is what I believe most likely happened to jesus), or he sends an angel from Heaven to Earth to incarnate into a human body.(This is the position of the Jehovah's witnesses. he is the archangel Michael).

The Catholic position is that God took human form.

My problem with that is that this negates Jesus as human since God Yahweh is a life force spirit. As Moses showed, just the mere presence of Yahweh makes your whole body shine. Yahweh is like a Hidrogen bomb (like our son), ever shining. Thus, God yahweh's spirit cannot be controlled by a human body. There is too much radiation for the body to absorb. The human body will not be able to overrcome God Yahweh's light.

But like I said, you like many others have been pre-programmed to think of Jesus as 2 natures. That is why, it takes time to reason this as not true as beived by Catholics.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 21, 2004.

>But the Apostle Paul in Ch. 1 of Romans clearly states for the ages that Jesus was the product of a sexual union between Joseph and his wife Mary. That is the meaning of from david the flesh <

"And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph"

Luke gives Mary's geneaology, Heli being Joseph's step-dad. Joseph was not the biological son of Christ, for even the Gospels declare that Mary was pregnant before they were married.

>Protestants are the modern Nestorians since they denied mary is the mother of God.<

Luther (Protetant) did not deny Mary was the Mother of God. Get your facts straight, man. No offense.

"God says . . . : "Mary's Son is My only Son." Thus Mary is the Mother of God." - Luther, On the Councils and the Church, 1539

"She is the true mother of God and bearer of God . . . Mary suckled God, rocked God to sleep, prepared broth and soup for God, etc. For God and man are one person, one Christ, one Son, one Jesus, not two Christs" - Luther, On the Councils and the Church, 1539

Maybe other Protestants shied away from using the title later, but they all still held Mary to be the mother of the Lord.

>I believe Mary was the true modern 100% of the human Jesus in the flesh.<

Huh? Mary was the "Mother of the Lord" even as Elizabeth exclaimed.

>So I am Jamesian-Petrine-pauline sort of Christian. <

Sounds fun, but you've got some mistakes you need to work out, eh.

-- Max Darity (arrowtouch@yahoo.com), October 21, 2004.

Elpidio, you contradict yourself. You state, rightly, that God is Spirit. And yet you describe Him in terms of "light" and "radiation", which are merely forms of physical energy, part of the natural Creation, not anything spiritual or eternal at all. Light and radiation came into existence at some point. God did not. Speaking of God in such terms takes scriptural symbolism and tries to make it a physical reality. No form of matter or energy can be part of God, for Spirits are not of the natural realm. Obviously if God or an angel appeared to someone, they would have to take on some sort of physical appearance, for we cannot see Spirits as they truly are. However, Spirits in their essence have nothing to do with the physical, including the electromagnetic spectrum.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), October 21, 2004.

I did not contradict myself, Paul.

God Yahweh is not like the Spirit of his angels .

His body burns with a certain kind of light which emanates from him like the fire from logs

Exd 3:2 And the angel of Yahweh appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush [was] not consumed. Again, when Yahweh descends on Mount Sinai he descends like fire. He burned the mountaintop. If he does this to a mountain how much a fleshy human.

Exd 19:18 And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because Yahweh descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.

Why did Moses face shine even after God Yahweh talked to him, Paul? Exd 34:29 And it came to pass, when Moses came down from mount Sinai with the two tables of testimony in Moses' hand, when he came down from the mount, that Moses wist not that the skin of his face shone while he talked with him.

Exd 34:30 And when Aaron and all the children of Israel saw Moses, behold, the skin of his face shone; and they were afraid to come nigh him. ....

Exd 34:33 And [till] Moses had done speaking with them, he put a vail on his face.

Exd 34:34 But when Moses went in before Yahweh to speak with him, he took the vail off, until he came out. And he came out, and spake unto the children of Israel [that] which he was commanded.

Exd 34:35 And the children of Israel saw the face of Moses, that the skin of Moses' face shone: and Moses put the vail upon his face again, until he went in to speak with him.

As you can see from modern science, radiation lasts even after you are no longer in contact with it. Or can you find anothr explanation as to why Moses body did shine even afer he had left Yahweh back up there in the mountain?

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 21, 2004.

Hmm.

Awhile back, I read through a large thick book dealing with the Freemason "theology". It was mind boggling and confusing, but I did manage to get a basic philosophy. If my understanding is anywhere near correct, the Freemasons understand God as "Light". My simple mind equated their belief similar to that of the Sun Worshippers. It didn't seem like "Light" was referred to as symbolic. I think they literally thought of God as light.

..........................

-- rod (elreyrod@yahoo.com), October 21, 2004.

The way I saw him, Rod, he was like a fire, but the light doesn't burn you.

My wife was awake when that happened the second time, in October 2000. She said my face was glowing like a lightbulb. Once the light was gone, she woke me up and asked me questions about my dream.

If God yahweh can light up my face in a dream, I wondr in real life, Rod!!!

Unfortunately, Rod, we don't have Moses in a home movie to verify his face shining.

The Christian Yahwist

-- Elpidio Gonzalez (egonval@yahoo.com), October 21, 2004.