ISLAM revisited...interesting argument : LUSENET : A.M.E. Today Discussion : One Thread

This is from the Internet. The authorship has been disputed, but the argument is valid. Our God tells us not only to show kindness to, but to love our enemies. I do not want to serve any god who tells us to kill those who do not believe.

Before someone brings up the Israelites, let me say that their enemies weren't 100% human, and so they don't count.

Jesus or Allah? - Rick Mathes

Last month, I attended the annual training session required for maintaining my state prison security clearance.  During the training session, there were presentations by speakers representing the Roman Catholic, Protestant and Muslim faiths.  Each man explained his belief system.

I was particularly interested in what the Islamic Imam had to say.  The Imam gave a great presentation of the basics of Islam, complete with a video.  After the presentations, time was provided for questions and answers.

When it was my turn, I directed my question to the Imam, and asked: "Please, correct me if I'm wrong.  I understand that most Imams, and clerics of Islam, have declared jihad [Holy war] against the infidels of the world.  By killing an infidel, which is a command to all Muslims, they are assured of a place in heaven.  If that is so, can you give me the definition of an infidel?"

There was no disagreement with my statements, and, without hesitation, he replied, "Non-believers!"

I responded: "So, let me make sure I have this straight.  All followers of Allah have been commanded to kill everyone who is not a Muslim, so they can go to Heaven.  Is that correct?"

The expression on his face changed from one of authority and command to that of a little boy who had just gotten caught with his hand in the cookie jar.  He sheepishly replied, "Yes."

I then stated: "Well, sir, I have a real problem.  I cannot imagine Pope John Paul commanding all Catholics to kill Muslims, or  Dr. Stanley ordering all Protestants to do the same, in order to go to Heaven!"

The Imam was speechless.

I continued: "I also have problem with being your friend, when you and your brother clerics are telling your followers to kill me.  Let me ask you a question.  Would you rather have your Allah, who tells you to kill  me, in order for you to go to heaven, or my Jesus, who tells me to love you, because I am going to heaven, and He wants you to be with me?"

You could have heard a pin drop as the Imam hung his head in shame.

----  The author, Rick Mathes, is a well-known leader in prison ministry.

-- Anonymous, April 12, 2004


I don't doubt your report Rev. Harper, but this does not ring true to me. Sometimes we are so obsessed with our "agenda" that we dream up promotions for that agenda. Be Blessed

-- Anonymous, April 12, 2004

What does not ring true for you Reverend? If you doubt the basis of the above article, let me help you.

From [/b]The Holy Qur'an[/b]

Surah 8:12. Remeber thy Lord inspired The angels (with the message): "I am with you: give Firmness to the Believers: I will instil terror Into the hearts of the Unbelievers: Smite ye above their necks And smite all their Finger tips off them."

Surah 19:5. But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them and seize them, beleaguer them and lie in wait of them In every stratagem (of war); But if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: For Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

Surah 9:73. Oh Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their abode is Hell - An evil refuge indeed.

Surah 98:6. Those who reject truth among the people of the book and among the polytheists will be in hellfire to dwell therein. They are the worst of creatures.

Well Rev. this is just a small sampling of the "Holy Book" that the "Peaceful" religion of Islam is based. Please let me know if these examples do not "ring-true" for you.


-- Anonymous, April 14, 2004

The "Imam was spechless", I'v know a few and "speechless" is not how I would describe them. In fact the Muslims are better at defending their faith than we Christians. "The Imam hung his head in shame". You can't even imagine Farakan hanging his head in shame. All the Muslims I know always has an answer regardless on what you say to them.

-- Anonymous, April 15, 2004

GSB, you made my argument for me. One who believes in the Quran does not become speechless or ashamed in the face of a Christian Witness, does he?

-- Anonymous, April 15, 2004

A muslim hang his head in shame? And miss his chance at paradise where 72 young virgins and 28 young boys are awaiting the faithful?

-- Anonymous, April 15, 2004

Thank you Rev. Harper for such insightful commentary.

What bothers me most about all the actions by the radical Islamic fundamentalists is that absolutely no muslim cleric or leader of a muslim nation has denounced it or pleaded with them to stop this senseless killing. Moreover, I have not seen a conference by any muslim leaders in the US denouncing these terrorist acts. If Islam is a religion of peace, then there should be an outcry by Muslims all over the world against the murders of innocent people by these terrorists.

I thank God that some of those Japanese terrorists have been released. I was horrified when I heard that they had planned to burn them alive. I thought that surely some Islamic cleric in Iraq and throughout the Muslim world would publicly denounce their actions and plead for their release. Forget about religion, where is the humanity in people when we keep silent on issues of this nature?


-- Anonymous, April 15, 2004

Brothers and Sisters,

What I know about Islam would fill a child's thimbal about half way, yet I'm compelled to respond to this bashing of one of the world's great religions. Its my impression that Islam worships God and hates evil. The difference we see played out on the screen are the lenghts to which Islamic fundamentalist are prepared to go in defense of their religion and to defeat the Great Satan. To portray them as blood-thirsty heathens who desire only war and strife is just plain ignorant. Everybody (sweeping generalization) needs a reason to fight. What's their's?

In Christ,

-- Anonymous, April 16, 2004

It is horrifying to note that those who say they love God and believe in peace would go to such great lengths to destroy those who have different views. That includes us and them. The bottom line is "who's in charge?" Love to all of you.

May the PEACE OF GOD rule in every heart

-- Anonymous, April 16, 2004

I believe that even though Muslims live a good life, they can become dangerous at a moments notice.

I had some Muslim friends in the past. The Bible horrifies them.

The reason I could converse with them is because I am not a trinitarian. I don't belive that Jesus is God.

I had sent the Patriarch of Antioch, Maran Mar Ignatius Zakka Iwas some letters where I asked him why he was very friendly to Muslims. He is located in damascus, Syria. Muslims have almost finished his Church there after welcoming them during the conquests of 632 AD. They are descendants of the Christian Jacobites. Now known as the Church of the East or The Syriac Orthodox Church.

I never received a response.

We must not aloow Muslims to have a foothold the way they have with Shaquille, Muhammad Ali (Cassius Clay), Lew Alcindor (Karem), ....

The Christian Yahwist

-- Anonymous, April 16, 2004

Dear Brothers and Sisters,

Get over being horrified. Just where do you think you're at? This ain't heaven. You sit behind your manicured hedge horrified at what you see unfolding in this place? Don't you know that for these very reasons the Lord will judge the quick and the dead?

In Love,

-- Anonymous, April 16, 2004

It's troubling to see someone who admittingly knows little about a religion which he labels as one the world greatest. Maybe if you opened up your narrow view you would understand how islam was founded by a thief and pedophile who conviently laid out new rules to suit his perverted longings. But of course you will never entertain such things and your mind is shut tight not wanting to upset the apple cart.

-- Anonymous, April 16, 2004

Bigotry knows no bounds.

-- Anonymous, April 17, 2004

Now, Really! Jesus never demanded that anyone believe in Him. He simply said that if you trusted Him, you would gain eternal life with he and the Father. Then the choice is yours. If one choose Islam, why should that bother those who choose Christ? Or if one chooses to believe in no god? Jesus said "Preach the Gospel" He never said to make them believe.

Be Blessed

-- Anonymous, April 17, 2004

Moderator Here

First, You should specify whose post you are replying to.

Second, As the moderator, it is my prerogative to edit/delete posts as necessary.

Third, When you use fake e-mail addresses, or pretend to be another member of the discussion, I figure that you have neither the common decency or courage to stand by your convictions, and therefore don't have the right to post here.

Why you ask? Because Islam does not believe in peaceful coexistance. You would be killed or allowed to convert. Glad to see you erased my post. I guess its ok for you to cast insults upon me by calling me a bigot but you can't take the same. The truth of islam is something you choose to ignore and create this wonderful little idea that everyone can live in peace and harmony no matter what there religion...

What a beautiful world you all live in...

I hope you'll wake up from you psychosis.

-- Anonymous, April 18, 2004

What if one does not wake up from their psychosis? How does that create a problem for you?

-- Anonymous, April 18, 2004

I never pretended to be any of the other posters here. That is a lie. I don't think my email address is any of your business so I used a fake one yes. How does that not make me "worthy" of posting on this forum? Courage and conviction are not things that can be measured on a forum. If you care so much about my conviction, I have no problem telling you about islam to your face.

-- Anonymous, April 18, 2004

To the so-called Rev. James:

None of the other posters uses fake e-mail addresses; that's how firm we are in our convictions. So while I cannot measure courage and conviction on a forum, I can measure tact and manners. You don't seem to possess either, so until you have the courage and conviction and faith that we won't spam you, feel free to post somewhere else.

Thank you, and good day...

-- Anonymous, April 18, 2004

Moderation questions? read the FAQ