Since becoming a Catholic this year, I have had occasion to attend mass at quite a few different churches and, probably without exception, the Gloria is part of the mass. But in my own church, it is omitted altogether. Is it just MY church, or are other churches omitting the Gloria? And why do you think this happens - is it because the Gloria is optional, or what? At this point, I don't want to ask my priest for fear he just might think I'm being confrontational. So can anyone tell me if any other churches omit it? And why? (I just happen to like to participate in reciting or singing the Gloria during mass!)

-- Dee (Dee@none.sorry), September 16, 2003

Answers

Not to fret Dee. That happens to be the script for this week at that church. It might be back in the script next week.

-- Terry (abc@304.com), September 16, 2003.

Dee,

It's my understanding that the Gloria is to be said(sung) on all Sundays except in Advent or Lent. Don't know why your church wouldn't, perhaps you should ask the priest. Of course you might want to wait a post or two, maybe someone will have a better response than me.

A layman,

Frank

-- Someone (ChimingIn@twocents.cam), September 16, 2003.

Hello, Dee.

The matter is not nearly as simple as what Terry told you.
The answer to your question depends on certain facts that you have not provided -- namely, the day of the week and the liturgical season of the year when there was no "Gloria." Let me explain ...

(1) If you are talking about there being no Gloria on a Sunday, then you have to consider the season. If it is Advent or Lent, then all is well, because the Gloria must be omitted during those penitential seasons. But if is a Sunday outside of Advent and Lent, then it is wrong for the Gloria to be omitted. [There would have to be an extremely serious reason, such as the priest's serious obligation to leave the church by a certain time on the clock.]

(2) If you are talking about there being no Gloria on a day other than Sunday, then that is usually normal. The only weekdays on which you should expect to hear the Gloria are those that have the rank of "feast" or "solemnity." I think that there are only between ten and twenty of each of these during the course of a year -- and some of them fall on Sunday anyway. (Note that this does not include days that have the rank of "memorial" or "optional memorial" -- i.e., most saints' days.)

So that takes care of when to expect to hear the Gloria (and I agree with you that it really is a most beautiful hymn/prayer). Next, you'd like to know why it would be omitted. I mentioned two possibilities:
(1) the Church's liturgical law calls for it to be omitted usually.
(2) the law calls for it to be said or sung, but a grave reason allows the priest to abbreviate the Mass.
To these, I would add the following other possibilities:
(3) the priest made a mistake of forgetfulness.
(4) the priest unjustifiably omitted it because he lacks faith in some doctrine it declares (e.g., that Jesus "take[s] away the sin of the world).
(5) the priest is kowtowing to radical feminists who dislike some of the words used. [God is referred to as "Lord" (three times) and "King" and "Son" and "Father" (four times!) -- the kind of allegedly "sexist" and "patriarchal" lingo that is verboten in feminazi circles.]

If it turns out that, Dee, that the Gloria is being omitted intentionally and unjustifiably, you should bring this to the attention of the priest -- in writing or face-to-face (according to your "comfort zone"). All you need to do is ask the priest to look at, and be sure to follow, the General Instruction of the Roman Missal ["GIRM"] -- in the front of the Sacramentary on the altar. [No priest has the authority to ignore/disobey this.] If, as is probably true, the priest has the old GIRM (replaced in 2000), he should look at article #31. If he has a copy of the new GIRM, he should look at article #53. Here are the two texts:

(old) #31. The "Gloria" is an ancient hymn in which the Church, assembled in the Holy Spirit, praises and entreats the Father and the Lamb. It is sung by the congregation, or by the congregation alternately with the choir, or by the choir alone. If not sung, it is to be recited either by all together or in alternation. The "Gloria" is sung or said on Sundays outside Advent and Lent, on solemnities and feasts, and in special, more solemn celebrations.

(new) #53. The Gloria is a very ancient and venerable hymn in which the Church, gathered together in the Holy Spirit, glorifies and entreats God the Father and the Lamb. The text of this hymn may not be replaced by any other text. The Gloria is intoned by the priest or, if appropriate, by a cantor or by the choir; but it is sung either by everyone together, or by the people alternately with the choir, or by the choir alone. If not sung, it is to be recited either by all together or by two parts of the congregation responding one to the other. It is sung or said on Sundays outside the Seasons of Advent and Lent, on solemnities and feasts, and at special celebrations of a more solemn character.

God bless you.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), September 16, 2003.

PS: If memory serves me correctly, there are two sets of special days on the calendar when the Gloria is used. The great solemnities of Christmas and Easter are celebrated not just on one day, but throughout their "octave" (eight-day period). I believe that the Gloria is said or sung on each day during these festive octaves.
JFG

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), September 16, 2003.

John,

Where do you come with this information from? You're like a human computer.

.

-- . (David@excite.com), September 16, 2003.

Oh, no, no, David.

Just as you can train a dog by repetition, so my repeated experiences have trained the "dog" in me. I have memorized a few basic things through repetition, and I have learned where to go to find and copy some more complicated things. I am nothing more special than a pack animal, plodding along. It's enjoyable work, better than I deserve!

God bless you.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), September 16, 2003.

This is great information J.F. I never thought things in the holy mass were so deep.

-- Abraham T (lijothengil@yahoo.com), September 16, 2003.

Usually when a priest wants to shorten Mass he either cuts out the music (and I mean not only songs/hymns, but also speaks what is usually sung such as the responsorial psalm), and/or drops the homily....

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), September 16, 2003.

Thank you, all, for this wealth of information (especially from John). I was referring to Sunday mass (I didn't really expect it would be part of a weekday mass), and can definitely say I have NEVER heard the Gloria performed at any Sunday mass at my church, outside of Advent or Lent. So next step is to just ask my priest why not, I guess. At this point, I certainly don't feel comfortable directing him to the relative GIRM, etc., so I'll just see what he has to say. (I mean, who am I, this new Catholic, telling a PRIEST how to conduct a mass...yikes!!). I'll let you know how it goes, though. Thanks again.

-- Dee (Dee@none.sorry), September 17, 2003.

Dee,

Sometimes its not what you say, but its how you say it.

-- David (.@....;), September 17, 2003.

Dear Dee,

You ask, Who are you to tell a priest how to conduct a Mass?, and your reticence is understandable. Most Catholics would feel the same way. Which is why liberal priests get away with mutilating the liturgy in so many ways. The answer to your question is - You are the Church! As such you have the right to expect that official ministers of the Church who are ordained for the purpose of serving you will present the sacraments and liturgy of the Church in a manner consistent with the teachings and requirements of the Church, not according to their own whims or preferences. A priest has NO valid choice in such matters. He MUST celebrate the Mass according to required liturgical norms. If my priest took such liberties with the Mass, I would first ask him about it informally, as you indicated you intend to do. If he did not offer a satisfactory explanation (it doesn't sound like there is one in the case you described), I would present him with a politely worded but clearly stated letter expressing my concerns, and would attach the relevant excerpt from the GIRM. (Obviously this would be easier if you had a number of co-signers). This is not a "petition", just an expression of legitimate concern from his parishioners. If the situation were not corrected within a short time, I would write to the diocesan Office of Worship or Office of Liturgy, or whatever it is called in your diocese, expressing the same concern, and attaching a copy of the letter I had given to the priest. If I still got no satisfaction, I would write directly to the bishop, attaching both of my previous letters. I'm a pretty reserved individual, and certainly don't consider myself an "activist" in any sense, but certain situations are simply too important to allow to continue uncontested, and any unauthorized redesigning of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass is one such situation.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), September 17, 2003.

Thank you, Paul, for setting me straight. It's still intimidating, though, and I'm sure you can understand my reticence. But clearly, as you point out, I'm obliged to act in the way you advise. I will certainly do my best in that regard.

Thanks again.

-- Dee (Dee@none.sorry), September 17, 2003.

This is like reading a good book and then finding the last few pages torn out :(

how did this story ever end???

DdS

-- D diSIlva (music@crispin.com), February 29, 2004.