Circumcision of the Old Testament.greenspun.com : LUSENET : Catholic : One Thread
Did circumcision in the Old Testament have a spiritual effect when one had it done to them? Such as their sins were cut off by God, like in the same way baptism has a spiritual effect in the New Testament?
Or was it just a sign that pointed towards the fact that God has "cut off" their sins?
Can a Catholic please answer, than you.
-- Jason Baccaro (LegendsRborn@aol.com), May 07, 2003
Here's a fairly in-depth coverage of the topic:
-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 07, 2003.
Interesting. I would say since Jesus came and fulfilled the old covenant, that would no longer be necessary, however the site goes into much more detail and factual (scripture-wise) information. Very much appreciated, Paul!
-- OperaDiva (firstname.lastname@example.org), May 07, 2003.
Circumcision was a covenant between Yahweh and the Israelites (today's Jews). Genesis 17 1 And Abram is a son of ninety and nine years, and Jehovah appeareth unto Abram, and saith unto him, `I [am] God Almighty, walk habitually before Me, and be thou perfect; 2 and I give My covenant between Me and thee, and multiply thee very exceedingly.' 3 And Abram falleth upon his face, and God speaketh with him, saying, 4 `I -- lo, My covenant [is] with thee, and thou hast become father of a multitude of nations; 5 and thy name is no more called Abram, but thy name hath been Abraham, for father of a multitude of nations have I made thee; 6 and I have made thee exceeding fruitful, and made thee become nations, and kings go out from thee. 7 `And I have established My covenant between Me and thee, and thy seed after thee, to their generations, for a covenant age-during, to become God to thee, and to thy seed after thee; 8 and I have given to thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land of thy sojournings, the whole land of Canaan, for a possession age-during, and I have become their God.' 9 And God saith unto Abraham, `And thou dost keep My covenant, thou and thy seed after thee, to their generations; 10 this [is] My covenant which ye keep between Me and you, and thy seed after thee: Every male of you [is] to be circumcised; 11 and ye have circumcised the flesh of your foreskin, and it hath become a token of a covenant between Me and you. 12 `And a son of eight days is circumcised by you; every male to your generations, born in the house, or bought with money from any son of a stranger, who is not of thy seed; 13 he is certainly circumcised who [is] born in thine house, or bought with thy money; and My covenant hath become in your flesh a covenant age-during; 14 and an uncircumcised one, a male, the flesh of whose foreskin is not circumcised, even that person hath been cut off from his people; My covenant he hath broken.' 15 And God saith unto Abraham, `Sarai thy wife -- thou dost not call her name Sarai, for Sarah [is] her name; 16 and I have blessed her, and have also given to thee a son from her; and I have blessed her, and she hath become nations -- kings of peoples are from her.' 17 And Abraham falleth upon his face, and laugheth, and saith in his heart, `To the son of an hundred years is one born? or doth Sarah -- daughter of ninety years -- bear?' 18 And Abraham saith unto God, `O that Ishmael may live before Thee;' 19 and God saith, `Sarah thy wife is certainly bearing a son to thee, and thou hast called his name Isaac, and I have established My covenant with him, for a covenant age-during, to his seed after him. 20 As to Ishmael, I have heard thee; lo, I have blessed him, and made him fruitful, and multiplied him, very exceedingly; twelve princes doth he beget, and I have made him become a great nation; 21 and My covenant I establish with Isaac, whom Sarah doth bear to thee at this appointed time in the next year;' 22 and He finisheth speaking with him, and God goeth up from Abraham. 23 And Abraham taketh Ishmael his son, and all those born in his house, and all those bought with his money -- every male among the men of Abraham's house -- and circumciseth the flesh of their foreskin, in this self-same day, as God hath spoken with him. 24 And Abraham [is] a son of ninety and nine years in the flesh of his foreskin being circumcised; 25 and Ishmael his son [is] a son of thirteen years in the flesh of his foreskin being circumcised; 26 in this self-same day hath Abraham been circumcised, and Ishmael his son; 27 and all the men of his house -- born in the house, and bought with money from the son of a stranger -- have been circumcised with him.
It is not a covenant between Yahweh and Gentiles like us. Acts 10 44 While Peter is yet speaking these sayings, the Holy spirit fell upon all those hearing the word, 45 and those of the circumcision believing were astonished -- as many as came with Peter -- because also upon the nations the gift of the Holy Spirit hath been poured out, 46 for they were hearing them speaking with tongues and magnifying God. 47 Then answered Peter, `The water is any one able to forbid, that these may not be baptized, who the Holy Spirit did receive -- even as also we?' 48 he commanded them also to be baptized in the name of the Lord; then they besought him to remain certain days.
-- Elpidio Gonzalez (email@example.com), May 08, 2003.
Sins and foreskin have absolutely not relationship whatsoever.
-- Leon (firstname.lastname@example.org), May 11, 2003.
There is, Leon. For the Jews, circumcision was like for us is baptism. If you did not circumcise you were not an Israelite. (I am talking about men). If you don't receive baptism as a Roman Catholic, you are still in sin. You are not a member of the Church.
That is why there was a discussion between Paul and James, that even got Peter in trouble. See the first 3 chapters of Galatians. Also see letter of James. Also see Acts when Paul comes to Jerusalem for the last time.
-- Elpidio Gonzalez (email@example.com), May 16, 2003.