While doing research, I learned that several churches who claim apostolic succession have holy orders that are declared, "valid but irregular" by the Vatican. Does anyone have a good explanation of what this may mean in layman terms?

There seems to be a dynamic effort by the Vatican to rebond with the Churches eventhough they may not be currently in union with the Pope.

It appears that some may have valid succession. In particular, a succession from Bishop Costa who left the Roman Catholic Church, founded the Brazilian Apostolic Church, and ordained priests as fellow bishops. Some of these returned to the Roman Catholic Church, were accepted and "reappointed" as Bishops, thus validating their ordinations and ordinations performed by them.

This is a very interesting subject.

-- john placette (jplacette@catholic.org), January 24, 2003

Answers

It probably means they were ordained by a bishop who himself was legitimately ordained, but did not have permission from the Magisterium to ordain them. Therefore, valid but irregular.

Disobedience isn't all that interesting.

-- Christine L :-) (christine_lehman@hotmail.com), January 24, 2003.

Isn't interesting?? IF you want to play an ostrich then surely it isn't. But if you want to stretch your hand to those who can shake it that is a different matter!

-- (victorms@hotmail.com), January 24, 2003.

I stand by my opinion - disobedience isn't interesting. It's depressing. And annoying. And irritating.

But not interesting - except in the sense of the old Chinese curse, "May you live in interesting times."

-- Christine L. :-) (christine_lehman@hotmail.com), January 24, 2003.

Folks I want to post a short piece here, I want to be constructive rather than be destructive. Aside from all the other discussions we have had. May they rest in peace, or maybe the garbage can. Why would any bishop tolerate this behaviour? In fairness to this priest he is a great humanitarian, but does he hurt the faith? I believe he encourages laxity in worship, He brings out their best in the secular things.

JAW-DROP:

This Can't Be Serious (but it is!): Novus Ordo Priest features psychedelic "mass," carries off statues to the trash, rides down the church aisle in a motorcycle, dresses up as Superman or the Grinch for "mass," swears, TEACHES EVIDENT MODERNISM FLAT-OUT (he denies we have souls, he denies Transubstantiation, etc. SEE HERE), says he "hate[s] the Rosary"....and HIS BISHOP DOES NOTHING! Here is a photo of this priest's bishop, Walter Sullivan:

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), January 25, 2003.

Yes, the Church has enemies within as well as without. A slap in the face to all the good priests who celebrate the Novus Ordo with full dignity and a profound sense of the sacred.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), January 25, 2003.

In conclusion, it can be said that all the prophecies broadly agree that "A Great Monarch" from France and "A Great Pope" will appear during the war and will play a key role in the victory of the West and establishment of subsequent peace. However, these prophecies also indicate that the common assumption of a Christian versus Muslim war scenario might be too simplistic. Even with a grand alliance among the Islamic countries, the Western alliance would not face such a tough challenge unless powerful countries like Russia or China ally with the Islamic nations. Evidently, natural disasters in USA and elsewhere, diseases (natural or due to use of biological weapon), use of nuclear weapons, internal strife in Europe and in the Vatican and particularly the striking of a Comet at the Sea causing tidal waves and millions of deaths will all contribute to the course of the war.

After the war is over, a period of peace will prevail in the world. However, after some time, tribulations will once again arise in the world and in the Vatican and finally the present civilization will come to an end with the event referred to as the "Three Days of Darkness". It is said that after those three days only a quarter of the human population will survive. The prophecies on post World War III events up to the "Three Days of Darkness" will be discussed in a separate article. Michel de Nostredame (1503-1566)

Download e-book Contains the complete prophecies of Nostrada Wouldn't this scare the hell out of you given the trouble with Iraq.

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), January 25, 2003.

Um, Ed? Isn't there something in our religion about not consulting magicians and such or trying to gain supernatural knowledge of the future? I remember reading something about "concealing a desire for control." But nevermind that.

-- Skoobouy (skoobouy@hotmail.com), January 25, 2003.

Dear Skoobuoy, I am not into that stuff, but this piece just caught my eye, and with the tense situation, the world is in right now it seemed appropriate.

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), January 25, 2003.

Ed,

Why not post a few links so that we can verify your accusations? I really don't see why it bothers you though, you don't mind attending a valid but illicit mass, and that seems like what this guy is doing.

Of course if your accusations are true *I* think he should be excommunicated and unfrocked, but then so should all priests who steadfastedly deny the will of the Pope and Magesterium, don't you agree?

Frank

-- Someone (ChimingIn@twocents.cam), January 26, 2003.

Frank, i tried to post the info. but it wouldn't take. This priest is 71 years old, an alcoholic. Does not believe in the Real Presence, junks all the statues, etc etc. The amazing part is that he collects an average of 24 dollear per person , at Mass and they al love him. They object to his salty language at times, but other than that, he's ok. He's good on charity work, however. I think that the poor man has a good and bad side. A jekyl with his love for humanity, and a Hyde celebrating the Mass.

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), January 26, 2003.