I am in the process of a shortfall dispute with the Alliance and Leicester.HDL holdings are trying to collect the debt on thier behalf.I have asked HDL to supply evidence and have issued a SARN.I have recieved letters back stating I am not cooperating and now they have activated suspended interest charges of 8% per annum.Which they have stated will make my account more viable for legal action.Can ayone comment on this.I would be very grateful. David

-- david armitage (karen@island44.fsnet.co.uk), January 17, 2003

Answers

David,

When did you first default on your mortgage?

Mark.

-- M Amos (idgroms@hotmail.com), January 17, 2003.

I don't know if they can do this to you but it sounds as though they are trying to scare you...don't let them.

Your SARN request has obviously upset them....have you SARNED the lender and the debt company? If not, so so now bu recorded delivery.

Repeat your request for any outstanding information.

Do not admit liability, do not talk to them on the phone, do not give them any personal info, as per advice under "do's and don'ts on the site.

Did you have a MIG? Was your house undersold in your opinion. We need this info to help you.

Take your time to read the info on the site and come back and ask anything you are not sure of.

Don't panic.

Hope this helps

M

-- hanging in there! (Anderston828@aol.com), January 17, 2003.

thank you both for replying, My self and my ex wife spilt up in 1992.I left and she stayed there with my young sons.(I thought at the time it was the right thing to do).After 6 months I tried to take my name off the morgage,but found out she had not been paying the morgage.The house was repossessed in may 1993. I wasnt aware that I would have to pay a morgage shortfall at this time. In about 1997 I was contacted by a company who were very threating (cant remember who but evershards does ring a bell).I payed this company £50.00 per month without them supplying any evidence of the unproven debt.However they stopped collecting about 1999 dont know why.Then I was contacted by HDL Holdings in summer of this year,we ignored thier letters which were pretty standard saying to contact them.However I foolishly phoned them (i hadnt seen your site at this point)and agreed to sent them a finanichal statement of means offering to pay them £50.00. They werent satisfied with the info I supplied and wanted more.I saw your site and retracted the offer and SARNED them,but I havent SARNED the lenders,They wont answer any of my questions or provide evidence that the property was marketed properly.They will not say if they are chasing my ex wife for 1/2 of the debt. On thier own admittance they have no records from the prevois debt collecter.I havent admitted this in writing ,this was during the telephone conversaion.I have since found out HDL Holdings are not using thier correct trading address(which I now know and the SARN was sent recoreded to the correct address) Sorry this is an essay,but I wanted to let you know all the facts many thanks Dave A

-- david armitage (karen@island44.fsnet.co.uk), January 18, 2003.

I had a MIG and yes I think the property was undersold. many thanks Daid A

-- david A (karen@island44.fsnet.co.uk), January 18, 2003.

David,

Firstly, do you mean JDL Holdings? Unfortunately, as you have made an offer of repayment this may be construed as an acknowledgement of the alleged debt, which can restart the limitation period afresh from the date of the last acknowledgement. In any further communication make it clear that you deny liability and do not admit the debt. Follow the good advice on the Home Repo site, particularly the 'Do's and Don'ts'. I would also involve your local MP too, tell him/her that they are trying to force a settlement on the alleged debt which they will not properly substantiate (see Mike Hancock's Early Day Motion 62, which you can quote too, this can be found on the repo site under 'repossession', just underneath the mortgage shortfall e- petition). As for the interest charges being reactivated I have serious doubts as to whether that is legal, I'll come back to you on that one. If it is a joint mortgage you would only be liable for 50% of the alleged shortfall. If you have any further questions just post them up. Good Luck.

Mark.

-- M Amos (idgroms@hotmail.com), January 19, 2003.

I thought that each person could be held liable for either the full amount of the shortfall or the balance if the other had part paid. Is there specific rulings which apply only to mortgage shortfalls to allow the 50/50 split?

-- Sue (bradfordandbingley_suck@yahoo.co.uk), January 19, 2003.

Sue/David,

I'll check out the 50% bit and come back to you.

Mark.

-- M Amos (idgroms@hotmail.com), January 19, 2003.

Re:the 50% liability - this is not correct unfortunately . You are jointly and severally liable for the whole amount. Therefore if one party pays X amount in full and final settlement, the other is on the hook for the balance. This is what pisses me off about the whole joint and several thing in terms of collection - an ex partner can pay 200 quid and walk away and leave you in the hole for thousands. Not fair!

-- Too scared to say (iwasduped@yahoo.com), January 19, 2003.

Dave/Sue,

I'm afraid I had duff info before, sorry. 'Too scared to say' is correct, I checked it out with a solicitor and he has confirmed that joint borrowers are joint and severally liable- either can be sued for the full amount. So much for justice!

Mark.

-- M Amos (idgroms@hotmail.com), January 20, 2003.

The same solicitor also told me that part payment by a seperated/ex partner does start time running afresh (limitation period) for that person and all other joint debtors. This is specifically stated in s31 (7) LA '80. I would think that one would have to be careful that a seperated/ex partner doesn't acknowledge the debt in any other way either i.e filling in an I&E form acknowledging a specific sum owed, I can check out this too if you wish.

Mark.

-- M Amos (idgroms@hotmail.com), January 20, 2003.

Re my above message. I asked the solicitor about acknowledgements anyway. He said:

An acknowledgment by a joint debtor only affects the person making it and not any other joint debtors.

A part payment affects and binds all others liable incl guarantors.

Mark.

-- M Amos (idgroms@hotmail.com), January 20, 2003.

Yes that's absolutely right, an acknowledgement by another debtor does not affect the other party, otherwise there'd be blackmailing going on all over the place. My fiance has actually used in a letter to Hammond, Suddards Edge the phrase "I do hope you are not confusing me with my ex-wife who has acknowledged this debt as this would be an extreme breach of the DPA", to date no response to this.

-- Chris (chris@anon.co.uk), January 21, 2003.

thank you all for your help, I have recieved another letter from JDL Holdings today(made a mistake when i said HDL in last message) They have stated that they are working on behalf of the Alliance and Leicester but under rights of subrogation,they said that they are also collecting on behalf of the morgage indemnity insurers.They also attached a copy of the authority from Eagle Star in respect of this. Can anyone shed any light on this,also they said that they persue both parties equally,but in morgage law both parties are joint and severally liable.(which says to me they will go after who ever it is easiest to get money out off) Once again many thanks David

-- david A (karen@island44.fsnet.co.uk), January 22, 2003.

David,

Have you seen my posting of 18th Nov 2002 'On the MIG question' ? I have in fact been trying to post a new message up in relation to this , but their seems to be a problem. If you like I can email it to you.

Mark.

-- M Amos (idgroms@hotmail.com), January 24, 2003.

JDL HOLDINGS LTD 1ST FLOOR JACKPOT HOUSE 340-342 LONDON ROAD HADLEIGH ESSEX SS7 2DD Telephone: 01702 427300 Telefax: 01702 427301 Email: donlewis@fsmail.net Web-site: Services: ABT Areas: NATIONAL Contact: MR DON LEWIS

-- a friend (wickedfluffster@hotmail.com), December 12, 2003.