Roger Fredinburg article (already posted at Freedom, self reliance) : LUSENET : Beyond the Sidewalks : One Thread

For those who aren't familiar with him, Roger Fredinburg is a self proclaimed "radical" (and he's not a radical LIBERAL, that's for certain!) He is a talk radio host, who has been a Bush supporter for as long as I've been a Bush basher.

But even Roger seems to have had enough, at last. Here's a pretty powerful pronouncement by him.

The big question he raises, as I see it, is what do we do now? So far, all I see are people saying "see, I told you he was bad. I told you he was going to steal all our liberties". What to do?


btw, check out the story of the guy who videod the cops beating the young man in El Lay (Inglewood, actually)

"Amateur photographer Mitchell Crooks was arrested outside CNN's Los Angeles bureau where he was scheduled for an interview. Witnesses said he was screaming as he was driven away by plainclothes officers. "

I hate to jump to conclusions, so i won't. I hope the INglewood cops aren't harassing the photographer, in order to get rid of the video tape of the cops beating the young kid (Williams), but that was what the photographer was worried about, and why he wanted to make a copy of the tape before coming into the police dept with an attorney. Which he was unable to do, as he was arrested outside of CNN before he had the chance.


Additional Titles


  By Roger Fredinburg July 7, 2002

For the first time in my life as a public figure, I am afraid to write or say those things most pressing on my mind.

It’s hard to imagine that as an American and a lover of freedom, sitting here in the wake of Independence day, I am actually terrified at some level to put words and thoughts into print for fear of where it might lead.

The Bush administration which I eagerly supported and gladly welcomed as a sign of political refreshment after 8 years of lies and scandals during the Clinton years is now beginning to look more and more like a threat to our nation and all that we believe in.

Homeland Security?

I laugh at the notion that somehow the Bush folks under the Mr. Magoo style of management of Tom Ridge will make me or my fellow Americans safer.

It’s ludicrous in my view to even contemplate putting these bumblers in charge of anything really important after watching them completely blow it.

I sit here now watching the breaking news story at Los Angeles International Airport. It seems one Hesham Mohamad Hadayet determined that Independence day, 4th of July, was a good day to die, and take some innocent bystanders along for the ride.

This blood is on the hands of President George W. Bush and Tom Ridge.

I have been yelling at the top of my lungs on the radio show since September 12, that the 60,000 plus middle eastern men living in this country on expired visa’s should  be rounded up and deported to their home countries. All of those here with “legal” status but not yet citizens should be rounded up and given some specific ultimatums about their staying here. Nobody is listening and I’m afraid many more will die because of this public deafness.

The truth is, Homeland Security is a sick joke. There are no deportations of middle eastern illegals , no protection of any substance along our borders, no ultimatums being made to the Islamic world, just an attack on American liberty and personal freedom here at home.

Eighty year old great grandmothers and sixteen year old cheer leaders are the targets of airport strip searches? Baggage loaded with mock weapons and explosives make it through check in more often than are detected. It’s like the keystone cops on dope!

Regular panic announcements about possible terror attacks often put out to the media by “undisclosed sources” ? Give me a break. Someone please call me when the sky stops falling.

The Bushstapo, A Police State? attempts to lay out the “Bush Plan” in it’s article  “Inside the Bush Plan”. If you want a PC puff piece on the Bushstapo then read it and weep. Here’s the truth. Bush plans to take 22 federal “service” agencies and merge them into a single agency whose motivation will no longer be service but will be “security” instead. Keeping us free from danger and anxiety is a noble cause for a president to tackle. I find it most amusing however that Bush wants so to provide this new giant security force, yet he avoids every legitimate opportunity to make us safer. Securing our borders would be a good start.

We currently have more than 80,000 federal bureaucrats who are armed with guns and police powers.  Forest service, BLM and a variety of folks you wouldn’t normally think of as law enforcement are exactly that. Under the Bush plan the number of armed federal bureaucrats is expected to double and those police powers will not have any reach beyond our own borders, meaning we will be under the scrutiny of what is about to become the worlds largest national police force.

Who Will Be Targeted?

If the new Bushstapo is anything like it’s mock-up at the airports then we can expect that young girls with perky chests and senior citizens in wheelchairs will be the likely candidates for investigation, strip search, surveillance and prosecution for innocuous crimes like conspiracy to wear non EPA approve body lotions or maybe conspiracy and RICO charges for failing to get Big Brother's approval for the Saturday night bingo game down at the church.

Already, across America, government has neighbor turned against neighbor. Callers to my radio program from Missoula, Montana shared the fact that this small all American city offers toll free telephone numbers to turn in your fellow citizens for things like too much smoke coming out of the tailpipe of your car.

We will be turning on each other as the paranoia begins to spread and everyone begins to question their neighbor’s patriotism. I can hardly wait.

As surveillance is enhanced, cameras on every corner, microphones and wire taps in every room, maybe the average Joe will begin to catch on but I wouldn’t hold your breath waiting for that. The truth is that in the very near future everything you say and do will be recorded, analyzed, decoded, scrutinized, and filed away as evidence. People will be afraid to meet for fear of being arrested for engaging in some “conspiracy”. As these new law enforcement bureaucrats start feeding on their ego’s and discover all of that raw power, there will be no stopping them.

Why am I afraid?

I live in a world of ideas. Meaningless, unless openly discussed and useless unless shared with the masses. The problem is that I am what’s called a radical. My opinions and ideas are often more striking, more severe, more intense than those of the typical all American boy type. I make no apologies, I am quite comfortable in my deluded state of mind and have no desire to soften or lessen the thrust of my commentary. Which is why I write this with such trepidation. I am not certain where the boundaries of free speech lie anymore.

Can I advise people to establish a close knit small cell of family and friends with which one should plan and strategize for all sorts of possibilities? Failure in the economy, a total attack on freedom and loss of liberty even possible insurrection. Can we talk about insurrection, rising up against the forces that have taken our country away from its moorings? Or is that hate speech? Conspiracy? I just can’t tell anymore. Is it alright to explore the boundaries of thought regarding the many way’s in which one might restore the people of these United States to their rightful place on the throne ahead of the politicians and bureaucrats? Can I advise for example that I believe a revolt must be more surgical and geared toward eliminating individuals who threaten our republic? That thoughtful and well planned assassinations, I think, would serve the country better than all out civil war? Is giving that opinion going to cause a legal challenge and courtroom test of my First Amendment right to free speech? Or, is it now a form of terrorism to suggest such a thing might someday be required of our people? And heaven forbid, what if I wrote it outright, demanded that Americans rise up and eliminate the obvious threats to our liberty before it’s too late. Surely, as the world's largest national police force is being developed while America is under duress and will soon be evident in every former private place in America, shouldn’t the thought be allowed to flourish on the outside chance that I might just be right?

If I can’t say it can I even think it? With  “hate” crimes laws, and the new PC thought police,  Big Brother has us pinned down. Can’t say it,   can’t think it,  better to put a sock in it for all our sakes,  shut up or else.

Click Your Heals!

A recent caller to my radio show from Saint George, Utah made a compelling story out of his family's day trip to Zion National Park.  Un-suspecting sight seers were met by an Armada of federal buses at the park entrance and driven to and off-loaded at a processing station. There they were charged 10 bucks to enter their own park. After walking through the processing gate they were met by more government operated buses, loaded up and given escorted tours of Zion National Park. Essentially they were put on a leash and dragged around the federally approved fire hydrants by armed federal goons. This outrage alone should have people marching in the streets. But…It doesn’t.

I have noticed recently that many republicans are angry with me for exposing the Bush administration. I am still hopeful that the president will pull his head out of the deep dark crevasse and surprise me, However, I won’t hold my breath. We have lost our property rights, parental rights, speech rights, etc. They are all gone, replaced by political correctness and the thought police,  soon to be everywhere, watching everything. Armed and sworn to keep us all safe from even freedom itself. Yep, I said keep us safe from freedom. You see, the enemy of the new Bushstapo is freedom. The very premise of its design is to limit the dangerous side effects of freedom and to monitor and detect those internal forces that would actually fight and die for freedom.

We saw it with the “War On Drugs”, and this is many times worse. But I don’t envision many standing up until it’s too late. Par for the course in modern America, too little, too late, by to few. Like the Germans in Hitler’s day, people are too afraid that one of Big Brother's agencies will come crashing down on them and rock their selfish little materialistic world. We’ve been conditioned to watch the swat teams wipe out our neighbors without asking why. We gladly accept Big Brother's word that so and so was a bad egg and deserved to be shot down in the driveway for such crimes as failing to pay taxes. We allow the storm troopers to march into our neighborhoods and rip crying children from their mother's arms and ruin families because anonymous phone callers suggest a problem. We sit idly by as every connection to freedom is cut away. We do nothing, say nothing, see nothing, hear nothing. We hide our heads, turn our backs on friends and family. We do this because it makes us feel secure. That’s right, keep your head down, your mouth shut, don’t ask questions, just shut up and pay your taxes. Secure.

This is the new Bushstapo security plan: Stay below the radar, be nothing, do nothing and in return you get secure. Hide there in your shell, but remember that in order to make any move even a turtle has to stick its  neck out. How long can America stay there motionless except for

-- Anonymous, July 12, 2002


Hey Joe, too bad that when King George II had that colonoscopy last week they weren't able to remove his head from his ass, eh? :>

In honor of the FBI being allowed to access anyone's library records, I went to my local library and checked out a copy of "The Turner Diaries". Frankly, I was suprised that the library even had a copy but they did.

I can't decide if I'm over-reacting. I feel like something is horribly wrong but I feel helpless to stop it. Whenever I try to talk about it with my friends they laugh and ask if I'm going to buy a bunch of guns and start a compound at Waco. It's frustrating.

-- Anonymous, July 13, 2002


I just posted this at Freedom and Self REliance, but since you brought up the subject of feeling helpless to stop it, I'm posting it here, as well. I got this letter from my sister just now. I admire the folks, e.g. Chani Geigle, who have the courage to take such actions. In fact, I'm about to send her a query about her organization.


Friends: Below is the news and statement from Chani Geigle, who is/was one of the

staff people at Oregon PeaceWorks in Salem, who was sentenced to 6 months in federal prison for stepping onto the grounds at the School of the Americas (WHISC). After her statement I have attached an article from the day before the sentencing took place. --dan ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 21:32:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Donna S Frazier Subject: Chani's day

Chani was sentenced to 6 months in federal minimum security prison and a

$1,000 fine. Most of the first time offenders, with no previous ban and bars, received 90 days and $500 fine. Second timers, with previous ban and bars, like Chani, got the maximum 6 months plus $1,000 fine. There were a couple of exceptions - 2 first timers got the maximum 6 months. It was a

long and incredible week. I'll send a couple of more messages to wrap it


Chani knew what would probably happen, and she's ready. She'll be home for a month or so and you'll no doubt be hearing from her.

Below is her sentencing statement.

donna ------- I come before you today with a heavy heart. I am really angry that I have been called here today. I am angry I've had to quit my job at a non profit peace and justice group in Salem. I am angry I've had to put my educational plans on hold. I am angry I am having to prepare to leave my

community, my friends and my family.

But that anger is nothing compared to the anger I have over the honest jobs stolen by corrupt corporations, over situations where children do not have school as an option because they have to apply themselves to slave-labor jobs in order to help their families survive, over communities being torn apart, over lands being raped, over family members losing loved ones to the hands of state perpetrated violence. I am enraged at the injustices perpetrated by this country. I am filled with indignation towards the injustice that you and the system you represent are carrying


I will never apologize to you or the United States government or to anyone else for protesting these injustices. But I do have one apology to make. I beg the mothers, fathers, daughters, sons, grandmothers, grandfathers, sisters and brothers of Chiapas, of El Mozote, of Colombia, of Guatemala

and all of Central and South America, to forgive me for my participation

in a system that oppresses, tortures and murders them daily. I ask the God of Life and Truth that sustains those people to forgive me. I beg that they hear my cries of repentence as I hear their cries of "Basta - enough is enough!". I also know that I cannot even ask for forgiveness if I am not willing to change my greedy lifestyle. Not only change my own lifestyle, slowly, day by day, decision by decision, but I must stand up

to that lifestyle of greed and violence if I am truly sorry in my heart for the grief I have helped put in this world. I am determined to spend the rest of my life doing everything in my power to correct my wrongdoings.

That is why I am here. I am not guilty because I protest and resist the School of the Americas and other violent institutions under your authority. Your authority will

crumble and wash away. I have no faith in your authority. My authority comes from the same voice and heart of which I ask forgiveness from. It is those same mothers, fathers, grandmothers, grandfathers, sons, daughters, sisters and brothers that empower me to make my stand. It is God and life itself that says I am not guilty. That love and light and life of me and

my co-defendants and the spirit of those affected by the SOA and other horrible U.S. foreign policies. We have brought that spirit here today and I swear to you, it is a force to be reckoned with. Go ahead, sit in your

throne of injustice and sentence us to probation, prison and fines. But I am warning you now - the people will rise up - the people ARE rising up and we will be stronger than we ever have been before and the laws and systems and vaules of hate and fear that you are grasping onto now WILL FALL. For your own sake, Mr Faircloth, I invite you to join us. Basta - no mas! I invite you to stand up and make your plea.

We must accept finite disappointment, but we must never forget the infinite hope.

Donna Frazier Coordinator Oregon Fellowship of Reconciliation 503-566-7190 P O Box 222 Salem, OR 97308 ----------------- 13 protesters found guilty - 31 await sentencing for trespassing onto Fort Benning BY JIM HOUSTON Staff Writer

U.S. Magistrate G. Mallon Faircloth found 13 SOA Watch protesters guilty

Wednesday of trespassing onto the Fort Benning Military Reservation during the Nov. 18 protests that drew thousands of demonstrators to the post's gates.

The 13 join 18 other protesters awaiting sentencing by Faircloth after pleading guilty or being convicted during the first two days of U.S. District Court proceedings. Each faces up to six months in federal prison and a $5,000 fine.

After finding 10 defendants guilty who had pleaded not guilty, but admitted by stipulation that they crossed onto Fort Benning, Faircloth told the group he was going to invite them to go to the Western Hemisphere Institute for Security Cooperation -- the successor to the School of the

Americas, whose presence on Fort Benning has drawn a growing number of protesters each of the last 12 years.

The School of the Americas was closed more than 18 months ago, but the protesters who allege SOA graduates have carried out atrocities in Mexico, Central and Latin America, told Faircloth that WHISC is a change in name

only. The protesters testified they will not cease their demonstrations until WHISC also is closed.

The judge suggested the invitation as part of a continuing dialogue he has conducted with the protesters as their cases were tried during the last three days. He has repeatedly urged that using the democratic process, rather than committing crimes of civil disobedience, is a more effective way of achieving their goal. Most of the defendants have countered that both tactics have been used and will continue.

During her trial, Chantilly J. Geigle, 19, of Salem, Ore., told Faircloth she has lobbied Oregon's congressmen, cornered countless business and political leaders and even garnered the support of the Salem City Council for efforts to close the Fort Benning school. But the avenue of the democratic process is not the only one she will employ, she said.

"Sometimes we are called to stand up for our country and our family," said Geigle. "I'm going to do that until the SOA -- now called WHISC -- is closed."

Geigle admitted she crossed onto Fort Benning as part of the Nov. 18 demonstration after having been banned from the post for a similar trespass during protests in November 2000.

Geigle was one of three defendants who demanded a trial Wednesday without signing an agreement stipulating that they crossed onto the military reservation. She was the only one, however, who testified.

Niklan Jones-Lezama, 38, of Blacksburg, Va., and Susan Jean Daniels, 41,

of Pembroke, Va., presented no evidence and did not testify, relying on arguments by attorneys Bill Quigley and John Wilson Reed, both of New Orleans, that prosecutors had failed to present sufficient evidence of their guilt.

Faircloth ruled the evidence presented by U.S. Army Capt. Dave Anglin and Assistant U.S. Attorney Dean Daskal -- including a videotape depicting both defendants' crossing onto the post -- was sufficient to support his finding of guilt.

Of the 37 protesters from across the nation who faced trial this week, only one has been acquitted of trespass. Trial of the remaining five, who will represent themselves, begins at 9 a.m. today in the third-floor courtroom of the federal building at 12th Street and Second Avenue.

-- Anonymous, July 14, 2002

I'm reading a book about this very subject, only this one was written a couple of years ago by Gerry Spence, the high profile lawyer who handled Randy Weaver's (Ruby Ridge) case.

In his book titled "From Freedom to Slavery", Spence details how much we Americans have given up our rights in exchange for security. The book gives many examples of this, and how we Americans have become accustomed to slowly allowing our privacy and rights as citizens to be taken away by our government and courts.

And this was all done BEFORE 9/11; I haven't seen a turnaround in policy, even with the exchange of democrat to republican - same game, different person at head of line.

-- Anonymous, July 15, 2002

JR, what does the book recommend that we actually DO, other than spill a bunch of tears about our lost freedoms?

Sherri, I just realized that you correctly diagnosed W's case of optical rectosis! Good job.

To remove said head from said colon, what would the corrective surgery be called? Anal cephalotomy?

-- Anonymous, July 15, 2002

You know what, I don't know what Bush or any other big wig people are up to. But I do know that when I watched Bush after 911 and I saw him try to turn the beautiful American spirit of comradeship around into hate for the terrorists, I just felt like something was wrong. Like he was trying to rouse us up into war. And I did not believe for one minute what he said about the question in my head. At this time I was asking, why do they hate us. Bush said that they hate us because of our freedoms. Blah! That's not it! They hate us because of our big business bullying the rest of the world around. That's why they hate us. And because of the stereotype of an American, what they see on TV. They think that is us.

I think it is all over my head and it is all about big business and who owns what and who has what. I don't think that our government has any thing to do with us ordinary people either, it is way beyond us.

But, how many rights are they planning on taking away from us in the name of security? Sherri like what you said, I don't see too many people around me worrying about this, but I think there are some who are dwelling on this in their minds.


-- Anonymous, July 15, 2002

Tren, in answer to your question, "But, how many rights are they planning on taking away from us in the name of security?", I'd have to say, "All of them"


-- Anonymous, November 30, 2002

Joe, you are so right. The sky is falling and most folks don't wanna look up. I guess we deserve the govt we get, but I feel for the world my kids will have to live in.

Do you visit this site? buzzflash

And to quote a guy from another forum I'm on:

" Everything that this land went thru from the "Red-Coats" to now is basically gone or going. The administration in essence is creating a brand new country. There are no Bill of Rights, Constitutional Right, Civil Rights; they're gone. It is a rule of dictatorship posing as a democracy.

GATHERINGS.COM has a letter from "congress" stating that in fact there are bases developed to hold civilians suspected of anything the guv deems as a threat.

The good ol USA is no more and we've been like blind sheep led to slaughter. BUSH INC. formerly known as THE UNITED STATES of AMERICA."

And is it even believable that BUSHCO has chosen KISSINGER to head the "investigation" of 9/11 ??!! What a sick joke!!

-- Anonymous, December 01, 2002

Bush, Cheney, Poindexter, Kissinger, Trashcroft, and Rumsfield. What a group....

We're in for a very rough ride for a while. Have a nice vaccination!


-- Anonymous, December 02, 2002

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