[via email - your mileage may vary]

A LETTER TO THE PALESTINIANS FROM NEW ZEALAND

This letter was part of Moshe's weekly posting called "Jerusalem Insights." It is an outstanding piece of writing from a man in New Zealand who claims to be an agnostic. I could only hope that every Jew and every Christian throughout the world understood the issue as well as he does! PLEASE - read it - print it out - keep it for future reference - forward it to everyone you know!

An Open Letter to the Palestinians from an Agnostic Date: Sun, 26 May 2002 18:03:29 -0700 > Speaking Truth to the Powerless: An Open Letter To The People Commonly Called "Palestinians".

Greetings to any Palestinian who may be reading this. My name is David White. I am a citizen of New Zealand, a small, Western, nominally Christian country in the South Pacific Ocean. I am not Jewish, or Christian, I guess I'm vaguely agnostic.

Writing this letter is a good way for me to discuss the horrible mess in the Middle East, spell out as many relevant points as possible concerning the state of the Palestinian people, and to see what can be made of them I don't speak Arabic, so I can only communicate with English-speaking Palestinians. There aren't many here in NZ, though, and I haven't yet met any. I don't know how many will ever see these words, but, here's hoping someone does.

I have a post-graduate university education, and I suppose I could be called an intellectual. Unfortunately, many such people have supported abhorrent ideologies such as Nazism, and continue to support Communism, so I refuse to describe myself in this way. I don't want to [be] considered as just another "trendy leftie" academic, as we would say in NZ. So, unlike many university-educated types, I am anti-totalitarian, pro-peace up to a point, pro-democracy, pro-capitalism (except the capitalists running Enron), and skeptical about the "cult of victimhood." I'm quite safe here in New Zealand, and no one I know has been killed by a Palestinian.

My perspective of Palestinians is something like this - you're Arabs (of course), mostly Muslim, but with a Christian minority. Many of you live outside Gaza/West Bank, mostly in Jordan and other Muslim countries, with some groups living in Western countries as well. You feel that you have been wronged by Israel and are fighting to destroy them.

As for my perspective on Israel, I see them like this. They are a mainly Jewish, small, free-market democracy with a large Arab minority surrounded by hostile Arab dictatorships. They have an ancestral claim to Israel, their state was created as a refuge from persecution, they have a right to exist, and, having survived a holocaust in Europe, they should not have to sit still and wait for another one in the Middle East.

A Down Under Overview.

Over the last few months, the conflict in the disputed territories of Gaza and the West Bank has turned into a war between the Palestinian people and Israel. (I will not apologize for using the term "disputed", as I believe it reflects a rather complicated situation more accurately than "occupied").

Your interpretation, as far as I can tell, seems to be something like this: You have no state of your own, and you are fighting a war against those you call "Zionist oppressors" and "colonial imperialists", in order to create a Palestinian state. Accusations of massacre and human rights violations by the Israeli Army are being tossed around like confetti. Your leader, Yassir Arafat, vows to "martyr" himself rather than "surrender", and that bungling and incompetent organization, the United Nations (again, no apologies for venting personal opinions), is trying to do what it is constitutionally incapable of doing, i.e. "saving future generations from the scourge of war".

The Israelis see things differently, of course. For them, it's a simple battle for survival. They offered you a state, and you attacked them instead. They have occupied Palestinian towns, have fought it out with various armed groups, and desperate attempts are being made by the US, other Arab countries and the UN to break the so-called "cycle of violence". As a result, the Palestinian situation at the moment generally, can be explained by putting it into New Zealand idiom.

Put bluntly, the Palestinian people are buggered. Munted. Stuffed. Rooted. (American equivalent=screwed. British equivalent: done over). It's like this: Yassir Arafat turned down the Israeli offer of a Palestinian homeland in Gaza and the West Bank. You want, or Arafat claims that you want, a Palestine "from the river to the sea," in other words, "all or nothing".

There is one insuperable obstacle to this- Israel. No matter how eloquent your arguments or numerous your martyrs, no matter how many European diplomats are angered by, or UN resolutions are passed against, Israel, the Israelis are not going to pack up and leave. The only way you will get the Palestinian state you want is to destroy Israel.

This is what you have been trying to do since 1948, and the current "intifada" launched in 2000 is your latest effort. However, the Israelis are not standing there and letting you kill them. They are fighting back, and if they have to choose between their own survival and yours, guess which choice they'll make.

A Vast Wringing Of Hands, A Great Fluttering Of Diplomats.

That has been the overall response to the disaster you have created for yourselves. You, the Palestinian Arabs, are obviously hoping for some kind of international intervention to save you. As we in New Zealand would say, "Get Real!"

The European Union and the UN have demonstrated on numerous occasions in the past their incompetence and total incapacity to take any sort of firm action without American leadership. Ask your Muslim brothers of Bosnia-Herzegovina, about how effective the EU and the UN were in protecting them without American intervention. In spite of the impression that American diplomatic efforts have created, the US will not take sides against Israel, and will eventually abandon its futile attempts at evenhandedness. If they do join forces militarily with Israel in their war against terrorism, your fighters will be snuffed out like candle flames.

As for your "beloved Arab brothers" in the Middle East, they make a great deal of noise about your "liberation struggle", and have sent money and arms, but have not sent a single tank to save you. Their diplomatic proposals are ones that could have been offered at any time, and are aimed at benefiting them, not Palestinians. The Egyptians themselves will not declare war on Israel unless they receive $100 billion to cover their costs.

Do you really believe that the rest of your Arab Muslim brothers think you are worth that much? Do you really believe they will put your interests ahead of their own? Although your friends and Arabs in Europe are passing sanctions and burning synagogues in your support, not a single EU warship has sailed to your aid, and not a single NATO aircraft has dropped a single bomb on your "Zionist oppressors".

I have noted that large numbers of people, including university-educated intellectuals support the Palestinian cause. Don't be misled by this. No matter how many western intellectuals, news media and international organizations may support the Palestinian struggle, none of this matters because America stands by Israel.

The Unbearable Burden of Life. How did you get into such a mess? As you yourselves would say and have indeed said on many occasions, it isn't your fault. It's always the "Great Satan" America, and it's "Lesser Satan", Israel, that you blame for all your woes. Everything that you do, such as your "martyrdom operations", are described as the products of your "rage" at being "dispossessed of your land", and of your "helplessness" in the face of "Zionist" might.

There are only 300 million Arabs against over 5 million Jews! How unfair! How unjust, that so many can do so little against so few!

A number of Western commentators have put Arab failures down to numerous cultural factors, not the least being Islam. Your religious beliefs in martyrdom and jihad, coupled with a total inability to accept any blame for your own predicament, have combined to do you great and lasting damage.

Look closely at why Western countries such as Israel have succeeded, and Muslim countries have not. Western countries are free-market democracies. Muslim countries (other than Turkey) aren't. Surely that should tell you something.

Why I Stand.

As I said, I do not, and I will not, support the Palestinian cause. Why not? I have a number of reasons, and here they are:

1. You have made it clear beyond any shadow of doubt that you intend to destroy Israel and kill or drive out its Jewish population. This is genocide, pure and simple. You justify this by saying that Israel has committed many crimes against your people, and that you seek "justice". I say this in response- NOTHING WHATSOEVER is an acceptable justification for genocide. Loss of land, humiliation at being militarily defeated - others have suffered these and moved on to create new nations and opportunities for themselves.

Examples abound- the Germans thrown out of East Prussia in Europe, 1945, the Nationalist Chinese who fled to Taiwan in 1949, to name but two. Germans and Taiwanese have coped with military defeat and the loss of land. They haven't warred with their neighbours, nor have they launched terrorist attacks upon them. Both countries have more wealth than any Arab nation. Why can't Palestinians cope? Are Germans and Chinese better able to deal with adversity than Arabs?

2. You have accused the Israelis of "genocide" against you. Here's a question for you: Israel has atomic bombs and powerful military forces. If they really, truly wanted you all dead, they could easily do it. Why haven't they? If the Israelis went all-out, you would be, as we say in New Zealand, "dog tucker". Why did they spend so much time negotiating with your leaders? Because Israel wants peace and secure borders. You refuse to give them even those. You plan genocide and accuse Israel of the same crime. Prove it!

3. The use of terrorism. Killing people for being Jewish is despicable. Terrorist attacks on innocent civilians are also despicable. (At this point, I'd like to pause and get a question of nomenclature cleared up, regarding those Palestinians who kill themselves and others with explosives strapped to their bodies. You call them "martyrs". Western media sources and academics debate the precise term to use in describing them. Others, including the Israelis, call them terrorists.

I have a better, more appropriate term. I prefer to use the word "kamikazes". The original kamikazes appeared in 1944, in the war in the Pacific. They were Japanese Navy and Army pilots, organised into "Special Attack Units" with orders to crash their planes into American warships, in the hope of destroying them - "one plane, one ship". Their initial impact was similar to that of the Al-Quaeda attacks on New York and the Pentagon - shock and horror. (I noted that many Palestinians appeared on Western TV celebrating the September attacks). Note: The American response, in both cases was not the one hoped for.

Once the shock had worn off, the US set out to destroy the kamikazes, and terrible destruction was rained down on Japan, ending only with 2 atomic bombs. You know what is happening right now in Afghanistan to the Al-Quaeda group).

4. Using children as suicide bombers. Anyone who teaches children to kill themselves in suicide attacks is not worth supporting under any circumstances. For you to do this to your children is an abomination. A commentator on a Web magazine said that if the Palestinians laid down their arms, they would get peace and land. If the Israelis laid down their arms, they would be killed. You know that is true, even if most of Europe doesn't. Your cause is evil, because it seeks destruction at any price. Genocide is not justice. Sacrificing your own children for the sake of your leader's personal ambitions is wicked.

That's why I cannot support you. That's why I stand with Israel.

Palestinian Past or Future?

The Second World War in Europe ended with Hitler's suicide. He was replaced by Admiral Doenitz who quickly made peace with the Allies. Japan's leader, Emperor Hirohito, decided on surrender rather than see his nation destroyed.

If Arafat chooses surrender, though, will the rest of the Palestinians go along with it? If he dies, will the war end? If the answer to both of these questions is No, then the Palestinian people are doomed. Do you really prefer death as a people? Do you fully comprehend what you are doing? If you are indeed aware that the path you have embarked on leads to destruction, and if you have freely chosen to walk in that direction, then as a people you are truly beyond hope.

Are Palestinians really going to be a "Kamikaze Nation"? Are you really going to give Israel no other option except your destruction? If they must choose, then as Israeli historian Martin Van Creveld said, "better a terrible end than terror without end".

Do not think that kamikaze tactics can get you what you want. The Israelis can tell you all about Masada, if you ask them. Remember what happened to the Japanese at places like Okinawa and Iwo Jima. Palestinians deserve better than the current mess you are in now - but before you can be given anything, you must offer a sincere peace, you must stop teaching your children to hate, you must stop believing that "victimhood" justifies everything and - above all other things - GIVE UP ISRAEL! Accept that you will never go there again except perhaps as workers or tourists. Accept that Jews are human beings. Accept the verdict of 1948 and learn to live with it.

Invest in banks, not bombs. Build computer chips, not Kalashnikovs. Teach science and mathematics, not hate. Look to the future, not the past. Stop blaming Americans and Jews for all your problems, and take responsibility for your own actions. Read those parts in the Quran about living with the "peoples of the Book".

Golda Meir, the former Israeli Prime minister, is quoted as saying " There will be peace in the Middle East only when the Arabs love their children more than they hate Israel ". Every time I see pictures of Palestinian children waving guns and wearing dummy explosives, then I can only say she is right. The alternative to peace is not victory but death.

Think about it- before it's too late.

From an Infidel to Those Who Submit, and are living in the Holy Land - May God grant you steadfastness in the face of things that cannot be changed, the capacity to cope with those that can be changed, and the wisdom and the ability to tell the difference.

David White Auckland, New Zealand

-- Anonymous, July 08, 2002

Answers

Unfortunately, the people who need to read this won't do it . . .

-- Anonymous, July 08, 2002

A letter to an uninformed man in New Zealand:

Dear sir,

The property owner to the north is a descendant of people who used to own many hundreds of acres in this valley. Over the years, the present owner's antecedants sold the land off in bits and pieces.

We currently occupy a small piece of that orginal parcel of land. The current owner tried to buy our entire piece. We refused. He attempted to buy 1/3 of our piece. We refused. He sent in bulldozer and smashed everything to rubble on an amount of ground equivalent to 1/5 of our piece. He actually gave orders to smash quite a bit more than that.

I have stopped bulldozers on three occasions so far. If I hadn't stopped them, my very house may have been bulldozed as far as I know. I do know that my fences, my trees, my rocks, my ground would have been scraped off into a ravine in a tumbled heap whether I wanted it this way or not.

There is a strong possibility that he will attempt to gain a large percentage of our ground in court. The survey will not be completed until later this week, so we don't even know what our boundaries are. We don't know where to draw the line to fight over as of this writing.

His claim is that his people once owned this land. But his people took it from our people before that, even though our people had a paper from the government that said they owned it. Our people took it from the people who were here before, people who did not have a piece of paper from the government saying they could keep it.

So who owns it morally?

If you can answer it without thinking first, then don't throw stones at others who also answer without thinking first. They may only differ with you on the answer.

Sincerely,

helen

-- Anonymous, July 08, 2002

Gawd, Helen, you're not thinking of strapping explosives on the neighborhood teens and sending them to the beer joint where his relatives hang out, are you? Nah, 'course not. :)

-- Anonymous, July 08, 2002

But, the israelites own the land fair and square. We know this because it says in the bible that they slaughtered everyone who was living on it at the time they moved in and claimed it, right?

Say, that sounds familiar...

-- Anonymous, July 09, 2002

helen, as far as your situation, I'm not so sure that over a long period of time (many generations) morality has much to do with it. We all have our individual opportunities. Fortunately, perhaps, serious land issues in this country are more recent (a few hundred years) than abroad. I think it is as relatively fair as anything to let the law straighten it out.

I also think I can't comprehend the turnovers that have taken place in the old world over the centuries. It just seems a law of nature that there will be change and that there will be fortunates and not so fortunates. I know that when my mother tried to donate my childhood geography books to the local children's library they were refused because there had been too much change. Seems like there needs to come a point in time when a line can be drawn and honored. Seems to like like the epitome (for better or worse) of a NWO. Of course, some of those lines make little sense culturally and will never be stable.

As far as the middle east, the question I have never seen answered is the extent to which Britain had say over the disposition of "British Palestine". I don't see that the Israelis took "palestine" from the Palestinians; I think Britain gave it to the new Israelis. Britain also gave most of that territory to what is now Jordan, so I have thought of Jordan as being the real Palestine.

One of the more watershed articles I have read, if accurate, was one that GodSheep posted a few weeks back. It explained that the King of Jordan (I don't recall how recently) offered to square things with Arafat but agreeing to make him prime minister, or something like that. Arafat turned it down. Made me realize (again, if accurate), that there is no settlement that Arafat would ever accept. Plus, I'm thinking seriously progressive Parkinson's dimentia on his part, which would mean he is less and less physically or mentally or emotionally capable of resolving anything.

Regardless of whether the Palestinians have rights in Israel, their leadership and that of the other Middle East countries really has screwed them.

-- Anonymous, July 09, 2002

Re Arafat and Parkinson's. Just think of him as Janet Reno on acid.

-- Anonymous, July 09, 2002

BrookS, I think if you search on Balfour Agreement, you might find some pertinent info. Winston Churchill had a bit of a hand in that too.

-- Anonymous, July 09, 2002

Reno on Acid! LOL!! Someone said on of the wrestlers was Janet Reno on steroids. Wish I could remember which one.

-- Anonymous, July 09, 2002

Git, yes I know about the Balfour Declaration. I'm just not clear the extent to which Britian had that level of say so in British Palestine. I have assumed it was theirs to hand out, which means the Palestinians are SOL, as least as of the original boundaries.

-- Anonymous, July 09, 2002

there is no settlement that Arafat would ever accept

Sure there is! Absolute ruler of the world.

-- Anonymous, July 09, 2002

BrookS, from what I understand we got the area after World War I, "the spoils of war." Also, see this bit I plucked from a Jewish- Zionist site. There's lots more, nicely organized here.

Mandate

Part of a system created by the League of Nations whereby, "peoples not yet able to stand by themselves," would be administered by "advanced nations." In time, these nations -- principally the Allied Powers -- would transfer authority to the local population. In the history of Palestine/Eretz Yisrael, the Mandate refers to the period 1920-1948, with its borders excluding Transjordan from 1922 onwards.

That Britain would be the power most likely -- and most motivated -- to control the territory of Eretz Yisrael after the Ottoman Empire had been clear to Herzl, Weizmann and others since 1902. However, the transfer of control was to take place as the result of the First World War, from which Britain emerged victorious.

The period began with good will, but moved towards a bitter end, following the escalation of Arab opposition and the the Zionist movement 's increased frustration at being unable to fulfil its purpose of saving European Jewry from annihilation in the Shoah. The process was expressed in the various external documents, Royal Commissions of Inquiry and White Papers brought below.

-- Anonymous, July 09, 2002

Fixed yer link so you won't have to creak around back and do it. LOL

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2002

Merci, mon petit chouxfleur.

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2002

Thanks, Git, good site but stop calling Barefoot names!

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2002

chouxfleur does not translate. Must be spelled wrong.

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2002

She called you a cauliflower. I'd whack her with one if I were you.

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2002

oops! No D in chouxfleur. Yes, it's cauliflower and it's a term of endearment in France, mon petit lapin. You should be worried if I call you a vieux chameau. That's a REALLY serious insult. Of course, if someone could find me a working notebook monitor, I might be able to see the screen at the proper distance rather than too far away for my poor old eyes. . .

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2002

"No D in chouxfleur".

Hope she isn't hanging the wallpaper upsidedown...

-- Anonymous, July 11, 2002

I hope she doesn't sand the tub by mistake...

-- Anonymous, July 11, 2002

You know, that's not a bad idea, BF. About a week ago I soaked in some new bath salts, not realizing how potent they were. When I was through with my soak I found I couldn't get out of the damn tub--it was too slippery. There are sliding glass doors and I just didn't trust the towel rails on them or the wall to hold my vast bulk so I was wondering what the hell to do. My knee was in very bad shape then so I didn't want to roll over and get up from a kneeling position. I thought I might let the water out, wait until it was dry and then get out but thought that would take too damn long. So I rolled over anyway and crawled up the back wall, kinda thing--ouch! I'm having crash bars installed the next place we buy.

Yeah, you can laugh, but y'all are headed down this same slippery slope. So to speak. Old age ain't for sissies.

-- Anonymous, July 11, 2002

"crash bars"? Is that like grab bars?

If you could determine that the towel rails were actually set into wall studs, then you might be ok. I think one of the reasons to install grab bars is to correct that. (Or maybe the towel rail itself is also too flimsy.)

There were various items I was told to install for my Dad at the end. One was grab rails. (A vertical which lets you get in and out more safely, and one set low at an angle to help you raise your carcass.) Someone lent me a shower seat which can be set at variable heights and used in conjunction with the side angled rail. The third part of the equation was a shower wand, for which I had two mounting brackets set - one for if I was standing up (which would have drowned Dad on the shower seat) and a second lower one with the height of the shower seat in mind.

Since I (now) live by myself, I'm generally glad that the rails are in place. Haven't trained the kitties yet to dial 911 for me if I fall in the tub.

-- Anonymous, July 11, 2002

I'm still in my 40s, but I have a shower spray and grab bars. These aren't bad items for anyone to have: you never know when you are going to injure yourself and need some assistance.

-- Anonymous, July 11, 2002

Yep, I like to call'em crash bars, though, because that's what happens if you DON'T grab 'em. The towel bars are set into the tile and probably wouldn't hold any weight over 80 lbs or so. It's the bars needed for actual bathing that I need--can't move in the mornings unless I soak them knees. But they can wait for the next house. I know you can buy those that clamp on the side of the tub but the sliding doors get in the way. But definitely near the top of the list for the next house.

-- Anonymous, July 11, 2002

In the meantime, keep that cordless phone / cellphone within reach.

You might even consider tying it to something like a towel bar just in case your hand is slippery and it squirts outta yer hand like a bar of soap.

[note: make sure that the string is short enough to stop the phone from falling into the toilet water.]

-- Anonymous, July 12, 2002

Tee hee. I DO keep the cordless on the floor by the tub, along with my scanner. I've learned that if a chain-reaction wreck with multiple loss of life and possible release of toxic chemicals from an involved tanker truck occurs, I'll be in the tub. Lately, I've learned that something will happen when I'm at the point where I'm matching seams on wallpaper. So far, the tally is two separate gunshot wounds and a VERY suspicious fire of an old tobacco warehouse.

P.S. Is this a good example of thread drift?

P.P.S. The wallpapering is finished.

-- Anonymous, July 12, 2002

P.P.S. The discontinued Alexander Julian wallpaper I bought from Big Lots for about $2.99/roll for Jim's bathroom went up like the textbook says, very easy job.

-- Anonymous, July 12, 2002

"P.P.S. The wallpapering is finished."

I KNOW that, question is, is it upsidedown? (And I want an independent opinion on that...)

-- Anonymous, July 12, 2002

Independent opinion - 'Opine on one subject at a time.'

Second opinion - 'Opine on another subject.'

-- Anonymous, July 12, 2002

It is only upside down if you spend a lot of time with your feet in the air. Hmm. I do that a lot. Okay, only if you stand on your head. By the way, how does one "stand" on one's head if one isn't using a leg to stand on?

-- Anonymous, July 12, 2002

LOL! This thread gets better every time I click on it.

-- Anonymous, July 12, 2002

Git, I think it works with one of those kitty anti-gravity devices.

-- Anonymous, July 14, 2002

I painted my drawers glossy white today and the chrome knobs look great.

-- Anonymous, July 14, 2002

So now this thread has lowered itself to T and A?

Really, Git, telling us about your drawers, and then your knobs! sounds like a new halloween costume.

btw, aren't they referred to as knockers and not knobs?

-- Anonymous, July 14, 2002

Only other names I know for them are "pulls" and "hardware."

-- Anonymous, July 14, 2002

Hmmm, perhaps I was thinking of knickers.

Not yours, silly!

-- Anonymous, July 15, 2002

Did you know that in Britain the retort "knickers!" is a sort of mild but slangy equivalent of "bugger off!"?

-- Anonymous, July 15, 2002