Having never used this type of setup, can anyone tell me if a screw mount lens mounted on an M body would not focus to infinity? In other words, doesn't the thickness of the adaptor flange change the lens to film distance and so create a slight magnification?

Thanks everyone.

-- jeff (debontekou@yahoo.com), June 04, 2002

Answers

leica cunningly incorporated the add'l FFD into the M cameras to permit LTM lenses to be used thereon with proper infinity focus.

-- roger michel (michel@tcn.org), June 04, 2002.

let me try to translate my earlier post: if you measure the film to flange distance on an M camera and a barnack, you will discover that the m camera's FFD is slitely smaller -- by an amount exactly equal to the adpter ring thickness (or its putative thickness anyway). thus a LTM lens with an adpter fitted will work purrfectly on an M. however, were it possible to do so, a bayonet lens could not be used on a barnack (without shaving it or the camera down), because the bayo lens mounts are set up to incorporate the necessary add'l FFD (it's as if they are altready wearing an adapter -- leica didn't want to redesign its optics).

-- roger michel (michel@tcn.org), June 04, 2002.

Roger, thank you. I would like to get a pre-war uncoated Elmar one of these days, however I just came into possession of an Industar 22, Elmar copy and I cannot make it focus to infinity. I have read that quality control on these lenses can be serindipitous. Do you think maybe mine is just poorly made? Or do all of the Industars have this limitation?

-- jeff (debontekou@yahoo.com), June 04, 2002.

I have one of the Industrar 22 collapsible Elmar copies I bought with a Zorki C. It will not focus on my Leica IIIa, IIIf, or Canon VI T. Nor will any of my other LTM lenses work on the Zorki. The lens seems to focus fine on the Zorki but, after wasting money on a CLA to repair the Zorki body i found that this particular Industrar is truly HORRIBLE. Interestingly I have a later FED Industrar 61 that fits on all my LTM cameras (except the Zorki) and is quite good.

-- Robert Marvin (marvbej@earthlink.net), June 04, 2002.

Welcome to the wacky world of Soviet quality control. There's no predicting what will fit what, IME. Some lenses are great, some are dogs. I know of a guy who was buying 50/2 lenses in Leningrad by the pound a couple of years ago.

-- Skip Williams (skipwilliams@pobox.com), June 04, 2002.

Thanks again everyone. Skip, that's a funny story, sad but true I'm sure. I don't think I'll take another $20 chance on an Industar. I'll just wait and buy a real Elmar.

-- jeff (debontekou@yahoo.com), June 04, 2002.

almost as funny as the jupiter lens that should have fit fine on my mint s3, but instead just tore up the flange. ever seen what a 12 guage deer slug can do to even the most sturdily built optic??

-- roger michel (michel@tcn.org), June 04, 2002.

None of the Jupiter lenses I tried focused spot on with the Leica. I was able to make my 50nmm f1.5 focus correctly by sticking a piece of alluminum duct tape on the back of the cam as a shim.

By the way, my Jupiter 3 is actually a decent performer now that I adjusted the focus slightly. It is actually useable at f1.5, though offering less contrast than the Contax Sonnar is tried to mimic. I tried two different 90's that were all total crap-unbelievably bad, couldn't render a sharp image of anything and felt horrible on the focus. Must have been tampered with by someone with zero knowledge of optics.

If anyone is interested in a few Kiev Contax clones and lenses for basically just the shipping costs, let me know. The cameras sort of function properly and are nice looking. I think I have two bodies with lenses and cases, and also a really nice 35mm f2.8 Biogon clone.

-- Andrew Schank (aschank@flash.net), June 04, 2002.

As I understood my friend who collects, fixes, and shoots russian cameras, the quality of russian cameras is spotty due to the factory's production philosopy - the need to meet production quotas during the 50s. Hence the cameras produced did not conform to a standard spec. Lenses of cameras produced in this period can not be easily interchanged since the resulting specs of each body/lens combination are unique.

Quality control in the factories improved a bit in the succeding generation of cameras produced. Thus you would be able to interchange lenses and bodies produced in the latter 60s.

Jeff - To use the Industar 22/elmar copy with your Leica III body would require ensuring that the lens register is similar to the leica specs. Unless you know how to do this yourself, or have a friend who is generous with his time to fix this, it is not worth the money spent on the lens. I would just use the I/22 with the body that came with it.

Roger - I know the feeling. Almost did it to my SP. I understand that the contax mount is different from the nikon mount as far as focal length of 50 and up is concerned. I tried the biogon copy and it fitted my SP (maybe I was lucky).

Andrew - Did you try it with a lens shade? I found the russian LTM lenses to be more flare prone vs. german or jap lenses.

IMHO, russian cameras are nice toys. Below is a picture I took of a friend's wedding using the I/22 elmar copy on the Fed 2. This is a scan from a 1 hour lab print.

My 0.02. :)

-- Arnell Umali (atumali@myrealbox.com), June 05, 2002.

Didn't work. I guess I just have to make a clickable link. CLICK HERE

-- Arnell Umali (atumali@myrealbox.com), June 05, 2002.

Russian stuff is all over the place in Quality...................I tested all my 50mm eight ScrewMount lenses wide open to F4..............I printed all the photos out only leaving an A B C D as a lens code,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,The best one choosen was the 1000 dollar 50mm F2 Summicron in Chrome screw mount,,,the second best was my 50mm F3.5 @f3.5 Industar-50 Rigid that cost 45 dollars for the lens and Zorki-6 body. I need to redo a better test to show my data...

-- Kelly Flanigan (zorki3c@netscape.net), June 05, 2002.