I found an old screw mount camera and played with it when buying chemicals. Why are the prices of some screw cameras so high? Why would anyone still use them with the short focus mechanism and two window operation, and old lenses/with exception, of course ($$$).

Is it part of being nostalgic, trying to imitate HCB...?

They are far from pocketable (as a point-and-shoot), the weight being too high.

My boyfriend respects my M3 but cannot understand the prices of the screw cameras...too slow. Must be the demographics he says.

-- Allison Reese (a_b_reese3@hotmail.com), May 29, 2002

Answers

1. Because they are fun 2. Because they are different (related to #1) 3. Because sometimes it is the journey and not the destination that matters (related to #2 & #1)

I have one available for borrowing, and it is great fun. Sure, it is old, slow, and the lens sucks in modern terms, but there is a certain joy in using it. The pictures seem so much alive, and who cares that it is only because of what I feel in my heart, nobody is buying them anyway...

-- Nick (nicholas_rab@hotmail.com), May 29, 2002.

i own a number of cameras (including a number of leica m cameras) and, for pleasure shooting, use my iiig more than anything else (with my brooks veriwide coming in second). i like the camera because (a) it has a very high VF mag making focusing very quick, (b) it is much smaller than an m, (c) there are so many lenses to fit it, including the voigts and current 35 and 50 (cron and lux) from leica, (d) it is very quiet, (e) the VF is uncluttered, (f) it has a very nice range of slow speeds as compared to an m and i use the slow speeds a lot, (g) i am able to "get away" with using a classic camera in situations where i mite get yelled at if i had a modern camera (e.g. strangers are much more apt to let me take their portrait with the iiig than with an f100), (h) the iiig, like the m3 to a somewhat lesser degree, exudes a quality of craftsmanship and finish that few if any other mechanical devices possess, and (i) i like the way it slows me down -- i think about the shots more. a mint iiig for $1500 is really a bargain. if a company tried to build one today to the same quality level it would, like the nikon s3 reissue, cost many thousands of dollars.

-- roger michel (michel@tcn.org), May 29, 2002.

most of on this forum have additional cameras of other makes. the old screw mounts are about as far from from todays modern auto everything cameras as you can get. there is a certain appeal to knowing you can still get a great picture from a camera that is over 50 years old. it forces you to stop and think. it also represents a different time when cameras were hand assembled.

tell your boyfriend, that if he thinks screw mount cameras are expensive try pricing mint 65 mustang convertables or 68 chevrolet camero z28's. ask him which he would rather spend the summer driving the new model or the classic.

this is not just limited to cameras and cars, many other items also have a similar relaitionship, due in some part to nostalgia and in some part to skills long since lost in these days of time constraints. old wood working is one example. in my case, my grandmothers wedding dress is another item that I doubt could be duplicated today.

-- greg mason (gmason1661@aol.com), May 29, 2002.

Leica re-released some brand new Leica screw mount lenses about 2? years ago...The new Leitz #11619 50mmm F2 Summicron was hawked by Heliar on Ebay; as well as a new 35mm Summicron..These were produced I believe for the Japanese market..All the ones I have seen are chrome; well built but real heavy..The 50mm is darn sharp wide open; and is the same lens/optics as the latest Leica M 50mm F2.; but with a M39 LTM (mount)....

The screw mount cameras are smaller than the M series

Many of the Leica screw bodies have a diopter control; this is cool if ones eyes vary when tired!

The last screw Leica IIIg has a great viewfinder; but the collectors seem to be grabbing them all.......

There are worlds of aftermarket lenses made by Nikon, Canon, Sears!/Tower, Steinheil,Carl Zeiss,Angenieux,Pentax (recently),Voigtlander,Wollensak,Cooke,Taylor,Minolta,Schneider- Kreuznach,Zuiho Optical, FED in the Ukraine; a company in Wetzlar......................................... Leitz!; plus all the Jupiter, Industar, & Orion series cranked out by all the many Russian factories...Many Russian clones are of the leica optics; which are dirt cheap; some actually are good to great....One must have a spirt of adventure when using these; and do alot of testing..Some are absolute crap.......Quality control is all over the map; that is why there are Russian optics lovers and haters...Most all the Russian lenses are super light; because of the all aluminum mounts..But they are not as robust.....The optical designs are mostly of old old lens designs....They have a nice dreamy out of focus which is cool for people shots...etc...

There are more Russian "Leica" screw mount cameras in existance than all the Leicas ever made.....I have only about 7 of them......They are LOUD ; basic and have NO roller cam; but instead a cam arm....Most all Russian lenses can be mounted on Leica screw mount bodies; but alot of the Leica lenses will not fit..The lens cam surface must be a cylinder; so that the Russian cam doesnt get hung up....Most all the 50mm Leica screw lenses will work....

The Leica screw mount cameras rangefinder has magnification; approx 1.5X? this makes the effective rangefinder baseline better than the Bessa R series....Kelly

-- Kelly Flanigan (zorki3c@netscape.net), May 29, 2002.

Allison, I still have the 2 LTM bodies and 5 LTM lenses I inherited from an elderly friend of the family when I was 13. I had the bodies CLA'd and a new shutter put in one of them about 4 years ago, and I take them out of the display case and work the shutter at all speeds once every other month. I have not had a roll of film through them since the one I used to check them after the CLA. For me at least, it is indeed nostalgia that keeps me from selling them. But as far as functionality, as Yogi Berra said: "nostalgia ain't what it used to be."

-- Jay (infinitydt@aol.com), May 29, 2002.

Allison, Sometimes there are unexpected rewards in using things that are not new and slick and popular crowd-pleasers!

-- Art Waldschmidt (afwaldschmidt@yahoo.com), May 29, 2002.

Allison as you get older you appreciate older things. (hope the wifeb feels the same way;-))

-- Andy Wagner (awagner@midwest-express.com), May 29, 2002.

Instead of making the "O" Series, Leica should have reintroduced the IIIG with bayonet mount.

-- Frank Horn (owlhoot45@hotmail.com), May 29, 2002.

Allison,

When I first started using RF cameras about 18 yrs. ago LSM cameras (except Leicas) were cheap. No one wanted them. Now they are all the rage. The 15000 yen Canon P is now 35 to 50 thousand yen. In 1987 I got an M4 (slightly dented) for US$400. I am truly hoping that Voigtlander will put enough modern equipment on the market to bring down some of those prices for user collectors.

Me--I prefer the new stuff now that it is available.

Best,

-- Alex Shishin (shishin@suma.kobe-wu.ac.jp), May 30, 2002.

For fun, Allison, for fun! Don't you and your boyfriend ever do anything for fun? BTW, what does he mean by "the demographics"? Why does he respect the M3 but not LTM cameras? LTMs are quite useable too, for those with patience, but whether it's worthwhile or not depends entirely upon your own interests and priorities.

I agree, the LTM cameras are a bit heavy for pocketability. I can't imagine carrying 1/2 kilogram of camera plus the weight of a lens in my shirt pocket, like some people claim to do, but it is quite small with a collapsible lens.

For the era in which the Barnack camera was first designed, it was a miracle of miniaturization. Don't forget, it takes a full-size 35mm cassette and it WORKS properly, which is more than can be said for some of the other freaky miniature cameras that were designed in the first half of the 20th. century.

LTM prices are not high for the more commomn user cameras (e.g. IIIa, IIIc, IIIf) but for rare models or for a IIIg in excellent condition they are. This is not surprizing, I suppose, collectors being what they are.

BTW, if you ever use one of the more recent LTM models, such as the IIIa/c/f, don't try to use both viewing windows at the same time unless your eyes are VERY close together! ;-)

-- Ray Moth (ray_moth@yahoo.com), May 30, 2002.

I don't know about the old screw bodies which look very hard and fiddly to load, wind on, etc. But the Voigtlander Bessa T looks like quite a usable camera for wide angle lenses like the 24 or the 12. Add the triggerwinder and the Leica doesn't have much of an advantage over it, imo.

-- rob (rob@robertappleby.com), May 30, 2002.

Allison: while I don't own/work with screw-mount bodies, I can appreciate the sentiments expressed HERE.

If your 'significant other' really IS an engineer at heart, he ought to appreciate the beauty of an 'elegant' solution (in the engineering sense) to the problem of designing a picture-making machine - and the pleasure of keeping even an antiquated design operating as originally designed (and proving, in the process, that it actually DOES till do the job).

You can still get from one place to another in a 1948 MG, or a 1932 Ford - or take pictures with a 1948 IIIc, or a 1968 M4 (Me!).

As to prices - they vary with the cosmetics and the market. I admit that personally I get more bang for my buck with an M - but 'chacun a son gout'!

-- Andy Piper (apidens@denver.infi.net), May 30, 2002.

I too agree that there is a certain nostalgia connected with the screwmount cameras, but as others have said they can be potent picture makers when pared with modern optics such as what Voigtlander makes or the special edition LTM lenses Leica brought out a few years back. No, it may not be pocketable, but my IIIg with collapsible Elmar easily hides under a light jacket without a wrinkle. Allison - there doesn't have to be reason for everything - you and your boyfriend should shoot more and question less ;-)

-- Bob Todrick (bobtodrick@yahoo.com), May 30, 2002.

Allison you know how all thw techno kids rave about the ease of use and great quality they get with their new toys, well sometimes its fun just to go back a few steps and try it the old way. All things improve with time and imagination, but doing it the old way makes you appreciate the newer ways so much more. Using the older Leicas makes you have to think of things that are now taken for granted. IE the time lag from focusing to framing, settings,anticipation of action (you only have one chance no motor drive to make sure you get the peak of the action. Sounds like work but by learning in this manner you can become better with the newer gear.

-- andy wagner (yxandy@hotmail.com), May 31, 2002.