Some time ago I informed you of a major problem I had with my M7, while shooting an anti Le Pen demonstration in Paris. in a nutshell, the shutter locked up mid-roll and could not be released. Here is an update.

I sent the camera in to Leica NJ under the Passport Warranty, all costs covered by Leica. Two weeks later I had still not heard back from them so I called. A very helpful gentleman by the name of Mike looked up my record and told they had not seen that problem before and could not fix it. They are sending a new camera within the next two weeks. End of story (I hope).

Anam

-- Anam Alpenia (aalpenia@dasar.com), May 29, 2002

Answers

Hopefully it's not an inherent prob.

-- James (snodoggydogg@hotmail.com), May 29, 2002.

in several of the recent m7 threads, people have suggested that leica is not very good from a QC perspective as compared to other companies. if any firm is in a position to ensure that their products are thoroughly beta tested before being released to the general public, it is nikon. however, when the f100 came out, it had several serious problems (the film rewind forks kept cracking, dust was pouring into the back, the thumb pad control for the AF spot would break after about three months of use, etc., etc., etc.). these faults were all eventually corrected about two years into production. there are now about five thousand m7s in the field. from what i gather talking to the folks in nj, the return rate is LESS than with new m6 cameras (which itself is less than 1% -- nikon hovers around 3%). i have also heard that DX problems may be caused by the failure to seat the film fully into the camera. the m7 is different than most cameras in terms of film loading (obviously). in most cameras, the film pops into a little compartment and so it is easy to ensure good alignment between sensors and coding. with the leica, there is some potential for users to fail to push the cartridge all the way into the camera. this may be what is causing the problem. some films may be more sensitive to improper loading than others depending on the precise configuration of the coding stripes. just like the shutter "jams" that occurred when loading that turned out to be the result of users failing to set the camera to a manual speed when installing film (resulting in the camera selecting a 32 sec exposure if the lens was covered), the dx prob also may be the product of mishandling. the leica was never the easiest camera to use (or load). just because the m7 has AE, don't expect it to be as idiot proof as an olympus stylus. it is said that blads don't suffer fools easily; the same is true of leicas. if you want a camera that a three year old can operate, look elsewhere.

-- roger michel (michel@tcn.org), May 29, 2002.

All complex products has some issues to work out when they go into large scale production and are used in ways not anticipated during testing. What is really important, is the ability of the company to deal with their customers when these problems surface.

Roger, if you by "folks in nj" mean the US Leica Distributors, you may as well disregard whatever they say about return rate (regardless if it is true or not). There is no way a company would admit to a higher return rate only 3 month after the introduction of a product which has significant impact on the companys future earnings. Not only is it too early to tell, but the consequenses on the stock value would be merciless.

-- Niels H. S. Nielsen (nhsn@ruc.dk), May 29, 2002.

i was not reading from a press release. i have a life-long friend who works for leica usa.

-- roger michel (michel@tcn.org), May 29, 2002.

I had a problem where the meter would not display numbers (only the dots). I unloaded the film and reloaded and all was well. I actually wish the M7 did not have the auto DX. The ISO dial on the M6 was perfect.

-- tristan (emulsion71@hotmail.com), May 29, 2002.

Anam:

I had the same problem with my brand new Leica M6 TTL. The shutter froze in the middle of a roll after only one month of light use. It took Leica USA in NJ three months to fix it and return the camera to me, all under Passport Warranty. Needless to say, I was not happy about the length of time I had to wait! :-(...

-- Muhammad Chishty (applemac97@aol.com), May 29, 2002.

Roger,

Curious? The 5,000 M7s in the field you mention. Just the US or worldwide? If just the US that means around 15,000 worldwide now as the US is (or had been) about 30% of their sales.

They have to beleive they have a winner.

Jerry

Best,

Jerry

-- Jerry Pfile (Jerry Pfile@MSN.com), May 29, 2002.

I'd find 5,000 M7's in the USA alone, two months after launch, hard to believe. My understanding is that they sell about 10,000 M6's per annum in total. I could believe 5,000 M7's in total. My .02% of that number is running perfectly.

I did have what I thought was Anam's problem about a month ago - the camera refused to function after I had it turned on for a while. It showed me what I took to be a hexadecimal error code of "6C" in the viewfinder. It turns out that I hadn't read the manual (so sue me, I'm a guy, OK?) and the camera was telling me the batteries were low - it was "bc" for "battery check", not "6C". According to the Canadian distributor, the lithiums that Leica is shipping (was shipping?) with the M7 may be dodgy, and they recommend replacing them with four S76 batteries. I did that, and things have been perfect ever since.

I love this camera, I hope Leica sells a million of the little beauties.

-- Paul Chefurka (paul@chefurka.com), May 29, 2002.

5000 M7s in the field may well actually be dealer/distrutor orders for most of 5,000 made in first production.

-- Charles (cbarcellona@telocity.com), May 29, 2002.

that was a worldwide figure. i think it is pretty reliable.

-- roger michel (michel@tcn.org), May 29, 2002.

Roger, I agree with you that latest electronic cameras from both Nikon and Canon have had problem production start ups, but these are very complex mechanical and electronic devices. When you are making a comparison, I think you have put M7 against Nikon F3, FE, FE2 and FM3a.

-- sait (akkirman@clear.net.nz), May 29, 2002.

After shooting (and ruining a couple of rolls) we've determined that the so-called "freeze" is due to film sprocket holes, on the sections of the film in the top of the camera, being torn due to improper loading. With an M6 - - or earlier - - you didn't have to worry about seating the film canister. With the M7, you have to deliberately seat the canister *all the way in* with your fingers before putting on the bottom plate. And, be sure that you've pulled out enough of the film leader to fit well into the takeup spool. The only thing that putting on the bottom plate should do is to seat the leader in the takeup spool. There's nothing on the bottom plate to ensure that the film cartridge is fully seated. If it isn't, then you have a situation where the film in the takeup spool is being dragged (however slightly ) at an angle that will result in the upper film sprocket holes being damageg ( read torn!). Somehow, you can't finish winding the film past that first release, as the damaged film precludes it from happening. FYI: I've six rolls of somewhat dated film in experimenting just "what went wrong!" Just be certain to pust that film canister ALL THE WAY IN!!

-- George C. Berger (gberger@his.com), May 29, 2002.

Maybe after 50 years it is about time Leica changes the way the film is loaded into the M. Never had any problems with dx-reading in my contax G, canon eos or heard of such problems occuring frequently with other camera's. But in all those camera's the film is loaded in the same way.

If the m way of film loading is so much better than the system every other manufacturer uses, why than does the R system not use the filmloading system of the M camera's? It should be no problem to incorporate it.

-- Frank (frank_bunnik@hotmail.com), May 30, 2002.

Excellent post for those of us with an M7. Every camera has it's idiosyncratic details that the user must master. I've experienced the bc warning on occassion and simply switched the camera on/off. But I'll try new batteries. Pushing in the film canister is a good tip. Those of us who are grousing about the inconvience of having to do a couple of special things with a Leica aren't considering that it's a fact of life with almost every camera. If you don't place the leader exactly where they tell you on an auto load camera it will usually misload. My Hexar does this on a fairly regular basis because of cureled film leaders (as if film was sold in flat strips instead of rolls) . With a Mamiya 7, you must follow their step-by-step loading proceedure to the letter or you're in trouble. After years of M work I find the loading to be reasonably fast and reassuring because I'm doing the loading. Thanks for the little differences with the 7 over the 6. It shortens the learning curve.

-- Marc Williams (mwilliams111313MI@comcast.net), May 30, 2002.

Marc sure is right about the quirks of auto-load cameras! I've misloaded my wife's Olympus Stylus Epic three times becasue I didn't have the end of the leader exactly where the red mark is. On the other hand, I've only misloaded an M6TTL once and that was with a partially used film taken from another camera.

-- Ray Moth (ray_moth@yahoo.com), May 30, 2002.

My M7 just went to NJ for repair with a stuck shutter release. I was using it with a Leica shutter release cord and the button stuck in the down position. I packed it carefully in my suitcase for the return trip home, and it must have gotten jarred just enough to come unstuck, but the next roll of film wound way past the last picture on the roll. I removed the film, and it had not even used the last three pictures on the roll even though I was able to keep winding and shooting pictures beyond the end of the roll. Hopefully two in 5000 are the only problems they will have.

-- Kevin in Pitt (ksmith@icubed.com), June 05, 2002.