Which film or speed to use for indoor orchestra?

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Hi.. I'd be shooting some of these indoor orchestra or musicals of availability light (no flash allowed) using my Ms and 90mm 2.8 and 35mm 1.4 lenses. What film, or rather what speed should I use? I've always use the HP5 and I read it can be pushed to 3200? I have some TMAX 400 but there's no such mentioning? Or should I be better off buyer 3200 films and what are you recommendations? Any good links to get some inspirations from? Thanks.

-- Greg Choong (greg_choong@yahoo.com), May 27, 2002

Answers

You might want to try a variety of film before hand to see how they do for the look you're after.

I'd go with the Ilford Delta-3200 over the TMax-3200, my results show finer grain with the Ilford when the film is rated at 1600 (slight push over the "normal" iso of about 1000-1250)

HP5 is great, but I'd not push it more than 1 stop (800).

I'd rule out the TMax-400, unless you can get by with a 400 speed film.

Mayne try some T400CN pushed (C41 process pushed) at 800.

The tricky thing might be the metering - orchestras tend to be dressed in black, and the light is normally very contrasty in the pit. You might think about spot metering on say.. a face, and using that for the basis of calculating exposure.

-- Charles (cbarcellona@telocity.com), May 27, 2002.


Delta 3200. Even better, Delta 3200 with a 75 Lux.

-- Marc Williams (mwilliams111313MI@comcast.net), May 27, 2002.

I have been photographing for the Florida Orchestra for the past ten years. When I am permitted to sit in the orchestra to photograph the conductor I may use my Leica Ms with 75mm or 50mm Summilux. More often I use Nikon's in sound blimp's, 50mm 1.4 or 85mm 2.0. Believe it or not, the Leicas are way too loud for the slow movements, which offer the best opportunity for dramatic shots of the conductor.

The exposure setting for shooting the conductor from the orchestra side of the hall in the Tampa Bay Performing Arts center is F 2.0 at 125 sec with 800 speed film. Shooting for the audience side toward the orchestra it is slightly brighter, but I use the same setting.

Shooting from backstage, 90mm is the absolute minimum necessary to shoot the conductor, 135mm or 180mm on a tripod is best. What you use from the audience varies depending on what you are looking for. Keep in mind that 80 musicians look pretty grainy crammed together on high speed 35mm film. I would leave the 35mm lens at home unless you were going to shoot backstage before or after the event.

Has the orchestra requested black and white? Color film can always be converted to black and white afterwards. Kodak 800 MAX film works well and is readily available.

Since you will be shooting wide open, at relatively slow shutter speeds, with everybody moving, there is no room for camera shake, which is why I suggest a tripod. Likewise, since there will be virtually no depth of field, try to keep the film plane parallel to the subject. Too much prominent blurriness in an image that is already stretching the limits of shutter speed vs. movement does not make for a good image (i.e. one that the orchestra will like).

-- Jim Lennon (jim@jmlennon.com), May 27, 2002.


Pushing any 400 speed film, such as HP5, will result in added contrast. That's probably the last thing you want with already contrasty stage lighting.

I normally shoot T-Max P3200 at 800 or 1600. It's nominal speed is 1000, and I've gotten great results with the film at various speeds up to 1600. It is designed to be pushed so the contrast isn't a problem until you get into speeds of 3200 and above. I've never tried the Ilford 3200, but from the sounds of the other posts, I should test it out.

Bring a spotmeter. Stage lighting varies dramatically. I've shot concerts that were extremely bright, say 500@2.8 at ISO 400, and those that were almost too dark to photograph.

-- Noah (naddis@mindspring.com), May 27, 2002.


You might also want to try Fuji's Neopan 1600.

-- Chris Chen (furcafe@NOSPAMcris.com), May 27, 2002.


To complete the above post about Neopan 1600: Where Delta 3200 and T-Max 3200 are 'new' films with tabular grain, Neopan 1600 is a classic emulsion. As for the tabular 3200, this 1600 is a grossly inflated number. Despite this, I use it often at 1600, developed in Tetenal Emofin. I get good results with near invisible grain with prints up to roughly an A4 paper sheet (or Letter format if you're American). Emofin is a 2 batch developer, which means it is nearly impossible to block highlights: Important when you shoot inside with huge contrast ranges. I avoid tabular films as I find them much more picky on exposure than classic films, although I must admit I got several times excellent results with delta 3200 (at 1600).

-- Xavier C. (xcolmant@powerir.com), May 28, 2002.

My experience with shooting in a concert hall is that with ISO 800, you can probably get 1/60 at f/2.8 or so. If you're going to shoot the 90, you probably want to go to ISO 1600 so as to be sure of being able to shoot at 1/125. The light could be better, but if it isn't, then you'll still be safe. If shooting B&W, I agree with the others that a so-called 3200 film would be best. I'd shoot it at 1600, though.

-- Bob Fleischman (RFXMAIL@prodigy.net), May 28, 2002.

I have had good luck with orchestra and choir concerts using Fuji Superia 1600 (@EI 1200) and 90mm Elmarit-M with a KB-12 color correcting filter.

-- Doug from Tumwater (dbaker9128@aol.com), May 28, 2002.

Thanks guys! Your input is most valuable! I'd probably test shoot using some of your recommendations, especially dealing with the lighting. I can get close to the subjects so I think using my 90mm lens will suffice. I will of course have my handy 35mm lux and my Ricoh GR1v ready for quick and unexpected moements.

-- Greg Choong (greg_choong@yahoo.com), May 30, 2002.

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