I think that though we all love the idea of the Voigtlander, not all that many people are buying it, in the grand scheme of things. Here in Canada Voigtlander has been distributed by Gentec Marketing, but they announced last week that, due to poor sales they were dropping the line as of May 1st. I know that where I work (largest independent photo retailer in Western Canada), we've sold 5 or 6 Voigt R bodies since its introduction, and maybe a dozen lenses. Though Leica is used to these sorts of figures, I think most distributors would look at this and laugh. Consider that in the same time period we probably sold 100 or more Cosina bodies in the guise of Nikon FM10, Olympus 2000, etc.

-- Bob Todrick (bobtodrick@yahoo.com), April 23, 2002

Answers

I'm not all that surprised. Voigtlander was a product of the rangefinder retro-fad in Japan, where I'm sure they sold a good number of lenses and bodies. I suspect that fad, like all fads, is or has passed. Japanese manufacturers want volume, once the number go away, so will the products.

-- Dan Brown (brpatent@swbell.net), April 23, 2002.

I suspect that a lot more lenses than bodies have been sold. I own several myself for focal lengths that I use less frequently and cannot justify the $ for Leica glass. It's too bad that this is happening before the Bessa R2, which I think is a more appealing body than the R, and can easily serve as a less expensive second body for Leica M users. I have ordered one for this purpose and will report back once I have had a chance to use it for awhile.

-- Steve Rosenblum (stevierose@yahoo.com), April 23, 2002.

If they would have come out with the R2 right off the bat, and a full series of affordable M mount lenses (which they could make no problem), I think they would have developed more of a following. I also have one of their lenses, but haven't had any use for the bodies they have made so far. It almost seems like they went out of their way to court poor sales with camereas like the Bessa T.

-- Andrew Schank (aschank@flash.net), April 23, 2002.

Don't count them dead yet! The R2 is a sign of things to come. It wouldn't surprise me to see the LTM lenses offered in M mounts soon. They made Nikon RF versions of some of their lenses; M mounts can't be that far behind.

-- Tony Oresteen (aoresteen@mindspring.com), April 23, 2002.

"Don't count them dead yet"--well, if they have no distributer or one that doesn't even make any effort to get the cameras into the stores, how wil the cameras sell in quantities enough to justify production? I don't think a few dozen gray market cameras sold here and there is going to be enough.

-- Andrew Schank (aschank@flash.net), April 23, 2002.

I think Cosina does not feel like putting much money into marketing. They are niche market and they want ot keep it that way. THK never did much to promote CV line and Schneider does absolutely nothing.

On the bright side there are grey-market dealers like Stephen Gandy and Delta International who bring CV products at good prices. And in the case of Stepen there's a lot of information offered for a prospective buyer.

As far as "grand scheme of things" goes I highly doubt that Leica sells much more more items quantity-wise then Cosina does with Voigtlander line. And probably Cosina is more profitable then Leica in the grand scheme of things since they can afford R&D to come up with new products every six months or so. No offence, just a thought...

Also Kobalux comes to mind. They make lenses, not a bad 21/2.8 for one, and they have no distributor, and we still can buy them if we feel like it. So what's the problem?

-- Alexander Grekhov (grekhov@wgukraine.com), April 23, 2002.

Maybe due to the poor exchange rate of late, the Canadian gov't issued an order that all Voigt products sold not be taken out of the country...like autos eh?

-- Dave Doyle (dave@soilsouth.com), April 23, 2002.

Alexander, I question your statement that Cosina is a niche market. Among other things Cosina makes bodies for Nikon (FM10/FE10), Olympus, Vivitar and a number of others. They are (IMO) a big company that is far more interested in 'numbers', than providing a product to keep a few rangefinder zealots ;-) happy. The reason they got into the Voigtlander line was mainly due to a large screwmount faction in Japan. Only because of grey market cameras showing up in North America did they feel that they should market the cameras over here, but I don't think they've ever thought of us as a major market. Only time will tell if the R2 boosts sales enough that distributors here (US and Canada) want to market it properly.

-- Bob Todrick (bobtodrick@yahoo.com), April 24, 2002.

I question your statement that Cosina is a niche market. Among other things Cosina makes bodies for Nikon (FM10/FE10), Olympus, Vivitar and a number of others.

I should have made it clear that I meant Voightlander line of Cosina products -- their RF line, Voigtlander SLR lenses (not the generic plastic junk) and Hasselblad accessories.

They are (IMO) a big company that is far more interested in 'numbers', than providing a product to keep a few rangefinder zealots ;-) happy.

I think the "numbers" come from the sales of their generic cheapo stuff -- enough to put some cash in the pocket AND pay for R&D for new lenses. Also I think they have a nice profit per lens or RF body sold (I'm talking about Voigtlander line here).

-- Alexander Grekhov (grekhov@wgukraine.com), April 24, 2002.