bloody shite

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

Answers

At Least a Point

but bloody worried after that load of crap

Any attempts on goal - no ?

Any control over 90 minutes - no?

Sorry but on TV we looked very poor

night night - no more can be said - await reports from the foot soldiers.

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

I feel very let down, not just by the team, but also by Bobby's failure to do anything effective about it. He tried, but in the same way that he dabbled with the team formation against Spurs & 'Pool. Bringing Solano in field (that's how it looked on TV anyway) and Jenas on, leaving Shearer up front on his own didn't work - it made things worse. We lost our outlet on the right and any chance of winning the game. Agree that Hughes was generally poor as pointed out on the other thread - I'd have thought more of him if just one of his throw ins had reached one of our men, or at least one who didn't have a Fulham player up his @rse.

For me a double sub of Bernard and Lua Lua for Cort and Robert would have secured more posession and given us a chance of winning the game.

I really wanted Robert to have a blinder but it just didn't happen for him. Not entirely lack of effort, but his annoying habit of trying to pass the ball behind the defender challenging him and leaving the ball at their feet! Mind the balls delivered to him were generally hit and hopes - none of the over the tops that Distin has been feeding him - At least that's how I saw it.

Nothing I saw changed my mind about Elliot - he can tackle OK but he gets out of position and his distribution isn't good - a fault shared with Hughes today.

Cort in all honesty was awful - No - Woeful. He either has an incredible lack of pace or and incredibly slow mind - I'm not sure which but he was slow to anticipate passes and failed to reach balls that I'd expect anyone to get to. He's a fair replacement for Shearer if Shearer is injured but cannot play with him effectively. If there's no Bellers then it's got to be Lua Lua or Dyer up front with Al.

I'm still annoyed at the booing - that's never a good thing when you know they've tried their best but it just hasn't happened. Silence is perhaps a better option if you're really unhappy.

Credit to Fulham who made us look so bad, and yes, the ref gave us nothing, but that's clutching at straws. Right now those last 5 games look tough and I will be wound up like a clock spring for the rest of the season.

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

Verdict Pete? We were bloody horrible, 2nd best throughout, and frankly a little lucky to get even a point. Fulham took control of midfield and never let go. For spells in the 2nd half we were actually embarrassing.

I really don't think we can blame a lack of effort, with the possible exception of one Frenchman, but there some truly dreadful performances. Cort was awful, Speed had a nightmare: Distin was distinctly wobbly, and looked far from being the answer at CB: Elliott's distribution yet again was woeful, but at least he did some useful defensive work. Solano had a decent 1st half, but even his performance went down the toilet after the break.

The only player I can say anything positive about was Given, who unquestionably was our MOTM.

Difficult to know where we go after such an abysmal performance, but unless BR can work another miracle we can probably kiss goodbye to a CL's place after all the hard work that has been put in throughout the season. Very, very disappointing.

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

Regarding the substitution, I initially thought BR was reacting to the fact that we were being over-run in midfield by bringing on JJ. However, he clearly told JJ to play up front with AS, and ran to the touchline screaming at him when he drifted back into m/f, at which point Dyer told him to get further forward.

Despite this, JJ clearly realised the main problem was in m/f, and kept dropping back to pick up one of the several spare men that Fulham usually had.

If BR felt we needed another forward on the field to replace the totally ineffective Cort, you really have to wonder why he bought JJ on at all - why not simply bring on a forward, eg. Lx3?

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

Clarky agree in the main - but yet again a certain Frenchman made the goal. He meant the header to go exactly where it did.

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

Where does he get these inspirations from Clarkie - Jenas as striker - now I never would have thought of that. When he came on I confidently told my family he'd push Dyer up alongside Shearer and play Jenas - Speed in midfield. Wrong!

Was I right that he brought Nobby inside for the last 15 - 20 minutes?

You know Bobby may spot some great players (or hire great scouts) and develop them very well (or hire....) but when was the last time we won a tactical battle (as opposed to having Bellamy drag a defence everywhere and create or score goals or have an individual piece of brilliance from Robert, Solano etc.)?

It seems when we're set a tactical challenge we fail - you know the matches. Am I being too harsh, unfair - I'm still P@ssed off so maybe I am. I think the world of BR but I'm still asking myself questions.

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

can someone ask me why we allowed their players to pressure us so much? How could we be so indecisive and unthinking? Our best options time and again were back passes to Shay.

Aaron taking throw ins looked downright bewildered, he had no idea who to throw in to!!!!

This might rank as the worst performance of the year, even against Wham and Pool we had some play...

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

Seems to me we were so sh1t scared of losing we made no attempt to go all out to win. Woeful.

It's the old story. Not an ounce of guile. Pass sideways or backwards or bang it as far upfield as possible for this giant of a so called striker who looks a foot smaller when he jumps, but for fuxake whatever you do, don't try to move the ball forward via open spaces created by intelligent players making room for themselves.

There haven't been many worse exibitions this season.

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

I'm as pished off as anyone but Bobby got his subs badly wrong tonight - Cort had a bad game (as did at least 6 others and players who have been out for that long take more than 2 months to get back) but without him we could NOT hold the ball up for a second. With the 5 in midfield and no-one running through Shearer had to win the header, hold the ball up, turn, create and finish.....adn of course it failed miserably.

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

LuaX2 to start against derby. Gotta give the lad a chance, clearly cort is not up to it at this point, and the rest of 'em have no idea what to do without Bellamy.

-- Anonymous, April 08, 2002

Pilgrim said
"I'm still annoyed at the booing - that's never a good thing when you know they've tried their best but it just hasn't happened. Silence is perhaps a better option if you're really unhappy. "
Do you really think they tried theyre best Pilgrim lad? If tey did then we are surely gonna get relagated next season half the lads didnt even try......

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

Cort looked like he needed match practice to get his head straight. He was flat footed, mistimed jumps and looked gangly when pressured. Fulham ran all day long and closed players quickly in midfield, where we looked very lightweight - and with Speed too! The team didn't look as if they had played together before, and it felt as if the past 2 1/2 years had never happened.

Bobby's marks:

Given 7 - outstanding stop at Saha's feet, 2ce!
Hughes 6 - average game, ok in defence
O'Brien 6 - outpaced a few times, cleared up reasonably well until dead leg.
Distin 6 - again, for a supposed quick lad he looked slow over 10yds. Nearly managed 4 passes to the opposition on the trot 2nd half
Elliott 4 - why?
Robert 6 - great header fwd for Dyer's goal. Frustrated throughout
Speed 5 - battled for nowt. Looked off the pace
Dyer 7 - great finish, reasonably worried Fulham (but not often enough)
Solano 7 - hard game, worked well
Shearer 6 - the barometer of the team. If AS ends up in midfield bringing the ball out, you know we're playing badly. And he did often, and we were throughout. No real luck in the game
Cort 5 - a stint in the reserves, please, to get his match head right. Immediate haircut necessary.
Subs: Jenas 5 - not entirely sure what he was supposed to do up front. Snatched his shot which could have been a winner
Dabizas 5 - fair 2nd half appearance.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

A few points to respond to:

Pilgrim - Solano moved inside to bolster the m/f even in the 1st half. For whatever reason, that I don't pretend to understand, we were over-run in m/f throughout the game. In The Journal this morning, BR reckons we are weary after playing for 10 months - well there are a few things I could add to that comment.

After his lay-off and coming back without a single Reserve game (!), Speed was yards off the pace, and as is usual Robert was contributing only in little spurts. This left Dyer trying manfully to run the m/f operation, and I don't think Solano had any real choice but to move infield.

Up front CC was hopeless, and this meant the ball was continually coming back into m/f - as fast as we got the ball, we gave them it back.

What Bobby was thinking of in bringing JJ on as a striker only he knows - presumably so as not to disturb the Dyer/Speed combination - one that wasn't functioning anyway. All this actually did was create confusion, with Dyer, Shearer, Solano all trying to sort out who was playing where when we should have been driving for the winner.

Josh - my criticism of Robert was very muted, because he wasn't any worse than several others. As you've raised the issue, yes he contributed to our goal, and also knocked in a couple of good crosses. However, his overall contribution to the team effort when we were being overrun in m/f, simply wasn't good enough for me. He did track back fairly often, got in a couple of tackles, and bugger me even got himself booked. However, far too often he stands like a lemon when a team-mate is under pressure and looking for an outlet, too often he doesn't move to get into space, and far too often he tries to beat someone in a dangerous position around the halfway line only to lose the ball, putting us under pressure. He is a fantastic talent, but far too often his contribution to the overall team effort is lacking and way, way below what he is capable of.

Last thought - I think we are under-estimating Fulham's contribution to our performance last night. They haven't been having a good time recently, but I have to say I thought they were impressive - Laurent robert would do well to watch the video today and ponder on the work-rate of some of their players, in particular his compatriot Steve Marlet, who rans his knackers off in the cause and looked a good player to me. He might perhaps come to realise why Marlet rather than himself is going to the WC with France.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

BR made a substitution which ended up stopping our most effective force. Dyer and Solano are back on the same wavelength and the pass and move was getting somewhere. When JJ came on I could tell that Dyer was going to end up alongside AS. KD is most effective running through the defenders, scares hell out of them and his link play with NS alllows this to happen. Stupid substitution and I have to agree with earlier sentiments. It should have been LLL for CC and JJ for GS.

LLL must start the next game if we are to get anything.

On the Robert issue he did try occasionally but I feel the reason he doesn't get the bal is because of his positioning. Too often he is standing beside the left back or next to the centre circle. If he gets the ball at this point he ends up with too many players in front of him and loses it or plays a long ball which sometimes gives us the break. For a left winger he's rarely in the Left wing position when people look up. I agree he doesn't work hard enough but a couple of defensive tackles and a strange defensive header in the second half certainly proved he does try some of the game. Very frustrating to watch.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

Andy - I agree entirely with your comments on LR. You know, it seems to me that he may not have been well coached in his earlier career, as at times he does seems terribly naive. However, he is such a wonderful natural talent, I have to believe that if he himself is willing to learn that BR could yet make a genuine world star out of him. Let's hope so.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

My turn.

I saw the pre-match interview with Bobby on Sky. He was asked why Speed was in for Jenas and he said it was totally down to experience, as that was the key factor at this time of the season. Begs the question as to whether Jenas will play August to March next season and Speed March-May ?

Three things were wrong with the set up last night.

The first was Carl Cort (how did someone give him 5/10). He was hopeless. He was worse than having no one there at all. If you aren't there you cannot mess things up. The time he was flagged offside inthe first half was an absolute disgrace. Solano was out on the wing, Cort in the middle looking out towards him, Solano swung the centre in and Cort was flagged offside. No excuse. Not any, schoolboy incompetence.

The second was Speed playing. Speed is a defensively minded midifeld player, with little or no inclination to get forward. Jenas is a positively minded midfield player with every incliniation to get forward. When Speed plays the whole centre of gravity for the side moves back 5 yards. (Lack of Bellamy has already move us back 5-10 yards). Suddenly the Speed/Jenas person rather than passing the ball slightly fowards/sideways and finding Dyer on the shoulder of a defender is doing that 5 yards deeper and Dyer is surrounded in midfielder and then defenders. Playing Speed stops Dyer in his tracks.

BUT

If you're going to play a defensively minded Speed, on the left hand side of midfield, then you can risk playing Bernard at left back. Bernard has a more attacking frame of mind and would perhaps put in the attacking option that Speed removes. But no we have Elliot back, to allow Dabizas to be dropped. Elliot got a couple of tackles in but the passing part of his game was hopeless. He twice just hoofed the ball over his shoulder inthe general area of the forwards, the second of which prodcued a right bollocking from Shearer. Elliot also delays the passes to Robert. The first two passes he gave him he delayed and delayed until they were hospital passes.

Given was spot on.

From our position up in the gods it was clear what Hughes' problem was with throw ins, not a soul was moving. He looked forward, sideways and back and everyone was hiding next to their marker. Even the kids in the Family enclosure could see the issue.

Jenas coming on for Cort was surreal. Speed even jogged across to question Bobby as to wheteher he had the right person, I think he said "but we're both crap why you taking him off", or words to that effect.

Our successes this season have revolved around pace, movement and fast passing. With Cort ion the team (at the moment) we have a block to all three of those attributes. Playing Gary Speed has a similar detrimental effect on the pace and movement, and his passing is pretty dodgy. Elliot can be okay defensively but nothing else.

If Bellamy isn't fitfor Derby then Lua2, Dyer, Chopra, my grannie should be picked ahead of Cort.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

Spot on Macbeth, With Speed back in we looked lost in the centre of midfield and our Forwards were stood on the half way line instead of our defence. Your'e right about the throw ins as well, but I will say that it was during the entire game that we lacked any sort of movement. Does anyone agree that Cort and Speed seem to have no idea about finding space for the ball to be played into them (I have already made the point about Robert so I won't repeat it). With Dyer and Solano they can control the ball and pass it on even with two opposition players around them. With speed and Cort the ball bounces off their ankles for five yards and they have to run after it.

Any of the other options available to us should be used rather than play Cort again, maybe even leave out Speed as well, We have fully fit players who should be used rather than partly fit liabilities.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

uncle bob has always been loyal to his senior players sometimes to the point that it hurts the team. (remember england in '86 & 90)

cort is a senior player, bob probably thought it would be wrong and detrimental to his confidence to leave him out -after missing 2 seasons - in favour of lua or ameobi. the result of bob's loyalty is a deficit of 4-5 points plus a place in the fa cup semis.

bob may be vindicated if and when cort gets back to his best form or villified if he (cort)spends next season tripping over the ball.

the speed thing is a bit mystifying, i've always thought speed was crap even during his "purple patch" in january, the notion that a half fit gary speed (presumably he covered half of the center circle last night) would be more effevtibve than jenas is hard to support.

if the last few weeks has proved anything its that given, distin, hughes, JJ, dyer, solano, robert and bellamy are ok, the rest are probably not top six / CL quality.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

Cort isn't a senior player, he is an expensive player. Speed is both. Last night they were both hopeless.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

dot com has a rant about the booing last night.

in the last 6 weeks we've come up against the worst teams in the league. - mackems, fulham, everton, ipswich, 3 at home 1 away.

we've managed 2 wins and 2 draws from that lot.

we've also been panelled by arsenal and liverpool and managed a sketchy draw at aston (not interested mid table) villa.

i'm not a big fan of booing the team or individual players but this isn't the result of one bad game. what do you expect?

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

GB

if we play in the CL then we are going to be playing against the equivalent of Man U, Arsenal and Liverpool every game, and we've seen how we've generally striggled against these sides (6 points from 18).

I want us to be playing at this level, with the opportunity for all the players you've mentioned to learn from the experience. If we end up in the Uufa Cup then okay we will still learn but we'll be playing against our peers not our betters.

I think the 8 you name are probably okay but it still leaves us 3 players away from being a very special side. I don't see Shearer not being in the side, for all the loyalty reasons mentioned elsewhere. He is not the big issue at the moment but if everyone was fit he would be close to being our weakest offensive player.

What we will need is the squad size of classy players to match the top 3. We have no cover for Bellamy, no cover for Shearer, struggle to cover for Dyer, and unproven cover in many places. Robson has refused to rest/sub some players and allow the younger players to grow. Shola had 12 starts last year and has had 4 this. It's very easy to get into the trap of saying I'm not picking a player until he's better than the player in the side, who I am very loyal to.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

Macbeth I like what you're saying about shearer being "the weakest link" assuming everyone is fit. Personally I think it's time for bob to realize that shearer may not be up to playing every single game for the whole 90. Additionaly, it will be a strong manager that finally tells shearer this and since bob will only be around for the next two seasons tops it has to happen sooner rather than later. Don't get me wrong, shearer has been a great servant to the club and we wouldn't be in the position we're in now without his contribution. However, not for the first time this season, shearer didn't get a sniff against a rather poor defence.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

Robert doesn't like balls played to his feet, he prefers it played into space to run onto, as 9 times out of 10 he can beat the defender to it.

Only Bellamy and Distin seem to understand this though. In time the rest of the players will get used to it, maybe Robert can tell them if he gets learning his English when in between World Cup matches on the telly.

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002