Hi,

I need to photograph computer equipment and other objects for my work and recently hired a professional photographer to do this. He used two powerful commercial strobes and a soft box, and the pictures were quite nice. I tried to copy his setup just for fun using a crappy old auto-flash and a bunch of white paper to use for reflection. Well, they turned out pretty well considering the equipment I was using. But...

I figure if I could use two consumer flashes and some Lumiquest devices, I might be able to do 98% as good of a job as the professional photographer. Which leads to my question: Can I use two (TTL or otherwise) flashes with my M6 TTL (or one TTL and one Auto (set to manual)). Am I trying to do something that the M6TTL system just isn't designed to do, or with a few connectors and cords could I pull it off. I don't mind spending some money to do this, but I don't want to spend X thousand dollars getting a professional lighting setup, etc.

Thanks in advance for advice and/or references. grant-

-- grant young (g_e_young@yahoo.com), March 10, 2002

Answers

To do this the effective way means you need a few pieces of equipment:

- Flash meter - slave trigger - stands for the flash units - diffusers for the flash units - extension cord to connect one flash with the camera (Nikon SC-17 is perfect)

You set the camera on 1/50 flash sync, set the flash units on manual output. Create your setup, connect up camera and master flash, connect slave to second unit. Manually trigger the flash to get your exposure reading with the flash meter. Adjust power output on the two flash units until you get the f/stop you want to use, or just set the f/stop to what it falls to.

Easy.

-- Godfrey (ramarren@bayarea.net), March 10, 2002.

The following is copied from THE NATURAL IMAGE, published by the noted wildlife photographer, Geo. D. Lepp www.leppphoto.com >>>

"The ability to use more than one flash at the same time in the TTL mode has been an advantage for 35mm photographers for many years. The method has been to use a series of connector cords and accessories to connect all the flashes and the camera together. Minolta was the first camera company to offer wireless TTL flash capability, but this system had many drawbacks. A few years ago the Ikelite Company developed a wireless TTL flash slave called the Lite- Link that allowed Canon and Nikon cameras to use multiple TTL flashes without any cords connecting them. This technology uses sensors to read the flash duration of the TTL flash attached to the camera and control the accessory flashes to exactly mimic the timing and duration of the main flash.

"The result is a correct flash exposure with as many flashes firing as the photographer wishes-- all without attached cords.

"Introduced this year [1999] is a new TTL flash slave from Nikon called the SU-4, that uses a similar technology and gives new capabilities to many Nikon flashes. This small slave unit slips on the flash shoe of any TTL Nikon flash, and, by reading another TTL flash on the camera, it mimics the same output. The end result is a properly exposed image using several light sources.

"So how is the SU-4 different from the Lite-Link? First of all it's smaller and less expensive. It also has the capability to rotate around the base of the attached flash to face the main flash on the camera, so as to better read the main flash's output. Other than those differences and a few bells and whistles, the SU-4 is very similar to Lite-Link.

"There is no limit to the number of SU-4s that can be used simultaneously. As long as all the flashes with SU-4s attached can read the master flash on the camera, the exposure will be correct.

"The literature that comes with the SU-4 states that the slave should only be used with Nikon flashes. It is my experience that the SU-4 should work with any flash that is set to give automatic TTL flash exposure with Nikon cameras that support the TTL flash mode. The street price of the SU-4 is approximately $75 [1999]. The weight of an SU-4 is 1.8 oz and the size dimensions are 2.5 (W) x 2.1 (D) x 1.1 (H) inches."

Note that these instructions apply to Nikon. I needed some typing practice and that is why I copied this onto this thread. It is also a question I have pondered a bit. It might be that the Leica could be similiarly rigged and it would be for someone who is a lot more savvy in the realm of Leica flash than I am. All I know for sure is that when I try to use a Gossen Multi-Pro flash meter to figure out muiltiple independent slaves, this seems to befuddle the Multi-Pro, and I get poor results.

It could be that both of the products mentioned have a website and you could find out about Leica compatability straight from the "horse's mouth."

-- Frank Horn (owlhoot45@hotmail.com), March 10, 2002.

Or...you could buy 2 Metz SCA-3000 series flashes and a Nikon SC17 cord and a Nikon SU-4 wireless TTL trigger. With the SCA-3501 or 3502 module on one flash, connected to the camera via the SC17, and the other flash mounted on the SU-4 using an SCA-3402 (Nikon TTL) module, you would get both flashes controlled TTL by the camera. You could also use a Nikon strobe on the SU-4. I am also thinking that Metz might have a wireless TTL slave trigger for some of their units.

I agree that the flashmeter and manual (but adjustable-output) flashes is probably the most user-selectable way to go, the all-TTL way is probably simpler.

-- Jay (infinitydt@aoo.com), March 10, 2002.

Jay- If I read you correctly, what you are saying is that each light source must be metered with the flash meter independently of the other flashes, until each reading is the same (or, very close)...?

-- Frank Horn (owlhoot45@hotmail.com), March 10, 2002.

I need to photograph computer equipment and other objects for my work

These things don't move around on you, so you could easily shoot them daylight-balanced photo-flood lights. These are cheap and work amazingly well for this type of shot. You control the relative output from each light by moving the light closer or farther away from the subject. Your in-camera meter does fine for determining the exposure. Bingo, done, simple and cheap.

Or just rent two studio mono lights and a flash-meter for the occasions you want to do this. Most of the bigger studio strobes have built-in modeling lights that make it very easy to set up and pre-visualize your shot. Flash meters then take most of the guess- work out of exposure when using the multiple-light set-ups. You can even use it to double-check that you have your 2:1 (or whatever) lighting ratio properly adjusted. You can then hook up via a pc synch cord from the pc socket on the camera to the strobe, or use a small on-camera flash (dialed down to minimum output) to trigger the main strobes since they all have flash slaves built into them. Power output is adjusted by sliders on the back of each unit, and most allow the modeling light to dim proportionately at the same time. Once you've used this type of set-up in a studio environment, you'll never even think about trying it with two small on-camera type strobes again. Trust me!

Cheers,

-- Jack Flesher (jbflesher@msn.com), March 11, 2002.

Hello Grant. Jack has given very good advice here.I understand budget is a requirement,however,there is no substitute for the predictable control of a simple monobloc/softbox/reflector arrangement using an incident flash meter.In time you will treasure this set up for commercial work.With the usual outlay on Leica equipment, relatively speaking it may not be a huge investment.For the 35mm. format, Leica images with this set up are second to none. Regards.

-- Sheridan Zantis (albada60@hotmail.com), March 11, 2002.

When using more than one flash, I think you'll find that the easiest way to do it is to simply use manual mode and meter the scene. The reason is that the TTL sensor behind the lens will give you perfect exposures every time, but since it is only one sensor, it has no way of knowing what ratio you intend your two flash units to have. Therefore, you have to engage in workarounds such as physically positioning one unit twice as far from the subject as the other, etc. If you're going to go through gymnastics like this just to use TTL, it is easier to use manual and just use manual mode and meter.

Alternatively, you can do a pretty good job with both units in auto, since each unit then has it's own sensor controlling it and you can adjust the power on one unit to give 1-2 stops less output.

If I had to do this without spending a lot of money, I'd get two Vivitar 283s with the off-camera cords and VP-1 plug-in modules which allow the power to be adjusted manually.

-- Rolfe Tessem (rolfe@ldp.com), March 11, 2002.

Frank: In manual mode, you can set the individual flash units to provide whatever lighting ratio you want. They don't have to be equal.

While multi-flash TTL automation would appear to offer the advantage of "perfect" exposure, I agree that a manual setup where exposure is determined by a good flash meter is more flexible and usually provides better results. The sensor's idea of "perfect", afterall, may not be the same as your definition for a more complex "commercial" shot.

Here is an example of a studio still life using multiple strobes, all configured manually (M6 TTL w/ 35mm Summicron):

This is what the set looked like:

Although the shoot was centered around a 4x5 shot, I simply moved my M6 into position for the comparison image shown above, and used the same exposure setting as determined with a Sekonic L-508 meter for the view camera (film speeds were the same).

-- Ralph Barker (rbarker@pacbell.net), March 11, 2002.

Ralph- Excellent illustration! The exposure is perfect. The use of flash or other artificial light sources, is a science. The practical use of artificial light really sorts out the pro from the amature. I'm sure it takes a lot of practice and no small investment in time and money!

-- Frank Horn (owlhoot45@hotmail.com), March 11, 2002.