Give us some ideas of things that are "too frugal" to you. Where do you draw the line? Are there things you just won't do to save money?

OK, here are mine: I just hate to hang up white clothes, all those little socks and everything, I put them in the dryer. I would not use the "Keeper" (sorry if this offends anyone I will remove, or any other alternative feminine product...) I did not use cloth diapers... I just bought the cheapest no-name brands I could find. I might think of some more! Add yours to the list!

-- Melissa in SE Ohio (me@home.net), March 07, 2002

Answers

A relative hoards everything, absolutely everything. She refuses to throw anything away. She is a long-time widow and you can only get through her house by following little trails. The entire house is packed, PACKED, with junk. If the fire department sees it ...

-- Randal in Brazil (randal@onebox.com), March 07, 2002.

Frugality is, I am sure, different to each of us. I used cloth diapers because I thought they were better, didn't contribute to the overwhelming trash problem and were, obviously, less expensive. I hang clothes out because I love the smell (and I can just hear pennies dropping into a piggybank somewhere) but I pay for a cell phone and internet access; both luxuries. You do what you do because it makes sense to you and fits your lifestyle. Sometimes it isn't frugality that causes us to do things but safety and concern for our family's health and well being. Those things that I "just won't do" are things that someone else romps through, while they wouldn't dream of hanging clothes out or baking their own bread or using cloth diapers, or whatever. I really enjoy hearing what other people do to save money; then I pick and choose. Hear those pennies? =o)

-- Rosalie (Dee) in IN (deatline@globalsite.net), March 07, 2002.

Melissa, I divide my whites, lol. I hang out the t-shirts, slips, boxers, shirts but I dry the socks and smaller underwear. That way I still save some money but don't have to hang out the tedious (and embarrassing) things. I, too, think we each do what makes sense to us or fits our priorities. My husband and I are very frugal, but living in the almost country think a cell phone for me is necessary. There have been several times when I have hit a deer or had the car break down when I have been extremely thankful for my cell phone. We also take several short vacations a year. I have to get away at times for my sanity. We skimp in many ways to pay for the vacations. We are making fun memories for our children this way. When we eat out it's only at places that we have coupons for and we don't go anywhere expensive. I didn't use clothe diapers because my two children that I did try them on, broke out in rashes from the clothe, no matter how often I changed them. I'm trying to think of what is too frugal for me and it's a real challenge to find something! The only other thing I can come up with is moving to a online provider that is cheaper if you spend less time online. I can't do that, lol.

-- Deena in GA (dsmj55@aol.com), March 07, 2002.

I'm guilty of using my dryer for everything. My electric bill is usually around $35 a month so I don't mind using it as much as I do. I'd have a tough time giving up my dishwasher. Most everything else I'm pretty frugal with, especially food. I do not buy junk food at all, my kids don't mind because we've never ate the stuff. I won't buy pre-processed food and never buy the name brand stuff unless it's cheaper than generic/store brand. Cable tv and music cds is something I'd never buy though I have a friend who makes cds for me. Vehicle tires is one thing I don't mind paying up a bit for. Shoes and boots are something I'll pay a bit more than the cheapest price. Same with socks, especially for my kids because those cheap socks barely last a month for them.

All my frugality gets thrown away on rent though. That's something I need to work on. I could have paid off a place in many areas for what I've spent on rent the past few years.

-- Dave (multiplierx9@hotmail.com), March 07, 2002.

I guess I'm pretty spoiled, I could probably come up with a whole list! Right now I'm just trying to cut back on the food spending by better planning and usage. If I stop buying junk food altogether, I'd have a rebellion on my hands, and I'm outnumbered!

I'm still working on getting a clothesline in, Lance thinks everything is stiff when it's dried on a line - I can't convince him there's a big difference in drying it OUTside and drying it INside! I may get a small one just for the sheets and kitchen towels, old towels, etc. If I can cut down on just two loads a week it will still save me money, and gradually I can add to the list of "hang- ups", right!

I couldn't give up my dishwasher either! If there's one thing in this house that saves me a lot of time, that's it! I do hand wash whatever won't fit and a few other things I just don't like to put in there, though. I like my microwave too, though I use it far less than I used to! It is really good for steamed veggies and wonderful for squash, though!

I'd better quit before I get too far and you guys think I'm a spendthrift!

-- Christine in OK (cljford@mmcable.com), March 07, 2002.

I remember reading somewhere (was it the Tightwad Gazette ? Can't remember...) about separating 2ply TP into 2 rolls -- someone had even made a hand-cranked machine to do this. This is pretty much where I draw the line. I'll make stock out of what other people throw away -- and never have to buy the powdered; I refuse to buy anything foodwise that costs more than $2 a lb (Thanks, Mitch!); I fool my kids into eating beans three times a week; but separating TP - - I draw the line RIGHT THERE!

Sorry -- not my bag!

-- Tracy (trimmer31@hotmail.com), March 07, 2002.

lol Tracy, yeah that's taking things a bit too far for sure.

-- Dave (multiplierx9@hotmail.com), March 07, 2002.

A few weeks ago, a friend came over and had supper with us-he was complaining about his wife stashing everything in the basement til he couldn't stand it anymore, and he hauled TWO truckloads of stuff to the city dump. Well of course that sparked a big fight between he and his wife-(which was why he was eating at our house without her!) and I could just feel my dearly beloved trying very hard NOT to look at me-to his credit, he never said a word, but I took a hint and stuff started going! This same fellow complained of wifes cooking- she never seasoned stuff because she thought seasoning was a waste of money! plus, they had to have their new washer fixed, because she packed it too full of clothes! I have been to thier house and shivered because she wouldn't turn the heat up. So yes, I think you can be too frugal! The funny thing is-he makes a good living-its not that she HAS to do any of these things!

-- Kelly (KY) (homearts2002@yahoo.com), March 07, 2002.

Hey Kelly, I would draw the line at no spices or herbs to flavor food!! We use so much of this kind of stuff. I do grow a lot of my own herbs. My kids thnk there is something wrong with everyone else's cooking, it is too bland for them!!

-- Melissa in SE Ohio (me@home.net), March 07, 2002.

Although I have a reputation amongst friends for being "cheap", there are MANY things that I would not do just to save money. The way I figure it, I save money wherever I can do so with a moderate amount of effort, and then I can splurge on certain luxuries without feeling guilty. I do not SKIMP on my food bill, although I do try to buy things on sale, in bulk, etc. I do buy myself "toys" (mostly used books, magazines, and tools for the homestead), but again, I try to find deals). I like to live well, but just don't think it is necessary to spend a lot of money to do so.

-- Elizabeth (ekfla@aol.com), March 07, 2002.

Using second-hand underwear is, in my opinion, TOO frugal.

My dad would never let us use second-hand shoes. We always had new shoes, and things were really tight for us sometimes.

I save money AND embarrassment by drying socks and underwear on a rack indoors.

I would not serve oatmeal every morning, nor would I water down the juice.

I have learned to darn socks, but find it a lot easier just to buy new ones. I am sort of in between on this one.

I don't like the water heater turned down, but we do keep the heat at 62.

I have used both cloth and disposable diapers; we had two in cloth when I had no washer or dryer. The more children I have, the more I use disposable for convenience. But I really like cloth.

And I don't approve of the once-a-week bath unless there is sponge- bathing in between.

-- Cathy N. (homekeeper86@sympatico.ca), March 07, 2002.

The Keeper is great for environmental reasons, and it does pay for itself pretty quickly. Also, women have mentioned that for some reason it relieves cramps, so that may be something to consider. The Instead product is a totally plastic disposable version (some report it is shaped more like a diaphragm) which to me is even worse because it IS disposable, and worse, not decomposable. I liked cloth diapers-- was happy to have the nice rags after, and they will decompose after a while, unlike disposables.

I guess where I draw the line is the payback--some things just don't have a payback ratio that is worth it, like the toilet paper splitter someone mentioned. Also, I try not to buy white anything, easier just to wash everything together:) The payback ratio is different for everyone--depends mainly upon what you do for a living--if you're some high-paid sports star, it doesn't make sense to bake your own bread, or hang out your clothes (after all, someone might steal them) to dry. Also, it just may be more important to do other things--I'd rather buy books than clothes, for instance. Interesting thread.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), March 07, 2002.

The sad thing is that I am not even embarrassed about hanging out the white clothes, I just don't like to do it! This is something I am going to work on! I personally don't own anything that is white, but for some reason my 2 oldest girls have lots of socks and things that re white. Plus cleaning rags are bleached also. So it is all little stuff! The rest is just because I am squeamish, and I try not to spend much money. I know I can cut back on many things, and I am going to try harder. Thanks to all for great responses!

-- Melissa in SE Ohio (me@home.net), March 07, 2002.

I have a lot of times bought Brady underwear at a yard sale! Once I got him 18 pairs for 10 cents a pair, that looked like they had never been worn. I did wash them in hot bleach water and I think he is still wearing many of them. It was just too good of a deal to pass up.

My girls do pass shoes down to each other. Most of them are like new, so I don't worry about it too much. If they hurt their feet they would let me know I am sure!

-- Melissa in SE Ohio (me@home.net), March 07, 2002.

On bathing once a week! We have a pool, so in the summer the kids are in and out of it constantly. But I have to remind Brady to actually get a real bath, and wash his hair. His theory being that he has been wet, and it makes NO sense to get a bath and get wet again... Too funny!

-- Melissa in SE Ohio (me@home.net), March 07, 2002.

I also have never bought underwear/socks at a yard sale or thrift shop. Since it is inexpensive to purchase these on sale, especially for the children, that is what I have done.

I also dry my little items, socks, underwear on a clothes rack overnight in the bathroom.

We do use hand-me-downs in shoes amongst our own family and clothes as well. We do shop at thrift shops for most of our clothes, but rarely find coats or snow boots.

I rarely used cloth diapers, wish I had been more diligent in that area, when I think of all those years of disposable diapers $$$$

I have a hard time continuing to make my own homemade laundry detergent. We don't own a microwave or dishwasher and even with a large family, 8 at home now, don't find it overwhelming. "Many hands make light work"

I also would not want to serve the same item (such as oatmeal) every morning. I do not buy day old bread, but prefer to make my own.

My question is whether somethings that are maybe cheaper are not really a better deal in the long run, because of having to replace them so much sooner. For example: I always have bought my daughters Saltwater sandles in Navy blue. They are not cheap, but can be bought on sale. They will last at least 2 summers of two daughters and because they are a darker color always look clean and polished (unlike white) I use these for church/town from May to October.

I purchase denium jeans for my little boys at a store here called Shopko that will guarentee them not to tear,rip or wear out and will replace them completely free if they do for the same kind/same size. No time limit. That has saved me alone many $$ as boys love to put holes in the knees and fray the bottom of their jeans.

I have a sister that cuts corners by buying past the pull dates on much of her food and I would rather buy fewer items at a store and have better quality or even spend the time to make it from scratch rather than lets say, make cookies from a cake mix that came from the canned goods store.

I buy my spices by the pound through the coop and vacumn seal the exra in large mouth canning jars and so have no reason not to use them.

However, I love the challenge of learning how to be frugal.

-- Marie in Central WA (Mamafila@aol.com), March 08, 2002.

I like marie, like the challenge. I only buy clothes on clearance or yard sales , or sew them ( the latter being the first option.). I NEVER EVER buy pre-boxed foods, ( excluding my hubbies life long hobby of consuming a bag of potato chips once or twice a week. How can I complain, he is the breadwinner.) I bake my own bread, make my own soap, and can ( if neccesary ) my own toothpaste. I have spent much time researching which products work the best for the least amount of money. I do use the dryer in the winter, I have arthritis and cant take cold on my hands. My mother in law and I share our internet service, each paying 1/2. We carpool to the grocery store, and other shopping trips. ( My mother in law is a real blessing, buying things for the kids when they need them or homeschool supplies.). I search the stores in January ( thrift shops ) for sales on winter coats for the kids for the next winter. I save all the trimmings from veggies and leftover in a freezer bag in the freezer for soup. I save the peelings off potatoes for fried skins. I freezer single serving of leftovers for homeade t.v. dinners. I cant think of all the things I do, but I am doing somthing right, hubbies family thinks im nuts. Of course they are the ones with a -0- balance at the end of the month. LOL all the way to the bank. Kristean

-- Kristean Thompson (pigalena_babe@yahoo.com), March 08, 2002.

I never knew Shopko did that. That's a really good deal. One of my favorite sayings to my kids is 'stay off your knees' but of course it's kind of futile. One good thing out here is the weather is warm enough for shorts 10 months of the year so that's what they wear for playing most of the time. We don't have Shopko down here that I've seen but I used to go to one in Montana.

Speaking of bleach, do you all have a hard time finding regular plain bleach since they came out with the concentrated stuff? Last time I was at Target they didn't stock straight plain ammonia anymore either. The grocery store doesn't stock it either but Walmart still does for now.

-- Dave (multiplierx9@hotmail.com), March 08, 2002.

Melissa, I was going to ask this same question just about the time Lusenet went down.

I'm much like the rest of you. Splittting toilet paper is out. Altho most of the ideas in Tightwad Gazette at least bear some consideration, that one was one of the most ridiculous, time and energy wasting ideas I'd ever heard of. I think the value of frugal ideas really vary from person to person. Some things waste time saving pennies that would be better spent elsewhere making dollars. Just depends on your particular situation. The one clothing item I will not buy used is underwear. I do buy a lot of secondhand shirts and coats (and jeans if I can find them) for around home/barn. Then I can afford better quality good clothes for town/special occasions. When I find good sales on barn boots I buy several pair. Then I'm not forced to buy a pair at regular prices when the old ones suddenly spring leaks. I also keep a pair in the truck ONLY for wearing to other farms/ranches. With the livestock diseases around nowadays, no way will I set foot in my barns with boots that have been near other livestock. That has possibly saved me hundreds of $ in vet bills and lost livestock. I have no problem with buying second hand shoes for young children as they rarely get enough use to show any wear (run down heels, etc.). Shoes for older kids usually aren't worth buying. Sometimes you can find a new or like-new pair that someone bought and apparently never wore. I find really expensive name brand tennis shoes on occasion that are brand new.

When my kids were young I used cloth diapers except for one who apparently had allergies to them. Now, especially with all I have to do caring for animals and with my physical problems, I was glad to use all disposables for my granddaughter. I wouldn't want to spend the time/energy on washing cloth ones. When my kids were still at home I never bought paper towels, we always used rags. Now, I use rags for big messes, but paper towels for little things. It isn't worthwhile to run the washer for a tiny load and I don't like having smelly rags laying around till there's enough for a full load. However, I always use paper towels for washing/drying my goats udders before milking. Again, the risk of spreading disease is not worth any monetary savings. I don't use a clothesline at all anymore except for things like sheets, and airing out sleeping bags. I cannot raise both arms overhead at the same time...which makes hanging clothes on a line impossible. I do use a wooden clothes rack when I have small loads.

I reuse my vacuum cleaner bags once or twice. At the price they are now, that's a big savings! I won't wash out sandwich bags on a daily basis, but I will for a day or two if it saves me a trip to the store. I won't buy outdated food, but I'll buy it close to the pull date and freeze it. I have no problem buying at our local canned food store. They have a great selection and I never buy dented cans or low-quality stuff. Some of the odd brands and generic brands are better quality than the high priced brands in the grocery stores. One tip (from Tightwad Gazette?) that paid off for me is keeping a can opener and spoon in your car. If you find a food item you're not sure of, buy one can, go out to your car and try it out. If it's good, go back in and buy a case of it. I like to buy canned fruit by the case, but only want good quality. Our canned food store is about 30 minutes away, so this tip has saved me from getting stuck with a large quantity of food we don't like or wasting gas from having to make an extra trip back to the store after waiting to try the product out at home.

-- Lenette (kigervixen@webtv.net), March 09, 2002.

I love all the ideas as for things that go to far, we have a friend who limits himself to three squares of toilet paper every time he goes, he also has land holdings in several states and plenty of cash in his safe at home as he doesnt trust the bank. My amish grandmother would sew buttons on the inside of my brothers knees everytime she would come to stay at our house mom would remove them after she left. I don't buy or sell undergarments at garage sales but have been to many where people dig through these things and buy them. I also worked with disadvantaged families for many years hispanic families homes were always spotless, cold only turned the heat on when the kids were home. rarely had the extra things like microwaves etc. always cooked from scratch even if it was just lunch for the kids. usually had only one car mom rrarely worked outside the home the kids had very few toys it was amazing what they survived on for a month.

-- ronda (thejohnsons@localaccess.com), March 09, 2002.

I dunno. To me there's a difference betwen being frugal and cheap. Being frugal means shopping for the best buy, realizing the best buy isn't always the cheapest. "Settling" for the cheapest hasn't always served me well. Sometimes I screw myself up because I was trying to be "frugal" when I was only just being cheap and not biting the bullet and getting what I really needed rather than just making do with inferior products that don't hold up under wear.

-- john (natlivent@pcpros.net), March 09, 2002.

You are so right, John! There is a vast amount of difference between being frugal and being cheap. Frugal implies using your money to the best of your ability to get really good bargains and using it wisely. Cheap (IMHO) implies stingey, tightfisted, mean-spirited and miserly. Not qualities I want to have or examples I want to pass on.

I truly believe in being careful with my money but I'm not going to be cheap with my spending habits or anything else for that matter.

Wishing you enough.

-- Trevilians (Trevilians@attbi.net), March 10, 2002.

I won't eat bad food to save money - ie, I won't use shortening instead of olive oil, give up herbs and spices, or switch to really cheap ice cream for our occasional indulgences. That doens't mean I don't cook cheaply, I just won't sacrifice taste and quality for frugality. I won't wear used underwear. I won't give up toilet paper for corncobs.

-- Sharon in NY (astyk@brandeis.edu), March 13, 2002.

I think we're a little too frugal sometimes. My husband wears his socks until there's a hole in the heel. Then he turns it so the hole is on top, and keeps turning the sock until there are too many holes to wear it. After that, the sock gets cut into baby wipe rags. Then if there is anything left of it after being a rag, it's mulch.

We use old feed sacks for laundry bags, I hate them! They shred at the top, making it hard to put clothes in or out, you can't toiss something into one, and you can't see which clean laundry is in a bag without dumping it all out. Oh, I hate those bags...

I think there is a point when something saves money but not time, or causes such a hassle it isn't worth it, and if it detracts from important things in your life, like your health, it's gone too far. I'm beginning to feel that it isn't frugal to keep stuff if it gets in the way of having a neat and tidy house, because it takes your time away to deal with the stuff, and a messy house causes a lot of trouble.

On the other hand, as frugal as we are, I know we'd seem rich and wasteful to my distant cousins in the Phillipines. Americans are so priviliged, many, many people have never used toilet paper or even a toilet.

-- Rebekah (daniel1@itss.net), March 13, 2002.