Ok I have palpated every doe in my barn, 40 to be exact. All due at different times. I am still not doing it right. Now I know some of these girls are bred. I wish I had someone to show me how to do this but I dont. I have read and read and still dont know what I am doing. Can someone walk me through the process? [Baby step, preferably.] So then I decided to go ahead and put the does back in with the bucks. None of them were aggressive but werent willing either. So to me that would reinforce that they are bred. Imput Please.

-- tracy (murfette@stargate.net), February 01, 2002

Answers

I never wanted to go with test breeding. I am at a loss. Some of my does should have kindled 2 days ago [31 days] and still havent. They are using the nest box for a bathroom. I have tried feeling and swear that I can feel babies. So clean the box and start all over. Even tried putting one in with a buck, She was the one that layed in the corner. I will give them a couple of more days. I will admit. I thought this would be easy. Pat you warned me, but I feel I am doing everything right. Lights 16 hours a day, spotless cages, great feed, free choice hay, water 24/7, What am I doing wrong?????

-- tracy (murfette@stargate.net), February 02, 2002.

Tracy,Test mating is not a sure way either. Some times it works some times not. The way that I palpate is I hold the doe with my right hand and put her head under my left shoulder. When she is calm I slide my left hand under her belly. Squeeze gently but firm enough to feel what seems to be marbles in her stomach. Do not push up to high on her stomach. You can get a hold of the large intestine which also feels like little marbles. Be sure you have her on a flat stable service where it is comfortable for you. Practice is the key. If you are still not sure. Put a nest box in for each doe on the 28th day. Keep trying for a few days as the kits get larger it will get easier. Some you can find in the lower stomach some in the middle and some up high. Do not give up and good luck. Beat the habit. Eat more domestic rabbit. Rodger

-- Rodger Solt (rds48@msn.com), February 01, 2002.

Tracy; You should palpate between 10 to 14 days after breeding only, especially while you are learning. Before 10 days its real hard to feel, after 14 days, you could damage the fetuses if you squeeze to hard. The most important thing is that the doe is relaxed. If she is tense and holding her stomach muscles you won't be able to feel. some does carry them high, some carry them low. You just have to feel around till you find them. You will feel them with your finger tips, they will feel just like marbles about 3/4 to 1 inch apart. On trying to test breed, If the doe is bred, she will grunt, growl, whimper or some verble diss-approval of the buck. she will also act nervouse and try to stay away from the buck if she is pregnant. If she just goes to the corner and lays down and dosn't make a sound, she probably isn't. This too needs to be done about 12-14 days after she was bred.

-- Ricky Jenkins (rjsjrj@yahoo.com), February 01, 2002.

>On trying to test breed, If the doe is bred, she will grunt, growl, whimper or some verble diss-approval of the buck. she will also act nervouse and try to stay away from the buck if she is pregnant. If she just goes to the corner and lays down and dosn't make a sound, she probably isn't. This too needs to be done about 12-14 days after she was bred.<

... and be prepared for unexpected litters if you follow this advice! A pregnant doe CAN AND MAY willingly accept a buck, and which is the reason why we do NOT recommend "test breeding." In fact, 12 to 14 days after breeding would be the most DANGEROUS time to attempt to "test breed," as it can result in the doe carrying two separate litters at the same time, but due two weeks apart. Yes, I am speaking from experience, as well as relating the experience of several others to whom this has happened. One commercial grower stopped all test breeding because of "too many double litters!" With a double-horned uterus, a rabbit is quite capable of carrying two separate litters, as well as being impregnated twice. Please rethink this strategy if you use "test breeding."

Pat Lamar

-- Pat Lamar (fuzyfarm@3-cities.com), February 02, 2002.

Tracy, Keep trying I place the doe on a surface (with carpet) about waist high for me. I gently hold one hand over her neck and ears. With the other hand a gently reach her abdomen and push up while gently rolling my fingers. I am looking for grape size marbles. If you push up toward the spine you can sometimes then feel them. I wish I was closer to show you as it is easier to show then to type!! I usually palpate between 12-14 days. I have never had a doe injured palpating her. You need to be gentle, but don't be to light of a touch! Also I don't test breed, I find it unreliable. Some does will continue to accept bucks even if they are pregnant. Keep practicing on the palpation and if you ever get out to Eastern Washington I'll show you! Denise K.

-- Denise K. (Rabbitmom2@webbworks.com), February 03, 2002.

Okay, Tracy... I knew you'd be running into some problems sooner or later, and especially when it came to bred does due to deliver. Again, this is where those "figures on paper" will lie... even if a doe willingly breeds, it doesn't always mean that she actually conceived, or... even if she IS pregnant, she can actually choose to resorp the litter around day 16 instead of carrying them full term and delivering them! As a result, even palpating isn't a sure fire guarantee of pregnancy, but if one understands the causes of resorption, palpation can be confidently used.

Your problem, now, is that the does are running overdue, and you are pretty sure there are kits inside. Although somewhat rare, some does have gone as much as 38 days (35 days for a live litter). As I see it, you are doing nothing wrong other than failing to MOVE the soiled nest boxes to a new area inside the cage (instead of in their potty area, heheheh).

Now then... some of us will keep oxytocin on hand for helping with difficult deliveries and long overdue does. Not advisable to use unless the doe is WAY overdue and you are POSITIVE there are kits inside! Remember... "normal" gestation is 28 to 32 days, and there will always be exceptions. In over 21 years of raising rabbits, I have resorted to using oxytocin only two times.

"Normal" oxytocin for inducing labor can be induced with gentle massaging of the doe's belly for at least 10 minutes. Another method would be to allow a buck to mount her, but NOT to make contact. Then, sit back and wait.

Meanwhile, after re-reading my reply about the test breeding... it does sound like I came on a bit harsh. Sorry... I was rushing at the time as hubby was calling me out the door to attend my daughter's birthday party! My apologies to the person who posted about "test breeding."

> never wanted to go with test breeding. I am at a loss. Some of my does should have kindled 2 days ago [31 days] and still havent. They are using the nest box for a bathroom. I have tried feeling and swear that I can feel babies. So clean the box and start all over. Even tried putting one in with a buck, She was the one that layed in the corner. I will give them a couple of more days. I will admit. I thought this would be easy. Pat you warned me, but I feel I am doing everything right. Lights 16 hours a day, spotless cages, great feed, free choice hay, water 24/7, What am I doing wrong?????

-- Pat Lamar (fuzyfarm@3-cities.com), February 03, 2002.

Does using nestboxes at 35 days gestation are indicating they are non- pregnant. Remove the boxes, tip the does over, and check their vulvas. If nice and pink, or even red, rush them to the bucks ASAP.Then start over. According to some rabbit scientists, the 2 days a breeder should never attempt palpation are days 13 and 23 after ovulation. (Anytime within 24 hours after being bred.) Major hormonal changes take place then. European breeders palpate on day 11; instead of feeling for marbles, they feel for a certain fulness in the lower abdomen. (The uterine horns haven't separated enough for the "marbles " to be felt.) It's apparently easier to feel a bellyful than a marble.:-) Sandra

-- Sandra Peake (speake@keremeos.net), February 20, 2002.

Tracy, how did the does come out?

-- Terri (hooperterri@prodigy.net), March 02, 2002.