Has anybody listened to Tegan and Sara? I'm pop culture illiterate, so maybe everybody heard of them months before, but I just started listening to them, and I must say I love them. They remind me of Ani back when I used to love her.

But I have no idea what they're talking about. These lyrics make absolutely no sense to me.

"if I gave you my number would it still be the same if I saved you from drowning promise me you'll never go away promise me you'll always stay closed down the last local zoo I'm gonna win the endless war over who kills the last koala bear and who in death will love him more"

I love the song. I sing along at the top of my lungs. But what is she talking about? I think I get the gist: she really likes a friend, and is afraid about making it more. But what's up with the koala and the new shoes? I don't get it.

"stand up sit down baby gonna be a formal dress down hey day we decide why not go downtown how about you and me we go get wasted"

Er, a formal dress down, ... what? Can anybody explain these things to me? Apparently I just don't get "canadian identical twin lesbian folk singers".

Then again, I'm probably just clueless. I'm still trying to figure out if Lucinda's "Changed the locks" is about a somebody she's hooked on or somebody she's trying to avoid.

-- Anonymous, October 29, 2001

Answers

Fred, I got no help for you on Tegan & Sara, whose names I'd never heard till this moment.

And also, I am also with you on "Changed the Locks." Self-preservation or stalker prevention? anyone? Y'all know I am no good with Lucinda.

-- Anonymous, October 29, 2001

PG, you gotta get down with Lucinda, now. I sort of love you, without knowing you, and it disappoints me when you are not in tune with Lucinda.

"Changed the Locks" is about a woman who has HAD IT with her lover and is trying to make a big statement about how she will never let him back in to anything in her life, because he's an ass. You know you're really done with somebody when you "change the name of this town." I mean, you may not be over them yet, but you're done with them, because clearly they never understood you and now you're finally realizing it and you've got to make sure they're not going to creep back into your world again, because they fuck it up when they get there.

Take it to the bank, people.

-- Anonymous, October 30, 2001

"You can't say those things to me that make me fall down on my knees." "And you can't knock me off of my feet." "And you can't hear my laugh." "And you can't make me want you more."

You see where I'm having trouble? These all sound like good things to me. It's probably my history, but I like it better when I read it the other way.

Lucinda's completely in love/infatuated with this boy, to the point where she can't help herself, and wishes that she could change this world in order to get control back. She doesn't really want to escape it, which is why she starts wishing bigger and more impossible things.

You're probably right, Al, but I like my version better.

-- Anonymous, October 30, 2001

Fred, I'm sorry, your Lucinda interpretation is just wrong. This isn't high school English class where the teacher says that there aren't any "wrong" answers, even though she knows there are but she wants a little class participation action.

This is like grad school, were the slightest misstep in analyzing "The Wasteland" will get your fellowship yanked quicker than a exhibitionist doing a striptease.

And the original qustion? I think it's just a couple of pretentious little kids who have read way too much poetry and think that if you string words together in a nonsensical way it makes you "deep" and an "intellectual."

Man, I'm raging today.

-- Anonymous, October 30, 2001

This is OT, I know, but -

PG, you gotta get down with Lucinda, now

Allison, I am hurting. I know how my lack of Lucinda love is a personality deficiency. Why does she have to sing so right? Why does she have to reach inside and twist me all up? Maybe if she wasn't as good, I could get behind her. I'll try harder.

Though I must confess that in a drunken episode, I think I told Omar that I would get Lucinda to Austin for the weekend of JournalCon if Austin wins the bid.

-- Anonymous, October 30, 2001

Man, the MOC makes me laugh.

Fred, I see what you're saying. But you can't have it that way, because it ain't right. She's saying he can't do all those things anymore because she is through with him. THA-ROO. She's had it up to here, if you know what I mean, and even though it is the most bittersweet thing ever, because she wants him more than she loves him, she's got to give him the elbow. He's out. He can't come around anymore because she hates to love him thus, hates him.

I know what I'm talking about, Fred my man. You know I do.

-- Anonymous, October 30, 2001

even though it is the most bittersweet thing ever, because she wants him more than she loves him, she's got to give him the elbow. He's out. He can't come around anymore because she hates to love him thus, hates him.

Yes. It's so tragic it's beautiful. She loves him but she can't be with him because he makes her CRAZY. Cah-razy. But she loves him anyway and hte only way to escape him is to "change the tracks underneath the train." I know you feel it Fred.

The other song that I love because it's so fucked up, much like myself, is Ryan Adams' "Come Pick Me Up."

"Come pick me up/take me out/ fuck me up/steal my records/screw all my friends, they're all full of shit/ with a smile on your face/ and then do it again/I wish you would"

I mean, what kind of sick love is that, people?

-- Anonymous, October 30, 2001

Y'all, sick love is sad. Don't have sick love, people. Life is too short. Because we all know when we're in sick love, and we all know when it's time to change the locks, but when people don't, it's just the saddest thing.

So no sick love. Okay?

-- Anonymous, October 30, 2001

I just have to say, after DLing the Lucinda Williams song, I got Allison's interpretation right away. definitely want, but don't need so therefore getting rid of 'em.

as for sick love...yeah. don't want none of that! right now, I've got confused love, so it's a step down maybe.

-- Anonymous, October 31, 2001

I'm going to concede defeat on the Lucinda question. Obviously the majority thinks that he's an ass and she's cutting him free. But back to part 2: Has anybody checked out T&S? Hard to understand lyrics aside, I love their sound. I don't want to buy Mr. Cheese's pretentious teenager explanation. And whatever the case, I sing along, and the music makes me happy, and that's what really matters.

-- Anonymous, October 31, 2001

See, Fred, I have to agree with the MOC on this one, and not just because I adore his snazzy new 'do.

I went to college with a lot of Tegan & Sara's. In Atlanta, at least, Tegan & Sara's are a dime a dozen. Maybe I'm Tegan & Sara jaded, but I think that as far as lesbian folk singer duos go, the Indigo Girls do a mighty fine job of filling the genre, and even when they were just starting out at Trackside Tavern way back in the day, their lyrics made sense and were a lot more than koala-killing, pseudo-intellectual nonsense.

And you're right, what matters is that you love their sound. But in terms of their lyric-writing abilities, it would appear that they're lacking, and like Natalie Merchant did a decade ago, their writing skills will hopefully mature with age.

(Although, Natalie Merchant is a bad example, because even in her "Secrets of the I Ching" days, her lyrics made complete sense, and more importantly, they read well as poems. So I guess that it wasn't Natalie's writing skills that matured, but rather, her political viewpoints.)

-- Anonymous, October 31, 2001

I have not heard the T&S people, but I will check them out.

I am a major-league Indigo Girls devotee, but I tire of their political posturing, even though I agree fairly often with their actual politics.

-- Anonymous, October 31, 2001

My dad always refers to the Indigo Girls as "those millionaire lesbians."

-- Anonymous, October 31, 2001

My dad always refers to the Indigo Girls as "those millionaire lesbians."

I wish I was a millionaire lesbian.

-- Anonymous, October 31, 2001

In response to your question on Tegan and Sara:

According to Tegan, she wrote My Number when a guy friend had a crush on her and she apparently did not handle the situation very well.

The other song, the First, was also written by Tegan and it refers to when their house was robbed and she walked in on the robber.

I've been a fan for about a year and I've read all their lyrics and in my opinion, some artists have lyrics that make absolutely no sense to us, but it probably means something to them. I just enjoy the music anyways.

-- Anonymous, December 29, 2001

The other song that I love because it's so fucked up, much like myself, is Ryan Adams' "Come Pick Me Up."

"Come pick me up/take me out/ fuck me up/steal my records/screw all my friends, they're all full of shit/ with a smile on your face/ and then do it again/I wish you would"

And now I, too, love this Ryan Adams song. I was one of the lucky recipients of Hannah's mix CD and the sad, sick truths in this song are splendid and so, so relatable.

-- Anonymous, December 31, 2001

as far as lesbian folk singer duos go, the Indigo Girls do a mighty fine job of filling the genre, and even when they were just starting out at Trackside Tavern way back in the day, their lyrics made sense and were a lot more than koala-killing, pseudo- intellectual nonsense.

T, I adore you. Truly. I want to take that and get it photocopied onto quarters of pages and pass it out on corners for people so they can all laugh like I did.

Of course, me having a gun and demanding that they laugh might make it difficult for them to laugh just like I did, but they will try, goddammit.

-- Anonymous, December 31, 2001

please don't anyone take this the wrong way, but i think your labeling of tegan & sara as just another teen lesbian folk act is so redundant and unoriginal.. it's like a copout instead of actually analyzing their work. maybe i'm bias because i just saw them live on saturday night and they blew me away, but i wasn't always a fan and i'm not easily impressed.

my poetry usually doesn't make sense to anyone but me and the people who are close to me. songs are like vague impressions of happenings in our lives and sometimes what seems to be nonsense and pretention is just an extended inside-joke.

i'm kinda just sick of hearing people bad-mouth teenage songwriters like they're all the same and none of them know what they're talking about. envy can be so obvious sometimes! but hey, on the other side of things, if i had an album under my belt and i was 21 and touring north america, i guess i wouldn't really give a damn about what anybody thought of me, as long as i was enjoying myself, which i know tegan & sara are. and P.S. i spoke to them and they're the least pretentious people ever.. they're hilarious and witty and they even mock themselves and their songs on stage, so yeah - there's my 2 cents.

-- Anonymous, January 21, 2002

I agree with some of your comments. It was unfair of some of the readers to jump to conclusions about T&S ("a couple of pretentious little kids", "Tegan & Sara's are a dime a dozen") without actually listening to the songs.

And I deserve a lot of the blame for this. I was under the impression that everybody in the world had listened to them but me, since I'm usually pretty late on the take, and I brought up some of their more obscure lyrics. I was also the first to label them as teen lesbian folk singers, quoting the amazon.com summary of their album.

While I still don't get the koala bear thing, I do actually understand the rest of those two songs (hell, "My Number" is about dishing out the sick love, folks, it's a perspective you don't often hear), and I would not describe it as teenage angst or pseudo- intellectual drivel. While they can be obscure, this doesn't necessarily mean that they're 'trying too hard' or being pretentious teenagers.

I'm quite jealous that you got to see them in concert. I'd really like to, but it seems that touring North America actually means a bunch of venues in British Columbia, which is a bit far for me to travel.

i'm kinda just sick of hearing people bad-mouth teenage songwriters like they're all the same and none of them know what they're talking about. envy can be so obvious sometimes!

And I'm betting you're a teenager.

Teen angst is now, and has always been, a part of growing up. A lot of teenagers write poetry, and it's usually about the same thing: "Why people don't understand me." Analysis of why this happens in our society aside, it leads to a lot of bad poetry and bad songs. Many of us in our mid-20's or later were actually author's of the bad poetry not so long ago, and have a clear retrospective look at it.

The fact remains: Most teenage authors have a lot of growing up to do, mentally, emotionally, and stylistically. It's not an unfair stereotype, until you believe that no teenager can write a good poem or song.

-- Anonymous, January 21, 2002

Well...I was just reading through some of the comments on this page...and I have a couple things to add to the Tegan and Sara comments.

As for the lyrics...the fact that lyrics are hard to understand does not in any way undermine the value of a musical act. Just one example...Phish, who has a huge following, also has some of the most incomprehensible lyrics I've ever heard...And also, most of Tegan and Sara's lyrics are actually not that hard to analyze. You just chose to talk about the song "My Number," which has a couple of really weird lines. The vast majority of their songs, which I'm sure most of you have never heard, are nothing like that song. That's like basing your opinion of Bruce Springsteen on the song "Born in the USA," or pigeonholing Dave Matthews based on the song "Ants Marching." Its just a really bad way to debate...if you're going to make negative comments, go ahead, but at least listen to a variety of the music before you do.

In response to the comments made about their adolescent attempts at being intellectuals....I don't even know what to say except that maybe a "musician" like Britney Spears is better? I personally think we should encourage young people to be creative and stand up for what they believe in, which is exactly what Tegan and Sara are doing. Is that not a step in the right direction?

As far as the fact that they are a lesbian folk duo. For you to even compare them to the Indigo Girls is really kind of funny. Yes, the Indigo Girls are great at what they do, but it is also a completely different style of music. Not to add the fact that Tegan and Sara have a much different audience. Yet the most important point I'm trying to make here is that its really....stupid, for lack of a better word, to categorize like that. Why does the fact that they're lesbians have anything to do with anything? Stereotyping....*sigh*

Oh yeah...yes I'm a teenager.

-- Anonymous, February 16, 2002

Yes, the Indigo Girls are great at what they do, but it is also a completely different style of music

*cough* *choke* *sputter*

Different styles in the way that Stone Temple Pilots and Pearl Jam have "really different sounds"? Sorry, but I've listened to a lot of T&S, and the analogy to Indigo Girls is fair and accurate. Both groups are heavily dependent on the acoustic guitar, they both take their roots in folk, they both have female leads, and they're both generally political.

the fact that lyrics are hard to understand does not in any way undermine the value of a musical act.

This is an arguable point. I'd say that, if you're trying to send a message through your work, it's best that it be comprehensible to at least some of your audience.

But you're also 100% correct. I chose lyrics that I found particularly hard to follow, from a song that is apparently one of their most popular. I could have easily chosen lyrics that more people would understand, but I was under the (mistaken) impression that I was (as usually) way behind the times, and that a lot of other people had heard of them. Even in "The first", we can quote, "They go from Kindergarten to killing sprees". For a song that's inspired by her house getting robbed, the song makes a pretty clear statement about how much times have changed since they've grown up, and how hard it is for grownups to understand. I misled the folks on this forum to think that they were just speaking gibberish, but I was really looking for some explanation on those parts of the lyrics that I just was not able to understand.

I'm really having a hard time with your argument. It's unfair to categorize music? Yes, the fact that they're lesbians has nothing to do with anything, but the only reason it was brought up was because it was in the editorial review on Amazon.

And they have an "entirely different audience" than the Indigo Girls? I haven't been to their concert, but I'm betting their audience is predominantly female college students, with a disproportionate number of lesbians in the crowd. And I bet this is a pretty fair comparison to the average indigo girls, ani difranco, or even jewel crowd, except they probably have more canadians.

-- Anonymous, February 17, 2002

Well...I hate to keep arguing over this, but I think I have a couple relevant things to say in response to your post.

As for T&S having a different style than the Indigo Girls, it seems your definition of the term style is different from mine. Yes, their style has a lot to do with their use of acoustic guitars and their folk roots. And yes, they both have female leads. However, their music is not mostly political, or at least they say it isn't. I'm sure it could be misconstrued that way, but I've read many interviews with them, and they don't consider it to be very political.

Some interesting differences between them and the Indigo Girls is the fact that they are very young, especially in comparison to many artists of this genre. They therefore have a younger audience. Also, in my opinion, IG has a slight country influence, whereas T&S are probably a lot more punk. I have also read this in numerous articles about both groups. Also, traditionally style has a lot to do with the way an artist (or artists, in this case) presents herself. Look at some pictures, because in that sense their style is completely different. Furthermore, as a gay female college student (you did peg that pretty well), you would find me at a Tegan and Sara concert and an Ani Difranco concert, but definately not an Indigo Girls concert. They are very talented, but although I don't speak for all listeners like me, that's not the kind of crowd I would be drawn to. There is a distinct stylistic difference, but maybe you have to be more submerged in the culture you're referring to to understand that.

On the point of lyrics....the message is comprehensible to listeners...at least it is to me. From one song, Divided, that is not on "This Business of Art": "Go downtown, catch an early movie. The shows are cheaper, they don't mind if you put your feet up. She's out on the highway, and she's got a homemade sign that says 'go ahead try to figure out what my future looks like.' I don't want to live my life like a story, I was thinking I could've been something. Don't run along side and control me. Just found my way, now let me be." To me, this sends a very clear message....maybe more targeted to my age range, but definately not immature.

It is very easy to categorize every lesbian folk act as sounding the same. I find it much more fulfilling to listen to each and consider them each their own entity, just as I would do with a straight male classic rock group. There are differences between Ani, T&S, the Indigo Girls, Melissa Ferrick...all of them. You just have to be more specific than naming their types of instruments, genders, and sexualities in order to find those differences.

-- Anonymous, February 18, 2002

I wish I was a millionaire lesbian.

You mean, you wish you were a millionaire lesbian.

:-)

-- Anonymous, April 09, 2002

I love T&S! I live an hour away from them, but have yet to see them live. Sara an I have actually emailed eachother a few times. A lot of people I know who have emailed them haven't got a response, but I've actually had a few decent email conversations with Sara.

The fact that they actually interact with their fans is very cool. I've read so many articles about T&S trying to be Ani DiFranco, but I don't really see it. I'm a huge Ani fan, and have seen my fair share of Ani concerts. And I just don't see it.

When performing live, T&S go on stage alone, with only their guitars. So concerts with them are really personal. They tell a lot of great stories (while Ani DID, too. But doesn't seem to anymore. And if she does, they're very short), and they're always really personal, and funny, and long.

Personally, I love T&S. I love their raw and rough sound, but also their very sensitive sound at the same time. While I'll admit that they have some growing up to do, and their lyrics will obviously mature over time.., I'm only 16! So I can relate somewhat to the anger they express.

-- Anonymous, May 07, 2002

"When it's all said and done, I'm still gonna be a girl, I'm still gonna be young, and I'm still gonna be a twin...people are either gonna like the music or not." -- Tegan Quin

Two girls with attitude and fierce independence -- such is Vapor Records' newest recording artists, Tegan and Sara, who will soon release their debut album, This Business of Art. Hailing from Canada, Tegan and Sara are one of the most appealing live acts to hit the stage. Armed with acoustic guitars and two distinctly different voices, they deliver music that is rhythmic, melodic, and powerful. On stage, they are charming and charismatic, exchanging rapid-fire banter with each other and the audience in-between songs that thrill with both their musicality and delivery. This Business of Art captures all of this and more.

At a time when people are beginning to feel that almost everything has been said and done before, Tegan and Sara are refreshingly wise without seeming jaded or weary. As the title suggests, the album is a portrait of complexities. Tegan and Sara's lyrics are simultaneously smart and full of youthful naivete, while the music ranges from fast and furious to tastefully understated. This Business of Art was recorded in two weeks, and it builds upon a skeleton of driving but spare instrumentation, with additional drums, bass, and creative effects that provide fullness and maturity to the duo's emerging sound.

This article was pretty old, but it basically sums up the girls quite well!

-- Anonymous, May 07, 2002

Ah, yes! Tegan and Sara. I was introduced to their music over a year ago, and I loved it from the beginning. You can debate all you want about what style they have, or who their audience is (said the bisexual high school senior) but the point is, do ya like the music, or not? I have "This Business of Art" in my car, right along with some Ben Harper, Ani Difranco, Dream Theater, Holcombe Waller (whom I VERY HIGHLY recommend), Tonic, Tori Amos, and Live. Personally, I think music is music is music is music, and who cares as long as it speaks to you somehow. And now, I will step off my soapbox....

-- Anonymous, May 18, 2002

I'm 17, and i've been playing guitar and writing songs for 7 years now. Tegan and Sara are the most influential and inspiring singer/songwriters out there today. I get so sick of the typical pop stripper that you see everytime you turn on the TV...

and by the way...I don't think that good song lyrics should be straight out...i think that they should be mysterious so that the listener can do what he/she wants with the meanings...that's how good song lyrics help many people in many situations.

i love tegan and sara, and i hope that they will be listened to and respected by more people in the future...because they deserve it.

-- Anonymous, July 14, 2002

In all honesty, Tegan and Sara are fairly independent. I find that in todays market, thats what sells. Everytime someone tries something new...it's either thrown against a brick wall...or its ravished. Tegan and Sara are somewhere in between. That doesnt mean that they are the all powerful band. Rather, they admit to being normal. They wont lip-sync. They are honest about their sexual preference, rather than saving it for later publicity. They're private about their sex lives. They make music that has charm, seduction, and is raw enough to inspire even those without the notion to perform. That is talent. And they're seemingly down to earth. So they're young. Who isn't? So you dont understand the lyrics? Maybe you weren't meant to understand...just let them flow. Be. Live the caberet, mon dieu!

-- Anonymous, July 22, 2002

Okay, I can't read anymore, Tegan & Sara are amazing. I've been a fan for over a year now. I have listened to almost EVERY song be it unreleased, live and radio/cd versions. I've heard almost every live story, and they're hilarious! The point is that whocares if they are lesbian twins, that is just something for newbies to label them as. Listen to their music, it has inspiring lyrics such as those in 'Proud' 'freedom' and 'the first' There is an intensifing energy that is released. Tegan & Sara are more than young lesbian twins from canada, I'm not going to say that they sound nothing like ani or the indigo girls, but it doesn't mean that i am classifying as the same either. They have a different guitar sound than ani, ani mostly picks, she is an amazing guitarist, tegan and sara mostly strum, with one occasionally playing lead...why does this matter? What else do you want artists to do with a guitar to make it sound original? The point is is that they are individuals, everyone has a sound of their own, and only an open minded person can find that. Its like comparing dave matthews to the hip. Theres a noticable difference if you open your mind and listen to more than 1 song. Tegan & Sara have an outgoing personality, they are awesome with their fans, they are in control of what they do, they do what they want, they have fun doing it, and they do it well! How can that be wrong, isn't that what we all want to be able to do. I see them going far. You gotta start somewhere and these girls have been in bands since they were 8. They have lyrics and stories that ppl can relate to. They aren't into breast enlargements just so they'll sell more concert tickets. They have a broad range of an audience unlike take for example Britany Spears. They are deep and ppl crave it. They are one on one with their audience, they want to get to know them, who they are and i am incredibly jealous for everyone who has gotten to see them live! They are so down to earth, and so 'ok' with who they are, and what they've been through. We need more artists like Tegan & Sara. They hit home. thats all...

-- Anonymous, August 24, 2002