Was Mr Warren "I'm a really nice bloke" Barton was the worst player on the pitch yesterday?

Can anyone defend him after that?

He has one decent game in four, where as Andy Griffin has impressed virtually every time he has worn a black and white shirt.

We would have been better off playing yesterday with 10 men. Think about it , we realy would.

If Barton continues to play at right back, or anywhere on the pitch, then we'll continue to be a shite team. He is the weakest link and should say Goodbye to NUFC. I'm franky thinking about giving my season tickets away rather than watch a team struggle again this season with him in it.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Answers

Barton was no better or worse than any other of our players on the pitch for a change.....yes he was at fault for one of the goals but even if he hadn't made that mistake we would've still been beaten...

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

He didn't do anything positive in the game and his defending was appauling backing off all the time. On the Verdict thread someone gave him a 4/10 whhich was over generous. I'm not saying the rest were much better, just that the rest usually perform better , and the likes of Robert and Solano may have had an excuse to their poor performances namely Illness and deportation worries.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

I can only presume that Griffin was injured yesterday, or he should have played. And if he was injured then what about using Steve Calwell, Garry Caldwell, Ryan McGuffie or Oliver Bernard as a right back. All of those players ARE better than Barton.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Lua Lua would be a better right back than that arse.

I've said all along he is a waste of space. Rik is totally right saying that we would be better off with 10 men.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

The former Wimbledon star was recalled to the starting line-up for the depressing 3-0 defeat at West Ham yesterday, replacing Andy Griffin despite the latter's impressive shackling of Ryan Giggs in the win over Manchester United last week. But Barton, who has already spoken of his disappointment this season after being booed in the 4-4 Intertoto Cup draw at home to FC Troyes, failed to match the level of that performance. Barton was at fault for the Hammers' second goal when he allowed space inside the area for the Italian magician Paolo di Canio to drill home inside the far post. But Robson insists he himself should take the blame for asking Barton to play on despite an injury, and he said: "We were a bit unfortunate because Barton was injured at half-time and I sent him out to see how he would cope with it. "But he got exposed on a cross-field pass against di Canio. In a one-on-one situation, he was unfit and di Canio was at him like a dog with a bone."

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Barton was terrible yesterday - directly at fault for the second goal and, by squandering possesion when under no pressure, indirectly responsible for the first. However poor Barton was though, Solano was far, far worse. This is disappointing as on his day he can be a match winner. On an off day however he is anonymous - in spite of his obvious limitations at least Barton offers commitment and effort.

I will be disappointed if BR doesn't make changes against Leicester. Too many players are regulars regardless of their current form and this to me just seems to encourage the attitude that mediocrity and lack of effort will be tolerated. A spell on the bench for some of the high profile under-performers will at least focus minds on the problems.

We seriously need to look at other options at right back. If fit then Griffin deserves an extended run in the team; on the basis of his limited appearances so far I rate him far more highly than Barton anyway. If Griffin isn't fit then Hughes or O'Brien could surely do no worse than Barton at present. Solano's performances this season have mostly been sub-standard and he also deserves to be dropped. We are more limited here as until KD is fit there is no obvious replacement. Ideas anyone???

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

We could always stick with what we have but get the oppositionn to play the way manure did, rather than the way wham did. :-))

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

The 'who for Nobby' question depends on how you want to play. On yesterday's performace Lua2 wouldn't have been any worse, and may have moved forward in the eductaion process. He could not have been worse as Solano offered nothing at all.

We didn't play well with only a right winger lasy year but there is the option of playing without one at all. Bellamy is so tireless that maybe he could be asked to do exactly the Gallacher role and let Shola and Shearer play together. Bellamy would be told to tend to be a right side player but with freedom to be whereever he really wants. We may be limiting our options on the right, but with Griffin there this may not be as much of an issue.

I don't have any feel for where he is best, but Bernard looked to have the energy/zip that our midfield was clearly missing yesterday. Maybe he's an option, dunno.

Ho hum

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Sellalena asks for ideas, okay, means changing the formation tho -

xxxxxxxxxx A back three of O.Brian, Dabias , Distin xxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxx cover in all positions by Hughes, Caldwell , Elliotxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxx wing backs (first choice, Bellamy (r), Bernard (l)

xxxxxxxxxx cover by Barton(r) aaaaaggghh and Elliot once morexx

xxxxxxxxx midfield ? xxxx Dyer/Solano , Robertxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Shearer plus one. so we are looking at

Given

O`Brian Dabs Distin

Bellamy Bernard

Solano/ Dyer, ????? Robert

Shearer/Cort ,Amoebi ,

still looking for that central midfielder, I am sure we would get a lot of good from Bellamy and Bernard down the flanks , not sure of the back three , Distin might instil calmness, as yet unknown , might get more involvement and creativity of f Robert by pushing him inside , With what`s availible if Bobby thinks he can play two lines of 4 he is mistaken, we need the advantage of maybe getting 5 into midfield areas . a lot depends on Bellamy/Bernard in this system , young ,fit enthusiastic , give it a go Bob,

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Buff , we've tried 3 at the back. The players don't like it/ too thick to understand the system. We were unbeaten for quite sometime playing 4 - 4 - 2. I think we should stick with it, but give some of the younger players a chance.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

We should not under any circumstances mess around with Craig Bellamy. He is without doubt our best player right now - provides 90% of all movement between defence and attack - and must be allowed to continue doing exactly what he has been - causing havoc to opposition defences. He is fairly lightweight, cannot tackle, and imo could be a liability at RWB. Is he not left-footed anyway?.

In addition, as was proven last season, his confidence is a fairly fragile commodity, and to even risk ruining it by playing him out of position would be sheer madness. On that basis it is probably under serious consideration!

We have a potential England RB in Andy Griffin - PLAY HIM ffs!

Solano has been generally hopeless so far this season. However, we also have a potentially good understudy for Solano in Diego Gavilan. Give him a chance!

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Whoops forgot Griffin., I know Rik , but you look at whats availible and plan accordingly, and when did players get a say , in formations, etc, never in any of my teams , might be diplomatic and ask a guy what he thinks , kidolgy thats all, certain players will not like it cos they can see themselves being axed, "Oh by the way Woz I`m going three at the back , six center backs to pick from , you will lucky to get in as a wing back", Seniors pros clique meet, give it a go Boss gotta say the boy`s are not happy about it". So what we have are two orthdox full backs who cannot defend, cannot pass, do not pose any threat whatsoever to the oppossition playing behind a midfield who need 5 in their just to survive. Give me strength please.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

I am always wittering on about our midfield being most of the problem with our defence. I still think they are part of the problem as the lads at the back don't get enough protection. However, I used to think the lads at the back were OK-ish. Now I think they make most of their own problems, partly because of their awful positional sense and partly because not one of them can command the area. Dabs is presumably supposed to be the senior CH and the job of organising the defence should really fall to him, with input from Given: this doesn't happen and, more often than not, the junior CH is left trying to deal with whatever shit hits the fan while Dabs is making one of his famous runs forward. Don't get me wrong, Dabs would be great with a World Class defender beside him, but, then, I think O'Brien, Hughes and Steve Caldwell would be much better if they had a World Class centre half beside them. We have two many "second" central defenders. I'm not criticising Given either, but he IS just a shot stopper. This may be a false memory, but didn't we go months in Bobby's first season without conceding a goal from a setpiece when Steve Harper was No.1? In terms of fullbacks, on present form, Bernard or Hughes have to be better options for left back than Elliott and I don't think there can be any question that Griff deserves a run at right back. Bobby obviously thinks so as he is justifying his selection of right back yesterday. IMHO, we should have bought either Southgate or Ekioghu when they became available. Easy to be wise after the event, I guess.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

The other thing is that Bobby is talking out of his arse when he talks about sharing the burden. Before the start of the InterToto, he spoke of how Hughesie had to play too much football last season and had had no real summer holiday. So what did Bobby do in an attempt to get him back to his form of the first half of last season? Rest him because we had Andy O'Brien and Steve Caldwell waiting in the wings? No, he played him in every single game we played 'til he got injured. Does this sound like a manager who is intent on load sharing?

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

YOu might be on to one small part of the problem, Dougal. I haven't seen enough matches in person to judge fairly, so maybe some of you regulars might have noticed this. From what I've seen of Given and Harper, or rather heard, Harper does seem the more vocal of the 2. Even in training, Harper is shouting at the lads, at times even when play is down at Given's goal. "No free headers" being one of his most common calls. Maybe that's the problem....Harper may not be speaking a form of English the average footballer can understand? ;-)

Still, if that were our only problem it would be simple enough to solve. First we need the right players in the right positions. Back to the old broken record of 1 strong centre half, and 1 strong central midfielder. *sigh*

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Maybe he meant load-sharing in the treatment room? Can't have too many in there at one time...or too few.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

I think Given's been pretty unconvincing this season -good shot stopper, but very little elase. Yesterday he did quite a bit of flapping at crosses - I remember him totally missing one in particular. He also is scared stiff of releasing the ball quickly since his experience with Dion Dublin. I don't this he commands the area or inspires confidence in the defence, but he'd probably say the same thing about them.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Most of us here have been very critical of Barton, and you can presume that he'll get plenty more from the press, other websites, radio phone in shows etc.

There must come a point when BR, realises that Barton isn't a popular player, and although he's stood up and defended his senior players in the past, enough is enough. He surely can't be picked again.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Do you think Barton would be as bad in a Neville/Beckham type right side combo ? Alternatively, do you think Neville would be better than Barton in a Solano/Barton type combo ?

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Snr Barthino is either brilliant (which he has been in more than one recent game), or utter pants...which those in East London have mostly testified.

I was disappointed not to see Griffin start, let alone not to even make a subs bench appearance (all the more telling when Warren went off). He's got to be given a chance to prove himself

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Solano is a poor man's Beckham, despite what ever Opta would have us try and belive

Barton is a poorer man's Gary Neville. Gary Neville is like Lee Dixon and probably David Craig for those old enough. He does nothing in a game but defend, makes no pretext of being able to attack, recognises he doesn't need to as he has class in front of him, despite recognising his own limitations he'll go and be supportive but you 'll never see him overlap if there's no cover, his primary directive is to defend and let Beckham play.

Barton can't defend, can't pass, can't centre, can't overlap. Waht can he do ? Well he backs off well these days.

Three centre halves demands three fast and intelligent centre halves. We have two with pace in Hughes and Distin, we have maybe two with intelligence in Hughes and O'Brien, (dunno about Distin yet). Not sure this is enough, if we'd added in Repka then we'd be flying, like bubbles.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

I'm not a Barton apologist. But there has to be an element of collective responsibility. "Lightweight" midfield with no "holding" player (except Lee on a good day) - extra pressure on back four. No "defending as a unit" i.e. cover from centre halves - full backs often exposed. With any number of other contributing factors and any any combination of the above.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Yes you're right the midfield neihter supported the defence nor the attack yesterday, hopeless the lot of them. Barton was isolated by Solano not being around to help. It doesn't make any difference to Barton's performance though.

A month ago he played superbly against Chelsea, he has shown subsequently (and previously) that that was the exception rather than the rule.

I'd guess the Barton abuse today matches the Kilbane abuse on the Sunlun boards. They probably need to play against each other to look good.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

Griffin has to come on for Barton permanently, I don't see where the problem lies.

If Solano has passport troubles, then bring in Gavilan - surely even our "top players" like Solano should be prepared to fight for their place?

Gavilan has shown good loyalty, we never hear him whinging about never getting a chance, he just plays on in the reserves.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

However, I think it is unfair just to criticise Barton, as the rest didn't exactly inspire him to greatness.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

It's not just one problem but a combination of many. The m/f were sh!te yesterday and gave the defence no cover. We have no defender (except possibly Barton) who shouts his gob off every match. We haven't had one since Psycho left. That could be a commanding goalie (neither Harper nor Given are that) or a CH like MacNamee or McGrath (or Charlie Hurley doon the road). More recently like Stam or Adams. But we've had nowt. FFS, even Dougal shouts more then they do.

We also seem to lack the ability to release a quick ball, so that when we eventually do, it invariably gets hoofed up and sent straight back, putting yet more pressure on the defence. Even LKD seems to dwell on the ball (aging memory mind) preferring to do it all himself rather than release an early ball.

Can't be sure it will be any better on Wednesday, but if I can see it, why can't YBR? Or if he can, why can't he do something about it?

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001

The thing is Screacher, on Saturday, we didn't dwell on the ball, we outpassed the best team in the land.

The same group of players, bar a right back, then failed to outpass a supposed relegation candidate.

They have shown that they can do it, but doing it week in week out seems to be the problem. If we play a system that beats Man Utd, why not play it every week against any team, regardless of their ability.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2001