Saw a streamer with news about the U.S. has or is going to pass a bill for the people to buy WAR BONDS! Tell me this doesn't bring back some memories. Now we have to think seriously about the real chance of ration coupons like it was in WWII or at the very least a shortage without them.

Depending how long this will go on and what countries could be involved, oil could easily be in short supply and things made from it. I remember these things were hard to get during WWII:

tires for cars or any vehicle

butter, sugar, coffee

nylons

Please add to the discussion on what you think will be in short supply. If we are going to do anything to shore up our "pantry"...we should do it soon before it is called hoarding or not being able to even get the things we want for a while.

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

Answers

Great idea for a thread! I was just wondering tonight if the Saudi oilfields are well-guarded. They would seem to be a prime target for the fanatics. With that, I would say the first thought should be "comfortable shoes!" Also, you can pick up serviceable bicycles for as little as $10 or $20 bucks at yard sales.

And what comes from petroleum? So many things, including trash bags, cleaners, etc. (Which is why Brooke's post on vinegar is so useful.) Man-made fibers--aren't a lot of them made from petroleum? Must look up old information posts from TB when I get a chance.

Yes, rationing and/or shortages could be a problem soon. We already know there's a dire shortage of flags!

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

" I was just wondering tonight if the Saudi oilfields are well- guarded. They would seem to be a prime target for the fanatics."

One of the articles I had read said "they" would go against any country that helped us. So, the oil fields of other countries might be in danger.

" With that, I would say the first thought should be "comfortable shoes!" Also, you can pick up serviceable bicycles for as little as $10 or $20 bucks at yard sales."

Yes, that would be a must. I bought a bike and spare tires and tubes for what else, Y2K. May I add, a basket or or small pull cart for the bike. A little more pricey would be a used mo-ped and extra tires. It would be great on gas to drive to work.

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

I remember the war cook book my Grama had, it had recipes that would use less sugar and eggs...because they were hard to get/ rationed. Remembering ration coupons for gasoline and my Mom would save the foil in cig packages.

Think rubber, aluminum foil, plastics, coffee, sugar....think about a wood stove and wood to heat your home. Insulation for you attic.

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

Maggie...in WWII anything thatwas made with oil. There was no mayonaise for instance. But now days, they have synthetic oils. I haven't a clue as to what they are made of, but no doubt trace back to pertroleum in the recipe somewhere. If I knew where there were right now, I would get out my old ration books and take a look. Surely anything that is petroleum based will be the primary things. I have been racking my brains as to what I should be buying. But I have lots of shoes and a bike and, and ,and from Y2k. So I guess we just sit here and wait and see what happens. Will touch back to this thread to see if I have forgotten anything. Taz

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

thanks Taz! How's that red truck running? Did you know that janet Reno bought a red truck too? hehehe

candles and candle making could be a necessary item and talent. if for example the threat to nuclear plants causes them to shut down, the ability to power the grid may be hard pressed.

Also, consider if you had to do without A/C. shocking thought for us in Miami! hats, big shady type hats. Light clothing, sun block, salt tabs, things like that. hand fans, or maybe a collection of the battery powered fans, with rechargeable batteries and chargers. when there is power, you should have all the chargers set to go.

solar radios, tv's, anything that can run on solar. Fairly cheap now and could be rare to find in future times.

How to fix it books. Not just directions on how, but books that can show how to fix something using something else not designed to be used that way. such as drains under sinks, using radiator hoses from cars when the actual correct pipe cannot be found. I do not suggest using alternate items on your water lines, though. Certain items such as radiator hoses are not manufactured to contain potable water.

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

Hi taz, would love to know what your coupons say!

I went out this morning to a garage sale, that a friends mom was having. We got to talking about what happened Tuesday and I told her about a possible bill that may be passed for WAR BONDS for the Government to raise money. Well, that led into WWII ration coupons that she had during the war, she is in her 80's. She said she still had her coupons and mentioned meat as one of the things that had to be bought with a coupon and was limited to $5 a week. Now that surprised me.

I have veg oil from 2 1/2 years ago, hope I can store it for a while more.

Barefoot, when you said "if for example the threat to nuclear plants causes them to shut down, the ability to power the grid may be hard pressed." made me feel somewhat better, because just knowing that is an option of shuting down the nuclear plants.

Another thing to do, is to make friends with someone living on a farm. I am lucky, living in a very small town...with farms all around me. I remember hearing stories from relatives, who would put their ration coupons for gas together and pile into one of their cars to go to another relatives who lived on a farm to get some food. One man in town told me, city people would come here to visit relatives and swap their extra sugar, coffee and something else for some of the farmers food.

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

like a co-op sort of thing. good idea maggie. Not much choice around here as to crops, but the U-pick fields could organize if necessary.

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

Things made of oil...

Plastic pots, flats, plug trays, cell packs, carrier flats, nursery cans, greenhouse poly, lexan, heating oil, pesticides, herbicides, lawn edging, weed barrier...

Oh yeah, perlite could be banned soon, too. The only substitute for perlite is styrofoam beads.

Expect prices to go up again at your local nursery :(

-- Anonymous, September 15, 2001

I found this info after a brief search:

Link to a story of a women raising 6 kids during the war>

Rationing Rationing began in the US in 1942 in order to preserve resources, such as gas and food, for the war. Americans were given ration tickets to control the amount of gasoline, meat, sugar, butter, even shoes they bought. Many of those women interviewed remember seeing horse meat sold in some markets due to the shortage of other meat.

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

Snip from LINK

Gasoline (petrol) and meat were rationed during the war. Every person had a meat ration book with stamps or coupons. So these commodities not only had a dollar price, they also had a price in ration stamps. When you ran out of ration stamps you didn`t get any more commodity. For gasoline there were three classes. The average car owner got an "A" sticker for the windshield (windscreen) and an "A" ration book. Those who could show that they were using their gasoline for patriotic purposes could get "B" stickers and a few more stamps. And if you really needed a lot of gasoline to aid the war effort you could get a "C" sticker and even more stamps. For meat it seems like everyone got the same number of stamps unless you had a medical necessity and could justify it to the ration board. I don`t think we got any extra meat stamps for my diabetes.

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

Snip from Fortress Finedom

"Sorry No Cigarettes" !!

These became a Luxury They were rationed all the time during the war. In the cities where people could not keep chickens or grow their own vegetables things were much worse. Air Raid shelters were being built in the playground of the Senior school, and we practiced running for shelter wearing our gas masks two or three times a week. Shoe factories were working flat out from 6am to 7pm and 8pm producing boots and shoes for the services. . The demand was enormous and to meet it meant an all out effort by the local men and women workers.The Senior Garage next to Ida Lilly's shop in Irthlingborough Road was turned into an engineering factory turning out aircraft parts.by the thousands. Violet Writing, Cliffs sister, and Doreen Warr both worked there. After a few months conditions deteriorated. There was very little in the shops. Our sweet ration was 3oz per week. Cigarettes were not rationed but were very scarce, you would be lucky to get 20 per week. Beer was in short supply. Its a good job the basics were rationed we were guaranteed of some, albeit a small amount each week. We were always hungry. No need to worry about putting on weight. We all looked like greyhounds. Queues formed at local bakeries, when occasionally, off the ration food was to be sold. I have seen many a queue outside Yates's Cake Shop. Unfortunately not all those queuing would be lucky, and would turn away disappointed. Clothing was rationed and we all had our clothing coupons. Something new meant a visit to Cyril Wilson manager of the Co- op Drapery and Furnishing Department, in his shop opposite Town Hall Hill in Chuch Street. Coupons though did not guarantee that you would always get what you wanted. You had to take what was available. "Dig for for victory" was one of the slogans used during this time and every piece of land that was suitable was soon put under the spade. Potatoes and tame rabitt meat was what we ate most of all. Many people kept a rabitt or two in their garden. Some kept a pig, but for this special permisssion was needed from the Ministry of Food, and your meat ration given up. Slowly but surely we got used to going without. I shall be eternally grateful to the Americans for sending us lease lend aid, which included spam and dried egg powder. It was sheer luxury to sit down to a plate of fried spam and an omlette made from dried egg powder all courtesy of the US of A, Dont forget though this was still counted as part of our rations so we gave up something to get spam. All buses in those days were accompanied by a conductor. We were used to public transport before and during the war as no ordinary folk in Finedon owned a car at that time. However the war meant severe cuts in the 'bus services due to the shortage of fuel. [end snip]

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

Snip from LINK

Once born Michael Sparrow would have been issued his first ration book and clothing coupons. The wartime bureaucracy would have taken an interest in him before then however. His mother would have been entitled to 60 extra clothing coupons (that is, a full year's supply) in order to provide maternity clothes ('designed to hide your secret') and a baby's layette. To get these she would have had to apply to the "Public Health Department of the Local Authority for Maternity and Child Welfare", supplying a certificate from the doctor or midwife booked to attend the birth. Had Michael been born twins, Phoebe would have had to apply again after the birth for more clothing coupons, this time presenting both birth certificates to the authorities.

As today, all the best authorities recommended breast feeding for newborn babies. (Modern authorities, however, wouldn't comment that breast milk is unrationed - and surely none would advise that babies not be fed between 10 at night and 6 in the morning for the sake of discipline!) We don't know how Phoebe fed Michael, but if she had chosen bottle feeding she would have found no ready-mixed, scientifically tested formulas available. She would have mixed her own formulas using cow's milk or dried skimmed milk.

Once weaned, Michael would have gone onto a child's ration of food, which differed in important respects from an adult's ration. The biggest difference was in the amount of milk available to small children. Whereas an adult was limited to around two pints of milk a week, growing children were issued up to two pints a day. This milk was made available at reduced cost or free to poorer families. Children also got first call on eggs and powdered eggs and oranges, when they were available. In 1942, the year Michael was born, the entire British blackcurrant crop was put aside as a source of Vitamin C for children; orange juice donated by America under 'Lend Lease' was also set aside for this purpose. Ironically, many poorer children must have been better fed during the war than they would have been during peace. If nothing else, Michael Sparrow would not have suffered from malnutrition during his early years.

Clothes were another thing rationed in wartime Britain, and outfitting Michael would have been a headache for Phoebe. It's true that the Ministry of Trade recognised that growing children were a special case when they devised their clothes rationing scheme. Growing children were allocated an extra ten clothing coupons above the standard ration each year, and clothing in small sizes had lower coupon values than adult-sized garments. However it was still a common complaint among mothers that they had trouble clothing their children decently on their rations. This affected all classes: even Vogue published an article on making children's clothes and nappies last! It was also a common complaint that children's shoes made in wartime were shoddy and wore out easily.

Buying secondhand clothing was one way of getting around this. Coupons were not needed when private individuals sold secondhand clothes to each other - as, for example, when one mother sold her child's outgrown clothing to another. Coupons were also unnecessary when clothes dealers sold secondhand clothing below a certain price determined by the coupon value of the clothing multiplied by a fixed sum. [end snip]

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

Barefoot, Florida does have a whole lot of fruit and having people pick their own would be a blessing in a time of need.

Big Kumara, I would think... if we once again went back to having gardens to produce some our food needs, nurseries would be kept busy providing supplies and advice. I would also think, shade trees would be a much wanted and needed item to cut down on the heatt during the summer. Nurseries would be a good business to be in! One thing that might come back into use again is fish fertilizer, stinks but is a natural product.

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

Time to start reminding people--if you're going to stash things, do NOT let your friends, neighbors or relatives know what you're doing, I don't care HOW nice they are. I wrote numerous posts on the old forum about how hoarders in WWII in Britain were arrested and their goods confiscated. The line between prudent storage and hoarding is a very fuzzy one--don't even try to define it.

How did the authorities find out about the hoarders? Not so prudent friends and relatives turned them in. Where's a link? You'll have to call my old dad and ask him about it--that's where I got the info.

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

I'll second that one Old Git....about not telling people you might plan to put a little extra away for a rainy day. Staples such as coffee, tea, sugar, dried milk, dried eggs, bulk tobbaco in cans, cig paper to roll your own, a bottle or two of your favorite drink might darn well come in handy. Don't forget personnel things like extra socks and underware, tires and oil for ones car.

If you can get an old copy of Howard Ruff's book "How to prosper during the coming bad years" and "Goverment by Emergency" by Dr. Gary North, please do so. Excellent information that may well be pertinent now and down the road! They talk about wage freezes, price controls, preparing for shortages. Looks like I will be rereading books I haven't looked at for a while.

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

We have two [I guess they are called mosques] near us. Driving by them today one notices that they do not have any American flags outside, or any on the cars of the worshippers.

If, as they say, these Islamics will start 'jihad' when we retaliate, I wonder just how this neighborhood will look. Will they go door to door attacking neighbors? Will they attack traffic as it goes by? What will they do, if anything? They are both on the same main artery in this area, and fortunately not where we need to go to get anywhere.

But they are close.

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

Barefoot, that is odd about not seeing any U.S. flags around the mosque you spoke of. These are just my thoughts, I would think most of those going to that mosque, would be more concerned about their own safety living here, then we would have to worry about them hurting us.

I am just a middle age women living in the mid west but, years ago when I was working...I was put in contact with a man who lived in Florida and he said he had built one or two mosque there and had gone to school with someone of importance in Saudi Arabia. I wish I still had his phone number, to get a feel from him on what he and some others are thinking. We had talked several times and he was just as nice as could be.

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001

I didn't have a flag until I mentioned it to my neighbor and she dug up one for me--and one from her daughter for the Hungarian. The stores sold out of anything flag-related within hours. I was able to take a cheap plastic stars and bars banner (found at Big Lots) to the Mexican restaurant when we went last night, thinking they probably wouldn't have been able to find a flag either. They hadn't and put up the banner immediately, by the door where people could see it.

-- Anonymous, September 16, 2001