So, we've gone from being World Beaters on Sunday to the worst team in the world on Tuesday. It's amazing what 48 hours can do isn't it?

By all accounts we played relatively well on Sunday and Barton and had a pretty solid game, yet it would appear that most people on here thought he shouldn't have played last night.

There were a number of postings along the lines of what would be able to do with a full strength team, what would we be able to do with a full midfield and a full strikeforce? Yet today, we are now back to being sh!te.
Did I miss something? Did we play our full team yesterday? Was that our starting 11? We didn't even lose the game, yet we have become the worst team in the world. 4-1 down, and we draw 4-4. How many teams would have folded at that point? Look at Boro at the w/e, look at Leicester, look at virtually every other team. We showed character last night, we fought back to a 4-4 draw.

I know that we got knocked out of the competition. Some people didn't want us to enter in the first place but we did. We made a little bit more money than we would have and we played in tougher pre-season games than we would have. Of course we would lose like that. Only Newcastle could lose a cup tie in such a fashion, but it's not the end of the world. We have a big game coming up. We have a left midfielder (who is class) to come in to the team and we may have a fully fit number 9.

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

Answers

Abuse Please

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

So is Barton shit or not?

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

He was yesterday.

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

What I don't get with Barton is WHY is he shit. He can run all day so it's not fitness. It's not like he's past it physically. He was a great player when we first signed him. He was an England international for fks sake. Did we make him shit? Like we made Maric and Tomasson and Pistone and Marcelino shit?

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

Yes, I think we may have. Or at least contributed to it. "We" and I mean at least some of the home crowd, really do like getting on a player's case. Different players react in different ways to this treatment - but confidence is very important at the top level and I think Barton has suffered in some respects so that I am not sure he really expects to be the best in the world when he steps onto the field - perhaps particularly at St James Park. I don't think this is responsible for all of his erratic form. I suspect that KK's side, which always had a drafty defense, didn't really suite Barton.

We used to have a player called Gibbs (right half/inside right). Long time ago. Some sections of the crowd just loved to have a go at him and I think he ended up like rather like Barton. Some days he was fantatsic. Some days he would make a few mistakes early on and he would be whistled down hill all the way.

It's Okay to say "These guys earn 40K a month." But is the implication that we are, therefore, entitled to boo, hiss, and jeer at any mistake? If that is the case then really what is wanted is a set of scapegoats, not a football team.

Frankly, this has always been a part of Newcastle crowds. And in my experience its always been much more vindictive and vociferously expressed than at other grounds I have regularly attended during my spectating life, Hibs, Hearts, Boro and Swindon. In my opinion we are NOT the best supporters in the world as long as that is a regular feature of home games. I have NEVER heard the Toon Army jeer at a player at an away match - but at home games its often very different.

Well, perhaps that's enough to get me banned from this BBS!

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

GET OUT

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

It's worth pointing out that at last night's match we were missing Shearer, Cort, Dyer and Robert. About £50m worth at their max valuations and all of them creators and/or goalscorers. With a full team I doubt Troyes could have got out of their own half very much.

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

Thank you Kegsy, I thought I must have fallen into a coma and woken up during a different season. I was horrified by the fragility of our defence but left the ground 9 feet tall thanks to being a part of a terrific evening. Shola's goal was the culmination of the crowd roaring every time we made any forward movement at all and should have been nothing but a consolation strike but instead ended up as the launch pad for a tremendous fight-back. I will cheer them all the way to Hell and back if they fight like that.

As for this bizarre witchhunt on here I can only say how glad I am that I don't feel the need. I have no idea what it looked like on the telly, but the view from the seats was that their first goal was a defelction and for those of you who are a bit slow to grasp the fact, this meant we had to score one more than them from then on. Troyes were a terrific counter-attacking side. I watched them bounce back against Wolfsburg and they did the same last night. We were stretching ourselves from then on trying to get numbers up front and left ourselves wide open. What would you have preferred? A Dalglish series of defensive subs to keep the scoreline respectable? Last season's head-down capitulation approach? It was a sensational end to a match. I loved it.

The twats who booed Barton were resoundingly shouted down by the majority (as was the case with Marcelino at Lee's testimonial) and the huge chorus of booing at the end was aimed squarely at the cheating crowd of Lazaruses cavorting in front of the away fans. I can't believe the ref let them get away with some of the most disgraceful feigned injuries since Roma came to visit. It was like playing against 11 Franck Le Bouefs. If he'd waved them off the field and not let them back on again it would have been no more than we dserved. I loathe gamesmanship in all its forms (I would dock Nobby's wages every time he moves the ball at free kicks) and have nothing but contempt for that shower: a shame really, because I was filmed by French telly shaking hands with their fans and wishing them bon chance on Blackett Street before the match.

Anyway, met a great lad from South Korea called Kim Ki Yeung who has invited the whole of the Toon Army to stay at his place during the World Cup. Hope he enjoyed his first visit to SJP.

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

Softie, I hope you got his correct 'phone number and address, 60% of South Koreans are called Kim; I once did a case for Hyundai and in an office of 20 there were 12 Kim's, 3 with the same initials, Kim K T ;-)

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

We may not be in the UEFA cup. We may have been crap at times, but we had something last night I haven't witnessed for a while. We had team spirit, we didn't give up in the end. For God's sake how many teams come back from 1-4 down. We didn't even lose. I'm convinced with Robert back on Sunday if we play with the spirit we played with in the last 20 minutes we will beat the Makem's convincingly.

Going through matches like last night might not be good for the health, at 3-4 I didn't think I could watch anymore, but in a masochistic sort of I loved it. Mad or what ?

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

If we can battle like that at the END when all is lost , then why not for 90 Mins. EH!!!!!!!

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

Err....because we have to wait for the other team to relax knowing the game is won before we can actually compete??

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

Remember last season when we did well for the first 20min, then disappeared the rest of the match. So this is some improvement. Now if we can just convince the players that the match lasts a FULL 90min (plus stoppage) and the only chance during that for a rest is at half time.

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

Barton was at fault for a cross which led to a goal & directly for allowing a forward through for a goal. But the way we played last night was that for the full backs to recieve the ball from the keeper and hit a forward who came off his man ( or occasionally drop it over for Bellamy).

Robbie Elliot managed to hit Ameobi and Bellamy consistently - Bartons distribution was not at the same level.

By the way it was Tommy Gibb not Gibbs that got slagged every week - thank God there was only one of him.

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

The plain facts Kegsy are indeed that we played well on Sunday, and for 40 or so minutes yesterday were embarrassingly horrible. Explanations?

* Having seen both legs, I would argue that Troyes were much better opposition than Chelsea - highly controversial perhaps in Lahnden, but true omho.

* Our game plan was flawed.

Part 1 was clearly to hit them hard from the KO, and get the crowd going to scare the cr@p out of the Troyes players. This almost worked. However, having got the lead we didn't push on for what would have been the killer 2nd goal. We tried to sit on the lead and kill the game, from the 8th minute, or whatever it was. First mistake.
We allowed Troys to get into their impressive passing game, couldn't get near them in m/f or in defence, and they got their noses in front with decisive away goals that effectively ended the tie.
Thereafter, we were chasing the game and continually got caught on the counter attack, committing defenders forward in an ill- disciplined, kamikaze way rather than seeking to re-establish control in midfield and then push for the two goals required.

* Game Plan - Part2: Formation.
This comprised employing three at the back with Hughes pushed in front of the back 3. This failed badly. Hughes became the hub of forward movement from defence, a role he is utterly ill-equipped for. In addition, this caused our FB's to tuck in to support Dabz who was usually faced by two Troyes forwards, leaving acres of space on the wings for Troyes to fully exploit - with wide men Quinn and Solano rarely tracking back to fill the gaping holes.
This formation was shambolic, with players constantly getting pulled out of position, and Rob Lee (who really should not have played so soon after the Chelsea game, and was awful) needing to constantly drop back behind the thoroughly confused Aaron Hughes to help out in defence.
The substitutions eventually caused us to abandon this nonsensical formation, and we basically just threw the kitchen sink at them. Fully liberated from the tactical cr@p, our players displayed some of the skill they undoubtedly possess, and just went for it.

Bizarre, but true.

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001

Seems about right Clarky

-- Anonymous, August 22, 2001