gullit and dalglish got serious stick for what was perceived as crap decision making in the transfer market.

so far uncle bob has escaped criticism (on here at least) in spite of the fact that nobody rates any of his signings (no opinion of robert yet)

just to remind you:

bassedas, acuna, obrien, bellamy, quinn, elliot,

see what i mean?

12 or 13 months ago we had domi and pistone as contenders for LB now we have quinn and elliot. thats just champion isn't it?

say what you want about mercenary foreigners (goma)etc. bottom line is they didn't want to play for uncle bob.

now we face another season of joyful mid table tedium spiced only with the usual speculation that the one really class player (dyer)will be offski due to lack of decent team mates.

if "king kenny" were still in charge we'd all be waiting for him outside the training ground with boxes of old fruit.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

Answers

Pistone was Toss, as was Domi in his last season. Give me Robbie Elliott over those two wastrels any day of the week. O'Brien is solid, Acuna busts a gut and with another year of Premiership football under his belt will come into his own this year. Bellamy vs Maric? no contest. Ok Quinn's a donkey and Bassedas is lightweight but generally we're in far better shape now than when young Bobby took over. Remember how much dross he's cleared out - and even managed to recoup some money for some of it. Oh yeah and although you conveniently discounted him from your argument; Robert is pure class.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

we can argue all day on comparisons of individual players (elliot vs pistone)without any resolution.

however, we're still looking at 9th place, 54 points, an 5th round fa cup exit, 3rd of uefa, and a midweek defeat at man city in the other one.

not what you'd call startling progress.

and okay, if you take the "better off now" stance, just when do you think we should be really competitive again?

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

He also brought in Gallagher for a season, who served us well given the dire striker shortage.

Domi was certainly not cut out for the English game. Seen him more than once, and his bottle was definitely of the cheap, plastic Panda Cola variety. Elliot is a better bet.

And I'm not so sure Dyer is offski (although I'd still take £20m), of for no other reason that no-one is going to touch him for the next 6 months given his recent injury record.

YBR has probably avoided some flak during his honeymoon period, and Wadsworth also took some hits for / with him. Last season was the first test, the one to come will be the make or break I reckon. Can't see another summer like this one with YBR at the helm unless we make a decent season of it (e.g. UEFA place in league, or Intertoto this time round).

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

So you expected YBR to transform us into Championship contenders within 2 Seasons? Don't base our progress on what a bunch of hacks are predicting for the forthcoming Season.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

>So you expected YBR to transform us into Championship contenders >within 2 Seasons? Don't base our progress on what a bunch of hacks >are predicting for the forthcoming Season.

No. but the argument that the crap players we have now are a bit less crap than the ones we had 2 years ago isn't much consolation.

They're my own predictions, what are yours?

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

My prediction?

Top 8. And given a reasonable break on the injury front, top 6.

We'll start poorly but will pick up significantly when Dyer et al are back in harness.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

George you forgot Lua2 and Gavilan as Bobby signings

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

Don't give him ammunition, Mac ;-)

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

it wasn't giving him ammunition was it ?

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

With my opinions of LuaX2 I think you handed George some hefty ordnance :-) Gavilan, I can't comment on...not seen him play, but reports seem fairly +ve

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

ok,

given that nobody can successfully argue that YBR has been a transfer mkt. king midas, past 2 seasons, what do you think of the job he's done and what is acceptable performance for the next couple of seasons?

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

Over £30m has been spent. YBR has to show that something has been achieved otherwise he has lost the plot. I'll write off last season as bad luck/injuries etc, but now it is time to deliver.

It appears to me that a lot of that £30+ million might have been better spent but I'm hoping that YBR's judgement will shine through and a number of players come good this season.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

oh yes Jonno, Let's just go and compare him with Kevin, lord knows that you believe he is the proverbial measuring stick!!!! YBR will be remembered as the man that saved us. and he really did, because any other manager would have taken us down, having had to deal with what he has had to.

When teams are spending 30m on one player, yet YBR has spent that on how many??? You get what you pay for, and we haven't paid squat! The inclusion of Robert means nothing. When you only have money for a Toyota, you don't go looking at Ferraris.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

Sparxx - I never mentioned Keegan. Why do you keep harping back to him? :-) YBR doesn't have to emulate Keegan in my eyes, to earn my praise this season.

£30m+ is a lot of money, and compares favourably with most of the Premiership. The number of players he has bought is his business. He has bought at all prices from £1m up to £10m, up and coming players plus established stars - his choice. He has to deliver THIS season. Saving us the year before last counts for nothing in that analysis. I'm not sure what yardstick I'd use to measure success/failure. Finishing bottom half would be a big failure IMHO. Top 4 would be a big success. In between and the judgement will be more subjective.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

Sparxx, Jonno didn't mention KK....you're looking for trouble picking on him....ask sooper! :)))

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

I am not sure that he has to deliver this season. How long did it take the greatest manager in football to get things right at Man Utd? This club was on its knees when he came - exaggerated expectations from the Keegan era married with mismanagement from Dalglish and Gullit. He has more or less stablised us (I say more-or-less because the departure of Stonehouse and Wadsworth pointed to things being slightly unstable still). Now he has to make real progress. He could do with some luckm which was in short supply last year. But mostly he needs our support.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

The problem with the Ferguson analogy is the assumption that everyone would have his level of success if they were given long enough. If that's the case we have only ever really given Keegan the time to succeed in the last 25 years. I'm not sure what the West Ham managers have as excuses.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

why the need for success this season then? I would count it a successfull season if we were able to stay healthy for an extended period. The demand that HE HAS to prove something is absolutely outrageous and is the kind of expecatation that led us to problems in the first place. YBR should feel no pressure from anyone, least of all us the fans.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

It shouldn't be too much to expect to improve over the coming season having spent more than all but 4 clubs in the league during the summer? I don't demand silverware - although to be in contention would be nice. Surely to finish in the bottom half this season should be viewed as failure unless there were very mitigating circs (injuries etc).

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

sparxx (sp?) your argument defies belief. you seem to be saying that YBR is a good manager but should not be expected to meet any minimum standards this season beyond "staying healthy" (whatever that means)

presumably you go to odd game, doesn't it get a bit tiring when the team is so average and inconsistent?

i think a so called "big club" with 50k fans and 30 mil spent in transfer fees should expect a bit more i.e. compete with leeds arse chelsea and liverpool at least. YBR is the dude in the chair and by definition responsible for getting the job done (or at least started) this season.

blah rant blether

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

MacB, Harry did well enough, given that he had tuppence hapenny to spend. They were 5th in the league a couple of years ago.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

agreed improvement is hoped for, but reality states that all the clubs that have made major improvements have definitely separated themselves from the pack. I just hope we can get a hold into Europe.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

GB - it is hard to measure tthe past two seasons against the previous as YBR has had really only one season to use his squad at full strength. To what end do we grade ourselves? Reallistically if all are healthy we should be vastly improved over last season, but who can tell? Only time........will tell

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

I don't need us to win anything, but I expect a damned sight more than last season's pitiful, gutless rubbish. Were we really only worth 3 goals at our best (the 4 against an apalling Bradford were completely outweighed by the 3 we let in)? We had 6 and 8 the season before. One serious tonking handed out at home each season and a healthy number of 2 clear goal victory margins is what keeps me happy. Getting after teams at home is what makes it all worthwhile: sticking 3 past Man United when they had all but won the league - you may be Champions Elect but you're nowt but whipping-boys on our patch! Tremendous. Win all the home games and take pot-luck and a good sing-song away. Isn't that what it's all about or am I missing something?

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

No softie that is exactly what I require. I remember a few eyars ago joining in a discussion with that old and knowledgable Jonno about whether fans who travelled many miles had different expectations to those based on Tyneside. I (and he I think, but I'd hate to misquote him !!!) decided performance mattered at least as much as result.

As any one will tell you we haven't won anything for bloody ages, and I have no real expectation we ever will, I therfore go to be entertained. A good result helps enormously but Premiership football year after year, combined with entertainment is more than enough for me. I is remarkably better than what we had from 77-92 as we all know.

Ideally we would win every home game, or 17 out of 19 like 96ish, but I'm not greedy.

For me for next season I want to see attacking football, on both wings, from players who want to score, want to enjoy their football. I want us to qualify for Europe, but wouldn't die if it didn't happen.

What I will not accept is the same as last year when we had none of the above. If that happens again, injuries or not, then I while criticise on here, and boo my perception of the culprits until they realise they should leave. (Boro fans booing Bryan Robson caused his departure, that was correct for them to do so).

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

I'm quite hopeful about next season.

Whilst I reserve my judgement on some of the summer buys, Robert looks like he is class and if he stays fit could provide that vital bit of balance in the squad that was missing so much last season.

The thing is, you never really know what is going to happen. Nobody expected Ipswich up there last season and I bet not many would have predicted Southampton would finish in 10th place.

One of the "big five" of Chelsea, Man Utd, Arsenal, Leeds and Liverpool may well go tits up next season and we really should be looking to take their place.

Just look at all the teams that finished 6th or below. Is anyone seriously suggesting that they have more potential than us? I don't think Ipswich are going to repeat their feat once again, Villa always hover around 8th place and the rest are really nothing special. With our injuries and more often than not under-performances we were one of those "nothing special" teams. If we get a bit more luck with injuries and a stable team we really should be looking at elevating ourselves above the "nothing special" category.

By the looks of things we are always going to concede goals, so it has to be our highest priority to score as many as we possibly can. The same principal as the first leg of the Lokeren game. Although they aren't world class opposition, we could easily have sat back on the 1-0 lead, but instead we went for goals to make the second leg easier.

Back to the original post, you never really know what is going to happen. The only thing that is certain (virtually) in my mind is that Bolton will go down and Sunderland will not be playing in Europe for at least the next season.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

Like others have said, I just want to see players working hard and honestly doing their best. For themselves and more importantly for each other. If they do that, the points will come. The worst part of last season was the gutless performances. If we win a trophy along the way or finish high enough to get into Europe, all the better. Just give me performances for which I don't have to feel embarrassed. I know our players are capable of it.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

I totally agree Ciara, that's all I ask. In fact that's all I have ever asked is for those that pull on the Black and White to give 100 per cent, every game, week in, week out. That's all. Play with pride.

-- Anonymous, August 14, 2001

The best thing I have seen is that YBR is bringing in some youngsters and bringing some youngsters through from the reserves. That's a really difficult job to do because the EPL is a tough tough place and you can't just throw 'em in there. Some people already rate Hughes as one of our best propects. This does require coaching and from what I read this is one of the best things Mr Robson does. Along these lines it seems that both Shola and LuaLua have improved. Neither are the finshed article - but if they are a lot closer by the end of the season, and we have one or two of O'Brian (also young) Bellamy, the two Scots brothers and Prutton (and possibly one of the young strikers) playing well and in the team then I will be happy. This may sound a measly objective - but I think it will mark the true transition for us from a team that bought success player by player, which we saw could not be sustained, to a proper squad based outfit.

-- Anonymous, August 15, 2001

I agree with Macbeth and Softie about performances. I remember what a revelation Gullit was when he first came. Despite only a marginal improvement in results the entertainment level jumped hugely after the dire performances under TSM. AS a fan on the terraces you have to have something to shout for. If you're far from home and looking at the result in the papers then 1-0 or 4-3 and the performance, makes no difference.

With average luck we should be in the top 8 and challenging for European slots. With good luck and perhaps a judicious signing or two at the right time there is no reason why we should not be breaking back into the big 4 or 5. If that is not the target then we must be setting our sets far too low.

-- Anonymous, August 15, 2001