I read somewhere that Philip Melanchton (Luther's follower)said something like this: the Protestant faith is more convenient to live, but to die the Catholic faith is the only secure way.

Is this story true? Where can I find the sources?

Enrique

-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), July 28, 2001

Answers

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-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), July 28, 2001.

Jmj

I cannot answer your question directly, Enrique, but I hope that the following excerpts from a long article about Philip Melancthon in the (old) Catholic Encyclopedia may be helpful to you. [I suspect that your quotation is apochryphal, since it does not appear in the encyclopedia article -- where it surely would appear if it could be proved to be genuine.] By the way, "Melancthon" is a Greek translation of Philip's real surname, "Schwartzerd," which means "black earth" (tierra negra).

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Melancthon warns against reviling pope or bishop; whereas Luther remarks: "You must denounce vehemently the papacy and its followers, for it is already doomed by God even as the devil and his kingdom". Melancthon, it is true, preached the doctrine that faith alone justifies and that "God will forgive sins for the sake of Christ, and without works on our part"; but he added: "We must nevertheless do good works, which God has commanded." Later he invariably sought to preserve peace as long as might be possible, and no one took so much to heart as he the break between the churches. ...

While Luther in the Smalkaldic Articles (1537), described the pope as Antichrist and other theologians subscribed to this declaration, Melancthon wrote: "My idea of the pope is this, that if he would give due recognition to the Gospel, his supremacy over the bishops, which he enjoys by human consent (not by Divine ordinance) should also be acknowledged by us for the sake of peace and of the unity of those Christians who are now, and in the future may be, subject to him. ..."

He thought it possible to remain within the Catholic Church, even with the new theology. But he was never a Cryptocatholic, as has been laid to his charge, and while evincing in every other way a spirit of reconciliation, he held fast to the "purified doctrine" ...

The story that when his mother asked which was the better of the two religions, he replied that the modified one was the more plausible, while the old one was the surer, is nothing but a ridiculous invention. [This is a bit similar to your quotation, Enrique. JFG]

... His last wish was that the Churches might become reunited in Christ. He died praying, quietly and peacefully, without apparent struggle.

St. James, pray for us.
God bless you.
John

-- (jgecik@desc.dla.mil), July 28, 2001.

Thank you very much, John. As always, you have been most helpful. taking advantage of your ample knowledge of things catholic I am asking you where in Luther's works can this quotation be found?:

"Esto peccator, pecca fortiter sed fortius fide"

Thanks in advance.

Enrique

-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), July 28, 2001.

Jmj

Dear Enrique,
I have something for you from the 1999 edition of the Oxford Dictionary of Quotations (according to www.xrefer.com/entry/248920):

"Esto peccator et pecca fortiter, sed fortius fide et gaude in Christo."

[Translated: Be a sinner and sin strongly, but more strongly have faith and rejoice in Christ. Is this correct in Spanish?: Sea pecador y peque fuertemente, pero mas fuertemente tenga fe y jubile en Cristo.]

Luther, Martin (1483 - 1546), German Protestant theologian
Letter to Melanchthon, (1521), in Epistolae (Jena, (1556)) vol. 1, folio 345 verso

St. James, pray for us.
God bless you.
John

-- (jgecik@desc.dla.mil), July 29, 2001.

Thank you very much, John. I couldn't expect less from you. By the way the transaltion in Spanish of Luther's words would be: Sé pecador, peca fuertemente pero cree más fuertemente y alégrate en Cristo.

Enrique

-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), July 30, 2001.

Jmj

Enrique,
I see that the main difference between our two translations is the fact that I used the formal "you" (Usted) as the basis of the commands (Sea ... peque ... tenga ... jubile), while you used the informal "you" (Tu) as the basis (Se ... peca, etc.).
I don't understand why you would not use the formal "you." Oh, is it because it was a letter from Luther to Melancthon, a friend?
Thanks. JFG

-- (jgecik@amdg.ihs), July 30, 2001.

Dear John: The reason why I didn't use the formal "you" is mainly because in Latin it does not exist. To everyone (as I remeber from my Latin lessons during "Preparatoria" clsses) you address as TU, second person. Even to the Pope or higher up to God in Latin you address them as TU. The formal you in Spanish USTED comes from the third person SU MERCED (your mercy). that is why when translating from Latin we prefer the second person tú over the third person Usted.

Enrique

-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), August 01, 2001.

Thanks for the very reasonable explanation, Enrique. JFG

-- (jgecik@amdg.ihs), August 02, 2001.