With the current welcome revitalisation of the non-footy thread (and with the football in such a state who's complaining)I thought I'd ask this. I think you're looking for very original acts, bands or individuals, who have shaken up the industry and influenced the future of Rock. IMHO there are 3 major contenders and one clear winner but I'll withhold my opinion for the time being.

So who is it to be then? WHAM!? The Spice Girls? Abba? Herman's Hermits? Cliff Richard? Or could you possibly have someone else in mind?

-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

Answers

Another Poll.

-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

Gary Glitter.......nah.... Freddie Mercury!!!!!

-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

Rock Star or Showman? Is there a difference? It is widley accepted that "the Clash" had significant influence on music trends pre London Calling. However the greatest show must have been done by the greatest band. Queen at Wembley Stadium.

-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

The Beatles.

-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

The Beatles, Sex Pistols, ermmmm Prodigy perhaps?

-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

I would say these must be the ones : Elvis, The Beatles (or if it has to be people not groups, then John Lennon and Paul McCartney), Dylan, Brian Wilson, Jimi Hendrix, Bob Marley, Sex Pistols (or individual Johnny Rotten), Eddie van Halen, Afrika Bambataa and the other original rapper whose name escapes me right now. They all did something which made a real difference to the development of music (sometimes in one particular field). You could also make a case for people like Buddy Holly, Carl Perkins, Bowie, Bolan, Neil Young, Prince, Morrissey, Jimmy Page, Jeff Beck, Joy Division, Kraftwerk etc but although they were/are great musicians, maybe they were more part of a movement and didn't make the difference that the others did.

-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

Robert Johnson, blah blah, delta bluesmen, blah blah. Velvet Underground, yada yada.


-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

Well I'm pleased I didn't offer a cash prize because I'd have had to pay out to Barry, whose first 3 names are the exact same as the three I had in mind and I agree with his first 5 as well. Whether this is a case of great minds thinking alike or fools seldom differing I will leave you to decide. My three contenders are :-

Elvis, the first, the great original, The King, nuff said.

The Beatles - Awesome talent, hugely influential on so many, I can remember so well the eager anticipation for every single and album they brought out, and 30 years after their disbanding they are still followed.

Bob Dylan. For me the greatest of them all. Not quite as commercially mega as the other two, his influence has been enormous and he has chronicled his time and his generation better surely than any other artist in modern times? (How better to sum up the revolution of the sixties than with "The Times they are a-changin", or the drug culture with a song like "Mr Tambourine Man".) A great original more than once, moving on from folk/protest to acid rock to country, quite fearlessly. When he moved on from folk/protest to the electric guitar he was booed on stage but carried on completely unphased. Very influential on and influenced by The Beatles who saw that they could write more interesting stuff than "She Loves You Yeah yeah yeah". Hendrix said that when he first heard him sing he was impressed with a guy who had the nerve to sing half a note out of tune like that. Hendrix then made one of the greatest cover versions of any song ever with "All along The Watchtower". Never a follower always a leader. "Woody Guthrie was my last hero because he taught me that you don't need heros."

One of his great legacies is that he made the words of the songs more important than they had been before. He created the space for the likes of Joni Mitchell, Leonard Cohen, Paul Simon, Don McLean and many others to come through. And he's still going. Now 60 and apparently has toured non stop for the past 5 or 6 years. I don't know how long he has left - as he writes in a recent masterpiece "It's not dark yet - but it's gettin there."

-- Anonymous, July 05, 2001

Barry has it just about right. I'd rate them slightly different in that I'd go Beatles, Dylan, Elvis, in that order.

Beatles because they produced 12 great albums in 7 years and then said that's it. Incredible sense of timing to the very end. In eighteen months they released three of the greatest records in the history of rock - Rubber Soul, Revolver (IMHO the greatest rock album ever) and Sgt. Pepper. I would argue that this was a burst of creativity that hasn't been matched before or since.

Elvis because he made rock palatable for white audiences, and added that bit of c & w to the black sound that defined rock and roll. Before he went in the army he was simply awesome - after the army, he settled for second rate films and was reduced to being merely very good.

Dylan because he made lyrics mean something in rock. It's hard for me to consider Dylan a rock artist, but he clearly produced some great rock music.

Special honorary mention to Chuck Berry, Buddy Holly, and the Everly Brothers - mostly because of the incredible influence they had on the Beatles. You get the feeling that Lennon and McCartney spent a lot of time listening to Don and Phil sing harmony.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Your were asking for the Rock "star", for Showmanship you'd have to say Hendrix or Freddie Mercury.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

I've just watched the greatest documentary series I've ever seen: Jazz, on British TV over the summer. I'm not even a big Jazz fan to be honest however, 'Kind of blue' recorded in '59 by Miles Davis sounded cool, so I popped into town and bought it.
It's simply the most beautiful music I've ever listened to in all of my 40 years.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

I'm more familiar with the jazz side of things and for me Dave Brubeck was a milestone figure. And I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the Stones, I preferred them to the Beatles.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

James Marshal Hendrix and His Experience. Vision (blurred mostly), ability, variety, power, subtlety...name it, he had it (including VD etc...).

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Elvis,Howlin' Wolf, Muddy Waters, Dylan, Hendrix, Frank Zappa, The Clash, Lowell George & Jerry Garcia.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Eminem...

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Heednhands

I hadn't seen the documentary, sadly, but I happened to buy Kind of Blue a couple of months ago, I was gob-smacked at it, more unbelievable was reading the notes and finding they'd done it in one session having never played the music before and what I was listening to was a first take.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

It depends if you're talking about talent or influence. I don't think The Beatles were particularly influential.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Talent = Queen , influence on later musicians = Muddy Waters , Lonny Donegan`s contribution to the revolution in the UK should never be overlooked, Rock Island Line, 2 old ladies lying in the sand, each one wishing the other was a man. pushing the barriers a wee bit then

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

OK Pit Bull ,Jonno above line from Cumberland Gap, 15 miles of the Cumberland Gap, BTW where is the CG outta interest like?

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Never ever understood what all the fuss was about with Presley. As far as changeing music went he was a good singer. The people who wrote the lyrics, tunes and arrangements for him get no credit.

Put me off him and I wont watch or listen too him now. For me his was just a singer.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

heedinhands

The Jazz documentary got a lot of stick because it was "influenced" so heavily by Wynton Marsalis who was adviser to the documentary maker. Also it only covered a few of the greats and inevitably left out some true greats including Mingus, Coltrane, Bud Powell to mention a few.

Having said all that I really enjoyed it myself and glad you enjoyed Kind of Blue more of an MJQ fan myself (retreats to corner to smoke his pipe and try and find that oh so bohemian beret niiice)

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Good to hear lots of interesting views. In fact I listed mine in chronological order more than order of influence, though I suppose it's more or less the same thing - you can only influence people that follow you. If you want to read a great music book, try Revolution in the Head by Ian MacDonald on the Beatles - it makes you want to buy all the records and listen to them over again. Anyone else got any recommendations on music books? I also thought Shots from the Hip (collected writings)and (I think it's called) Crosstown Traffic (on Jimi Hendrix) both by Charles Shaar Murray are pretty good. And the collected writings of Nick Kent are too.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Barry

try "we all had backstage passes" by Al Kooper or "Mystery train" by griel Marcus. Excellent.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

An excellent book on Dylan's work is "Song and Dance Man" by Michael Gray, a very learned tome discussing the lyrics. I understand it has just been reissued and updated presumably to incorporate the latest songs. I read the first version more than 20 years ago so I guess the book has expanded considerably since.

-- Anonymous, July 06, 2001

Possibly influenced rather than influencer, Morrosy & Marr with Smiths.

-- Anonymous, July 07, 2001