"golden droplets" in your M2/M3 viewfinder?

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In an earlier posting I recieved very helpful advice on how to examine an old M2 before buying. One advice on what to look for in the viewfinder read:

"...at the upper and lower edges of what appears to be a triangular glass [...]receding toward the rear eyepiece [...] If you can see "golden droplets" along the edges, this is evidence of the rangefinder prism begining to de-cement. It might stay forever, it might come completely decemented if the camera takes some kind of shock..."

I actually noticed these "droplets" i the camera, and put the purchase on hold. I took a walk to a couple of camerashops in Copenhagen to examine a few old Leica's and I noticed that all the M2 and M3 I looked at (5) did also have these "droplets".
Now I wonder; how common is the phenomenon? Am I likely to find one without?

-- Niels H. S. Nielsen (nhsn@ruc.dk), June 29, 2001

Answers

I sent two old M3s, one old M2 and an M4 to Leica USA for tune-ups. Everyone of the cameras came back with the annotation, "rangefinder shows signs of de-cementing." I sold the M3s and M4, but use the M2 all of the time with no ill effect, and the notification of the "problem" was made in 1989. I would suppose if there are signs of the problem, then the ethical thing to do would be to mention it on the invoice, as Leica did, but I don't know how important it is in real life. I would guess that any complex item that is over thirty five years old would not be perfect. Other than the annotation, Leica made no recommendations or warnings, so I enjoyed these cameras like there was no problem. All performed flawlessly.

This is only my experience. Someone else on this forum may have a story that counters mine... where the camera failed.

Good luck.

-- Al Smith (smith58@msn.com), June 29, 2001.


I just checked my M3 and if you shine a light into the finder and look with a magnifier, there is a small line of very tiny bubbles at the bottom edge of some element inside the finder. Now I recently had mt entire finder taken apart to bits and every single glass surface was cleaned by Bill Maxwell. He told me the prism was in good condition but that some cameras he has cleaned up had to have the prisms replaced as the coatings had deteriorated. I'm sure he would have told me if a few tiny bubbles were something to be concerned about. If the finder is clear, bright, and everything lines up, I wouldn't worry about it.

-- Andrew Schank (aschank@flash.net), June 29, 2001.

Repair people have told me the decementing problem is very rare on M4's. My M4 is still droplet-free, it's a 1970 model 3 years into production, so pehaps the early ones used the same cement as the M2's and the later ones used another type. My M2's were both late-models ('63 and '65) and both had droplets. I guess the cement gets brittle with age. I was told that they might stay fine forever, or a sudden shock might cause the prism to decement completely. I liked my M2's ok but even with the quick-load kits they were still slower to rewind than the later bodies and didn't have meters. Considering I could get a pair of mint M6's for what a collector paid me for my pair of M2's, I chose to do that deal rather than risking $500 rangefinder replacements in the M2's.

-- Jay (infinitydt@aol.com), June 30, 2001.

I have two M3 and both of them has this problem, well not a problem yet; I still use them one on a 21 with a finder, and the other holds a 50 and a hardly used 90, so my only worry is about having a problem on both and lose that finder for the 90 and the 50, but not so much the 50, since I like the one provided by the .72 in my M4P.Good luck, and donīt drope it.

-- r watson (al1231234@hotmail.com), June 30, 2001.

Great! another reason to lie awake at night worrying! Only a matter of time before my beloved M3 develops those "golden droplets" But soft, what light through yonder rf window breaks! It is John Van Stelten with the news that he repairs beam splitter prisms all the time. The only problem, he says, comes when the semi-silvered surfaces are left exposed to the air long enough to tarnish, so if your prism de-cements I guess you should deal with it pronto. He goes on: "The usual beamsplitter repair runs around $250-$300. The replacement may be $700.00 at Leica, but remember that they no longer have original M3 exchanges, but will replace with an M6 RF that is not really close to original.".............

-- david kelly (dmkedit@aol.com), July 02, 2001.


Thanks for your input. I'll go for it. As some people has pointed out, the price I pay for the camera/lens leaves room for repairs, should it be neccessay. I'll stop worrying and start photographing. Thanks.

-- Niels H. S. Nielsen (nhsn@ruc.dk), July 03, 2001.

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