Wednesday, April 25 8:11 PM SGT

San Francisco debates sex change benefits

SAN FRANCISCO, April 25 (AFP) - A seemingly unstoppable campaign to make sex changes a paid benefit for city workers here has triggered debate whether political correctness has overstepped its bounds, even in this Mecca of quirkiness.

At issue is a proposal by San Francisco Supervisor Mark Leno for the city to expand health coverage to pay for the operation for those who can obtain a doctor's note indicating they were born the wrong sex.

Passage of Leno's legislation would make San Francisco the only US jurisdiction to provide sex changes as an employee benefit, which also would be available to domestic partners or spouses.

Supporters contend there are 12 to 17 city workers who want sex change procedures or have undergone such operations and seek follow up care.

The city-financed San Francisco Health Service System estimates the number could be as high as 35, not counting domestic partners.

Supervisor Tony Hall stunned fellow board members Monday when he stood up and denounced Leno's proposal moments before the plan was to be voted on.

Hall said he has heard from hundreds of voters, nearly all of whom were outraged at the idea.

"Most of these cases are going to be people changing their gender at the cost of the health system, and the cost of the people of San Francisco," Hall said Tuesday. "This is what they were born with, this isn't society's problem.

"There are a lot of people who are concerned about the size of their existing male appendages and want to increase them. Are we going to pay for that? We have to draw the line somewhere."

He argues that making sex changes part of city medical coverage would be discriminatory, providing a special benefit for a small group of people.

Hall also worries that paying for sex changes, which cost from 35,000 to 80,000 dollars depending on the direction of the switch, could open the medical system to abuse by those who get into domestic partner relationships solely for free surgery.

"There are a lot of people who want things about their body or personality change that aren't covered in our health service," he said. "There are people who don't like the way they look, or the color of their skin. Stuff like this is basically elective."

After Hall voiced his opposition, Leno quickly had the vote postponed to Monday. Two supervisors who were out of town are expected to be back by then and should provide the votes needed to pass the legislation.

Leno argues that his proposal is "about equal rights for equal work" and would allow San Francisco to say to the world "We have transgender citizens living among us. We want to offer them the dignity that this world has yet to offer them for the fact of who they are."

Along with banning discrimination against people who are fat, skinny, tall or short, San Francisco has a law forbidding bias against people who have changed their sex.

"San Francisco and Berkeley have always been breeding grounds for people who think their opinion should dictate things around the world," said Hall. "The health service should not be used to trailblaze; it is a misuse of power."

"It is not the place of the Board of Supervisors of San Francisco to be setting worldwide policy," he continued. "Most Europeans are a lot more level headed and a lot more fair when it comes to deciding things."

Each of the city's roughly 37,000 workers would pay an additional 1.70 dollars monthly to fund the proposed new benefits, which include infertility treatment and Viagra prescriptions.

Hall hopes his decision to stand against what he sees as runaway political correctness will inspire other board members to vote against Leno's plan.

"I'm not unsympathetic to the plight of transsexuals," Hall said. "All of us were born with certain shortcomings, but it is not society's responsibility to correct that."

-- (has PC gone @ too. far?), April 25, 2001

Answers

The sad part about this kind of crap is that is probably makes perfect sense to those who reside in that freaked-out area, but it leaves the vast majority of us absolutely speechless. What a wonderful way to dispose of taxpayers funds! What a place!

-- Kali-LandOfFruit (And@Nuts.com), April 25, 2001.

"for those who can obtain a doctor's note indicating they were born the wrong sex."

You have got to be kidding me!!!

Deano

-- Deano (deano@luvthebeach.com), April 25, 2001.

And just think! One day in the maybe not-too-distant future, when the technology is present, they'll probably be able to change their sexes (although most of us know that you can't really do that -- it's just superficial) back and forth, as the "mood" strikes them. (Oh, yes -- a mandatory psychotherapy session first, of course.)

The most wonderful thing would be a desertion of San Francisco by the taxpayers and businesses, in reaction. Then the ones left can just wallow in their ordinances and rules, and have party after party enacting new ones.

But this time, nobody'll be left to play their game with them.

-- Eve (eve_rebekah@yahoo.com), April 25, 2001.

And just think! One day in the maybe not-too-distant future, when the technology is present, they'll probably be able to change their sexes (although most of us know that you can't really do that -- it's just superficial) back and forth, as the "mood" strikes them. (Oh, yes -- a mandatory psychotherapy session first, of course.)

Um hi eve: BTW, um, they already do that now, cept is um, well, called DRAG. ROFL... and no therapy session is needed....cuz, um, the freaks come out at nite :-)

Deano, did cha ever feel like you just woke from a bad dream? I think they are serious, that IS the scarey part.

-- sumer (shh@aol.con), April 25, 2001.

sumer

Oh, they're serious alright and it's definitely scarey!!

Pretty damned certain I wouldn't 'fit in' over there....;-)

Deano

-- Deano (deano@luvthebeach.com), April 25, 2001.

Nope Deano, you wouldnt @ all.....I've always said "God's gonna take out San fran 1st"....hee heee.

My son lived in California for awhile, and would venture down to San Fran, he and friends, said their were some strangeeee peeps there.

Mind you, hey I aint got nothin against someone walking with S/O on a leash....:-) hell beats the fetish balls they have here in town, and for FREE yet...hee hee.

-- sumer (shh@aol.con), April 25, 2001.

One of my favorite albums over the years is "Switched On Bach" by Walter Carlos. I still like the album even though the person who made it is now known as Wendy Carlos.

-- There's more to (art@than.gender), April 25, 2001.

Wendy (Walter) Carlos

-- There's more to (art@than.gender), April 25, 2001.

sumer

fetish balls for free??!! YIKES!!!

I can just see that here in the bible belt of The South.......;-)

Deano

-- Deano (deano@luvthebeach.com), April 25, 2001.

What can I say? Cleveland Ohio is a lil on the strange side.

Although a suburb here did BAN the fetish balls because they did not like the idea of men being caged up.

Now, me, um, oh heck nevermind.

And NO I caint see that in the bible belt either (veg)

-- sumer (shh@aol.con), April 25, 2001.

It's quite easy, and also quite psychologically lazy, at times cruel, thoughtless, insensitive – you get my point - to poke fun at those who are so very different from us. Kinda saddens me to see it. But then again, perfection has yet to darken my door either. Not even a sniff of its presence within my vicinity. Have at it if you are so disposed.

As each of us reflects on the day, as we sit quietly examining our hearts and minds, perhaps we'll find there is something we could have learned from having had this subject presented to us IF we had looked beyond the cheap laughs.

Maybe not.

I realize many of us here do not know, and have never known any transsexuals, have no firsthand experience with the genitally- challenged (?). This is a pretty rare occurrence, in my experience. Nonetheless, there are people out there who suffer terribly from this condition. These are real people. We share common ground with them, don't you know. Yes. Admit it. We are of the same Genus and species. 'Tis true.

I have no clue what it's like to be unsure as to my sexual preference, or whether I was born with the 'right' equipment. Damn glad about it too. I've known folks who were not so sure, still are not so sure. Confusion reigns within each of them. Real problems of real people. So easy to let our eyes glaze over, point and giggle. All too common.

As to the societal and political ramifications of this proposal: if the San Francisco electorate dislikes the actions of the elected, they will have opportunity to vote for, in the next election, those who are of like mind. Pretty simple in theory.

Personally, I lean libertarian, and agree with much of what Flint has written lately on other threads regarding health insurance. I would not wish to subsidize sex change operations via insurance premiums. San Franciscans may not agree. Wonderful country, this.

-- Rich (howe9@shentel.net), April 25, 2001.

Rich

Wasn't poking fun at anyone, however I find anyone who wants to totally change their gender via surgery to be beyond bizzare!

Just simply not the way I was brought up, I like it and offer no apologies for it.

Deano

-- Deano (deano@luvthebeach.com), April 25, 2001.

Rich, no apology here either. As a matter of fact, IF you only knew.

I know quite alot of folks such as trans, drags, homosexuals, lesbians and some real well. I do not agree with the lifestyle they know this and accept me for my beliefs and the way I was raised.

I have personally as of late met those into the 'fetish' scene, swappers, etc....GREAT people, but I am not into that nor are they into my faithfulness to my spouse, to each their own.

But I admit, seeing someone walking someone else on a leash would crack me up. I dont care if its different or not, and obviously it IS. You must admit, you dont see it much :-)

Sometimes Rich, you are so sensitive, which is a great quality. Not all of us do reflect on each day. Hey, I do well to get thru mine sometimes with a 17 year old blonde hair blue eyed beautiful son who attracts females like flypaper does flies. So I 'try' to lighten the heavy load I carry thru humor.

I HAVE TOO, for me, it is my sanity. I like Deano, wont apologize for having some humor and for me it IS humorous. I've seen the dark side the struggle with those whose families have turned them away, BELIEVE me.

One day Rich, you and I should do an email. If you only knew :-)

-- sumer (shh@aol.con), April 25, 2001.

Sumer, you have my addy. Be gentle though, would you? ;)

One of the benefits of my experimentation with psychotropic drugs early in life was that I learned to look at issues, particularly those quite foreign to me, from various angles. Stretching oneself in this manner takes work and a real motivation to learn - and inner strength to allow one's preconceptions to be bent and broken without experiencing the immediate reaction of 'stooping' to picking up the fallen pieces in order to super-glue them back on again. Sympathy and empathy are two characteristic results of putting forth such effort. Sweat equity.

No apologies are due anyone. I wrote the above that each of us might be prodded to make the extra effort to think and feel, to consider this subject - and matters foreign to us in general - a little more deeply perhaps. Sometimes we become so attached to our philosophies that reconsideration & re-evaluation become cobwebbed from lack of use.

I try to cultivate friends who are not afraid to keep me on my toes, to give me a shove when I become callous and overbearing. Some times a good, firm shove is just what I need.

-- Rich (howe9@shentel.net), April 25, 2001.

Rich, your thoughts are mine. I really have more compassion and empathy for these people than you could shake a stick at. My post was directed at the system, and reflected my frustration with these tax and spend notions. I'm sorry if it came off as condescending towards the others (and I see how you could read it that way); it really wasn't aimed at them.

-- Eve (eve_rebekah@yahoo.com), April 25, 2001.

Eve: Understood. Completely. Thank you for clarifying things for me.

Fortunately there's a guy here named Flint who, at great length, addresses those issues on which I would otherwise spend far too much time elucidating (with much less eloquence, thoroughness, creativity & stick-to-it-iveness) MY frustration with the "SYSTEM" as we've sculpted it.

-- Rich (howe9@shentel.net), April 25, 2001.

Sumer, you have my addy. Be gentle though, would you? ;)

Oh Rich, it wont be to scold just some personal stuff, tis all. You'd be surprised. :-)

I'll back atcha later this evening.

-- sumer (shh@aol.con), April 27, 2001.

Yes yes, to those of us who do not live within driving distance of San Francisco, the city may look like a breeding ground for freaks. However, those of us who have actually been there know that bondage- clad misfits leading their lovers around on leashes is NOT a common spectacle. While I personally do not agree with the new modifications to health coverage based solely on a belief that it will open the floodgates to anyone in need of corrective sugery, be it collagen injections or penis enlargements, I am doing my best to understand. Whether you have "close, personal transexual friends" or not, there is no understanding the position they are in unless you are one yourself. I do not understand the need many of you feel to poke fun at a city you know little about. Yes, San Francisco is a melting pot of cultures, economic backgrounds, and sexual identities, but labling it as a "cooky" place only makes the labler look naive to people who know better. No hostility intended. Please think long and hard before you respond with a short, deadly sentence cutting me down for insulting your opinions. I am not trying to be insulting, nor am I telling any of you that you are wrong. I respect differing opinions, and realize that many of us have been raised in different environments, thus embracing different morals. katie

-- katie gray (kt583@aol.com), May 30, 2001.

I lived in “The City’ during the 70’s and still spend a great deal of time there. Many are surprised to learn how small San Francisco is in population (790,000) and square miles (47). Unless they start building homes in Golden Gate Park, these population figures will not escalate much further.

The Gay community is considerable and the largest concentration is in the Castro District. This is a city that has always prided itself on being ‘wide open’. I don’t think that the Barons of the Barbary Coast, in their wildest dreams, ever envisioned the influence that the Gay community would have on the area. But the gays are but only one of the countless ‘alternative life style’ groups that make up the better part of the population.

Still, it boggles the mind that a municipality would sponsor and finance operations to change ones sex. Can you just imagine the doors this will open?

-- Telinet (like@it.is), May 30, 2001.

I live in San Francisco and find this policy measure outrageous. In fact, I worked for the city of San Francisco for only a couple of weeks (quit about a month ago) before I realized how out of whack the local city government is. To those of you from outside SF, please do not be so quick to judge all residents of SF as freaks and assume that everyone here is okay with these bizarre policies.

I'm personally about to leave the Communist Republic of California for the East Coast (not because of these policies, but because the technology economy here has collapsed). To the chagrin of left-wing fanatics around here, there are actually plenty of intelligent, rational people in the Bay Area with moderate views (even some Republicans!)

-- Boid (Noname@noname.com), June 05, 2001.