Survivor II: your early thoughts : LUSENET : Xeney : One Thread

I was going to wait until we had the new forum, but I can't help it. Are you excited? Are you going to watch? Do you have any guesses about who's going to win?

I already have some guesses, based entirely on the profiles on the CBS page. Here they are:

Possible (like, might make it to the merger):


Good contenders for final four:


No way:


My pick for winner: Rodger
My pick for person most likely to annoy the living fuck out of me: Tina.

Name your picks.

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001


You think Kel and Mitchell are both goners?

Man, I'm not even going to START watching this year. Last time I sulked for two weeks when my Greg got voted off. I don't want to foster an attachment to the boys and then watch them get thrown off the waterfall.

You mean they're not throwing them off when they're done voting?


-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

No! You have to watch it! I have no one else local to talk to about it, because no one watches it in Sacramento because of the early primetime. You MUST watch it!

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

What is up with their luxury items?? Debb, who's no looker, is bringing her eyeliner, another woman is bring lipstick. Some other choices: a backgammon set, bongo drums, a self-made immunity head dress, a songbook, and a frisbee. What is the matter with these people? Shit, I would bring tampons. Or a gun.

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

Oh, I know. That cracked me up. Actually the games I can understand -- good way to get to know people. But nobody brought a toothbrush? Ew.

As for tampons and guns, the producers provide things like tampons, condoms, etc., and I think a gun would count as a survival item, which they aren't allowed to bring.

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

Are you sure they provide those things? I thought I remembered Stacy or somebody from last season saying that having your period on the island was mighty tricky, and it involved lots of jumping into the sea.

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

Beth, no worries, I have been practically counting the days until Survivor II for months, so there is at least one more of us out here who plan on watching.

I don't have any guesses as to who wins, but since Keith is a local "celebrity" from around here, it would be cool if he does well. It would also be cool because I really do believe he would give at least part of his winnings to The Rainbow Connection, which happens to be one of my favorite charities.

I do have one question, though... what in the hell is a "Paella Pan?"

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

Paella is Spanish dish made of rice, peppers, chicken, pork, and shellfish. You make the dish in it's own special pan, a paella pan.

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

Is that what Keith took? He's the chef, right?

It's a round shallow pan with handles on either side, for making (wait for it) paella, which is a Spanish rice dish. Very tasty. Here's a paella pan.

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

Beth, I will watch the whole damn thing, regardless of how much ragging I get from my culture-snobby friends, regardless of how much homework will have to languish undone, regardless of its early hour and promise of suckiness.

And, in a few weeks, when we move, I'll be living with a fine tv set with good sound and a cable connection. I may be inviting some people over. Fear not, local discussion will happen.

-- Anonymous, January 26, 2001

Ugh. Debb is engaged to marry her stepson. Isn't there a law against that?

I could never root for a grown woman who identified herself as 'Kimmi'. I hope Amber doesn't turn out to be the "Survivor Amaya". Jerri justs wants the exposure, and i bet she cries when they see their first big spider. Or maybe that is a toss up between her and Jeff.

-- Anonymous, January 27, 2001

Okay, so Keith either doesn't have a shot in hell of winning because he took a Paella Pan, or he's going to win 'cause he'll be the best at cooking the bugs. I still think it sounds like a stupid thing to take as a luxury item.

I'm also going to be very annoyed with Colby. I can't stand the way the media has already dubbed him our "golden boy," and forcing him at us. It might not even be his fault that I won't be able to stand him, but I see it happening anyway.

-- Anonymous, January 27, 2001

I just finished my pre-survivor commentary on this crop of castaways. It's long so I won't reprint it here, you can see it at I got tired about halfway through so I really stopped even trying to be funny. Sorry about that.

-- Anonymous, January 28, 2001

Man. I'm hooked again. I watched it last night, and I'll be watching it all season, I can tell. I'm such a sheep.

I read a quote from the producer to the effect that this group was far more scheming than the other group, and that Richard Hatch wouldn't have lasted a week with them. I think we saw that tonight, and maybe it doesn't mean they're all vicious and evil -- they're just watching their backs. Debb was irritating as all get out, but she was also perceived as a schemer -- telling people Jeff wanted to be voted off and trying to get people to vote for him. (Note that I say she was perceived that way ... Alicia might have been lying.) I wonder if the vote went the way it did as a result of some pre-agreement by the team members, or if she was just irritating them all equally?

I would have expected Kimmi to pick up at least a couple of votes, or maybe a machete to the head. She hereby replaces Tina as the one most likely to annoy me.

I have a theory about how the voting went last time and how it will go this time, alliances or no alliances: the weak and annoying people will be voted off first, along with any obvious schemers (no one wants someone else to be the Richard). The next to be voted off are strong young men who might be a threat to win immunity. Then it will end up with alpha males, older males who are willing to follow the alpha males, and pretty girls who can pull their own weight. Like last time. (Note that last time, Sue was an alpha male and Sean was a pretty girl.)

I like Rodger. I think he could wind up being in the final four just because he's easy going but not stupid, and he's willing to take orders.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

I think Beth's analysis as to the vote-off order is correct.

Survivor version 'n' can never be as good as the first year, because the players all saw the first show, where Richard was picking people off one by one like lambs to the slaughter. Now everyone's guard will be up all the time, it won't be as much fun as the first time. But I admit it, I'll watch anyway.

I haven't studied the cast in advance, but I did watch the show. I can't quite tell everyone apart yet, but it was fun to watch.

I was tickled that I correctly predicted which group would lose the challenge. The losers (what was their tribal name?) seemed to have not gelled as team. Will they be another Tagi tribe? Tune in next Thursday!

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

Who's bright fucking idea was it to move CSI on AFTER Survivor?

That's it, I'm dropping my Thursday night class. This is just unfair. Completely unfair. Especially now that h is threatening Survior nights in the Mystery House.

My thoughts? It might actually be as good as last time. It kept my attention the whole time, but it felt comforting, like I knew what I was getting into.

I liked Pagong last year (MTV Beach House) and feel the same about Ogakor this year. I'd like the teams to trade Colby for Elizabeth though. "Dur... losing sucks!"

Debb was a good choice, she was the only one who had shown herself as even remotely distasteful.

And I really like Mitchell. I want Mitchell to win. Of course, this now means he will be voted of halfway through the game and I will pout for several weeks (see Greg) and everyone will roll their eyes at me. But that's ok.

I wonder how many of you think I'm kidding about that whole dropping my class thing.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

Elisabeth's immunity thingie was really annoying, as was Colby's "thank God I'm a Texan" bit. I found Jeff pretty irritating, too -- wasn't he the one who said in an interview that Richard Hatch was his hero? Alicia, on the other hand, irritated me a lot less than expected, as did Maralyn. In fact, I think I like Maralyn.

Listen to the video clips at the CBS web site -- Maralyn says Kel is really anal retentive and wants to be in charge. I don't think young guys who want to be in charge will ever do well in this game. I'm still trying to decide whether Michael will count as a young stud or an alpha male ... I think that as time goes on, people might start looking to Rodger and Alicia as the leaders of that tribe. I see the two of them plus Michael as the people to like on that team. The others either left no impression or annoyed the crap out of me.

We didn't see enough of the Ogakors to get many impressions. Jerri came across as surprisingly Stacey-like. It pains me to say this, but if you are a young attractive woman on Survivor, you should probably accept the fact that you will go further and win more money if you swallow your feminism and at least pretend to let a man be in charge. You're playing against middle America, here. I didn't like Stacey at all, but she challenged the alpha males and got voted off. Actually, you can take gender out of that: the younger folks who pretended to (or really did) respect their elders did better on Survivor than the ones who tried to be in charge, and it seems like you have to be at least 35 before the others on this show are going to give your opinions a lot of respect.

I swear, it's fascinating watching this. I am so hooked.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

By the way ... the only change I'm inclined to make to my earliest predictions at this point is that maybe you can swap Mitchell with Jerri on the "no way" list, depending on whether she learns to get along with Keith, or whether she gets Keith voted off. And I don't see her making the final four.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

I think the reason that Debb seemed the most annoying was that that's how the producers put together the episode. There are too many new people, and the location, and the arrival scenes for them to focus on all the Survivors. So they just picked a few likely evictees and focused on them, so that when the vote came we wouldn't all be going "huh? who?".

That said, Kimmi in the tent was driving me nuts. I can't believe she didn't get even one vote. That makes me suspect that some conversations must have been going on already.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

According to Entertainment Weekly magazine, the "Survivor" contestants receive unlimited amounts of suntan lotion (50 SPF), bug repellant, tampons, anti-diarrhea tablets, iodine, Band-Aids, aspirin, contact lenses solution, hand sanitizers, personal medications, and condoms.

I would guess there are usage restrictions, though, because tampon cotton is excellent for starting fires...

Man, I can't believe that out of 16 people not one of them could start a fire. Losers. ;-)

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

What about the fact that when Kucha flipped their raft, Debb sat on her lazy, defeated ass while the rest of them tried to finish the challenge in a show of solidarity?

Come on... working for yourself doesn't fly until after the merge. You've got to be a team player until then, not a pouty child.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

You know, I think we're wrong if we say it won't be any fun anymore because the contestants know how to play the game. They know how Richard played the game, but you can't learn self-awareness from watching a TV show, and that's the downfall every single time. Fortunately it's also what makes this fun to watch. Sue thought she was an honest person and that some people resented that honesty. Dirk thought he was voted out because people thought he was a threat. Stacey thought she came across as shy. Sean thought he was the last good person on the island.

They were all wrong, just like Debb was wrong when she thought she worked hard and was a team player. People are totally blind to their own shortcomings. Watch the people on the show who see themselves as natural leaders, and see how often they're wrong. Watch the people who think they're team players, when everyone else thinks they're whining losers.

Fascinating. I swear, I'll still be watching when they're up Survivor 12: the parking lot at the Boise K-Mart.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

What about Survivor III? Anyone else think it's time for some cold weather? The Himalayas? Siberia? Antarctica? Greenland? Michigan?

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

I was thinking that too, Mar - Survivor: The Rockies, or something, but you know, I bet that will never happen - it is all about the bathing suits, and possible nudity.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

Good point, though Colleen would have been adorable in a big, furry hooded Eskimo coat.

This hot weather thing is getting out of hand though.

Hey, what about Survivor III: New Delhi. Shove them in the middle of a crowded, third world city and see how long they last. Make them sell souvenirs to tourist for enough money for dinner. Instead of eating grubs they could make them eat vindaloo, with nothing to drink. The winner is the one who doesn't die of malnutrion or a communicable disease.

Survivor III: Afghanistan! The special all-woman edition! Each tribe votes a member off and is taken outside and her burqua is removed! Watch the hilarity ensue as the bootee is beaten to death for being so shameless!

"Oh dear, I seem to have bypassed my good taste chip."

Actually, that might raise a little US awareness of the rest of the world. Heaven forbid.

Something tells me next time will be either something on the Amazon or in Africa. Boooooring.

Why the hell am I anticipating next season already? Jesus.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

Debb was irritating as all get out, but she was also perceived as a schemer -- telling people Jeff wanted to be voted off and trying to get people to vote for him. (Note that I say she was perceived that way ... Alicia might have been lying.)

Another possibility: What if Jeff set Debb up? That is, what if he did tell Debb he wanted off and then lied about it to make it look like she was lying? That would be boss.

According to the Survivor site, Deb "quickly emerged as the Kucha tribe's vocal leader." That fact was probably a factor in her getting voted off.

There sure are a lot of annoying people on the show...

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

Mar, wishing she had that old, shorter email address.
I can understand your frustration, but come on. Your new one is a "Red Dwarf" reference. You can't get much cooler than that.
Back on topic: One episode & I'm sucked right back in. I can't wait until Thursday. I have no predictions on how things will go (mainly because I barely have any idea of who's who), but I'm looking forward to seeing how things progress.

-- Anonymous, January 29, 2001

I must confess that I did not watch but 1 or 2 episodes of Survivor I so I'm not very into the psychology of the thing yet. I did watch this first episode of Survivor II and my main frustration was that they didn't show more details of the shelters they built and how they turned out. I was a big fan of Robinson Crusoe and liked all those sorts of details in that book. I haven't read up on the biographies of these people....but I did find myself drawn in, and will probably get hooked. I'm wondering how long the grey-haired woman will last as she is probably near my age. I found myself thinking I could do better than she appeared to be doing. I'm also kind of rooting for the farmer/teacher older guy. Don't know any names yet

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2001

Does "vocal leader" really mean "big mouth"?

Regarding cold climates as locations for Survivor: I'm sure the bikinis factored into it, but there's another reason, which Burnett addressed in an interview last year. When you strand people in a hot climate, the primary surival concerns are water and shelter from the sun. Notice they haven't put anyone in a spot without trees or materials to make a rudimentary shelter, and they've always been close to water. In very cold climates, by contrast, people who go in totally unprepared tend to die. It's a much bigger undertaking to build a shelter that will protect you from extreme cold, and without the proper gear, even an experienced backpacker can die in a snowy area. Food is harder (or impossible) to find, and there is a real possibility of hypothermia or frostbite.

Basically, holding the competition in a cold climate would change the game a great deal, because the producers would have to provide far more in the way of provisions than they have in the two seasons so far.

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2001

You mean they might actually have to try and SURVIVE? ;)

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2001

Oh, come on, they've never made any pretense that this show was about life-or-death survival. They do that (to some extent) on Eco- Challenge, but viewers are more interested in the personality issues. Mark Burnett has said many times that the social interaction is the real survival test here. They aren't really going to put anyone in danger.

I forgot that one of the other concerns he cited about cold weather climates was the cost of keeping a crew warm and fed.

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2001

I swore I wasn't going to watch it, but somehow I ended up taping it. By the time I watched it last night, I knew Debb was the one voted out, so I watched very carefully to see why that might be.

I dunno. I found Kimmi much more annoying. I think Kimmi had made her mind up about Debb before they even got to the tribe site. If Debb was lying about what Jeff said to her, she is stupid, and she deserved to get booted. I think it's too early in the game to be playing that game, if ya know what I mean.

(And as an aside to Debb: You don't love Jeff to death. 'Kay? You've only known him three days.)

I wonder if any of these people practiced making a fire before they got there. I would have.

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2001

I'm right there with you, Laura. I was screaming at the TV about how none of them knew how to build a fire. Not one of these people thought to pick up a few books about "rough" living before they went to live in the middle of nowhere? No one remembered anything from Girl/Boy Scouts?

Wimps, all of them. If any of them had picked this up as an indispensable skill, they would have lasted much longer than they probably did.

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2001

Laura! That is what I was saying the whole time i was watching - that I would have been practicing making fire. Drove my husband nuts.

I think Kimmi is going to last a while - the men won't vote her off as long as they think she might give them some action.

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2001

I was wondering why none of these folks wore glasses (except sunglasses). If I was out "surviving" you better believe I would not wear my contacts and bring two pairs of glasses. I did see alicia trying to start a fire with an ugly pair. I guess they send glare into the cameras.

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2001

Aw, jeez.

You might have heard about Debb hooking up with her stepson after her husband died. And yes, I mean "hooking up" in the way you think I mean it.

There is an eleven year age difference between them, and Debb married her late husband when she was 22. She claims she was never a parent to her stepson, that they never had that kind of relationship, but I just got a terrible case of the willies, and I'll tell you why: my mom was 22 when she married my dad, and she is eleven years older than my eldest half brother. So this is more or less exactly like my mom hooking up with my brother. Which is just fucking nasty to even contemplate.

I'm very glad they voted her off, so that now I can stop thinking about her. Ick, ick, ick.

-- Anonymous, January 31, 2001

OK, so I watched the first one religiously, and would probably do the same with this one without any added reason. But, I have one -- I kind of know Elisabeth. She went to my high school, and for one year was very good friends with my sister. She's very smart (at least book smart by high school standards), and very artistic. Unfortunately, she's also a bit flighty -- I mean, a personal immunity headdress? I totally understand why my sister, upon learning that Elisabeth would be one of the new Survivors, commented that she had had enough of Elisabeth in one year of high school.

One thing I wonder is whether the editors of S2 will be more careful and edit out more of the scheming and alliance building that will almost certainly take place. On one hand, it'll make it harder for the viewing audience to completely understand why a person gets booted each week, but it will also add to the drama, because we won't be able to predict right away which 4 or 5 will be the last ones there.

-- Anonymous, February 01, 2001

I was wondering what that THING on her head was. When I read that it was an "immunity headdress", all I could do was roll my eyes. That's just weird.

Oh, and did you notice that the only time you saw Debb with her luxury-item eye liner one was during the interview clips? She looked like a raccoon. Apparently no one brought a mirror as a luxury item.

-- Anonymous, February 01, 2001

Okay, I don't care much at this point, but I *do* hope Jerri contracts some nasty debilitating disease while she's out there.


-- Anonymous, February 01, 2001

Man, they had to go and vote off the prettiest man on the island.

I'm putting all my hope in Mitchell.

Dear Kimmi,

When one's survival depends on eating an animal, one must ditch their tired vegetarian ideals and do it damnit.

Dear Jerri,

Please Fuck Colby.

Dear Colby,

I hope you find her to be a shitty lay and have everyone boot the miserable cunt off the... damn island thing... out of the outback.

Dear Jeff of Kucha,

Making gagging noises when one of your opponents is about to puke is bad form. Play nice like the token gay boy you are.

Dear Mitchell,

Will you father my freakishy tall children?

Dear Mad Dog,

You stabbed Kel in the back, but I still think you fucking rock. Way to remove that partial ya old pisser!

Dear Jeff Probst,

Strangely I find you more and more attractive each week. I'm scared. Hold me?

Love, Mar

PS. Was it just me, or in the beginning when they're all complaining about food and walking around in the water... did one of them step OVER a crawdad? Because that would be s

-- Anonymous, February 01, 2001


Much like me.

-- Anonymous, February 01, 2001

Dear Mar,

Stupid is spelled with a T.

Please stop posting before you further embarass yourself. Go watch CSI or something.


-- Anonymous, February 01, 2001

Man. I have to revise my picks.

Tina isn't really annoying at all. Jerri is such an incredible bitch that she's not even fun to watch. I hope she goes soon. Alas, poor Rodger; I really like him, but he might not last. And I don't think Michael is long for this world unless he tones it down.

Mad Dog is my favorite. I don't expect this to change.

There aren't many people to like this time around, are there? I really dislike all of the men except for Rodger. Jeff is just as hateful as Jerri; no redeeming qualities with either of them. I'm actually starting to feel like I might stop watching this.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Mitchell is likeable. Tina seems genuinely nice. So does Nick. All is not lost. Besides, it might be fun to watch Jerri roast.

Though if she wins we chalk Survivor up to being the game where the biggest fucker wins and we don't watch next time.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Dude, I was cracking up at the challenge, where Jeff was all calmly saying, "So, hey, that's a grub worm that likes to bury itself..." like he was just passing on interesting tidbits.

I hate Jerri and I hate Jeff. (Unfortunately, Jeff is on my Fantasy Outback team. I'm going to have to do something about that.) I think Tina is really classy for saying, "I screwed up, I should be the one to go." I also like Colby and Mitchell. Nick seems cool. Alicia might be cool. We'll see.

And yes, I'm finding Jeff Probst attractive, too. I need some Valium.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Aaaaargh~!!! That Jerri is a bitch royal (with cheese!). Poor, stupid Kel. And what's up with what's-her-face, "I'm a vegetarian, but I'll eat a worm"...?

I mean, come on. I was a vegetarian for three years. I understand people make their own distinctions on what they will and will not eat (what ultimately did me in was bacon). And cow brains are yucky, I'll give you that. But mammals bad, worms good? I don' geddit.

I'm not sure I like any of these people. I'm not sure that isn't the point. ("Richard Hatch wouldn't last a day with this group," quoth Jeff Probst.) That guy who got up and cooked the rice -- is it just me, or does the Number One strategy during this early phase seem to be just another variation on the old Japanese standby, "The sticking- up nail gets pounded down"...?


-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Goddamn Survivor.

Jerri was ROYALLY pissing me off. I kind of felt bad for Kel, because of Jerri's yabbering and passive aggressive snoopy self. And these people must be pretty damned hungry not to notice all those shenanigans. Grr. I hate being angry at these people. I was never very angry at the first Survivor.

And for some reason, strange and unknown to me, I still watch. Egads.

GO Maddog. She's sassy.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

I hope that Jerri comes down with an embarrassing and debilitating intestinal thing. What a bitch. I think they were wrong to go through Kel's stuff and I would have had a shit fit. I agree with Sei on Kimmi and the brain vs. the mangrove worm. She ate the worm and threw her values away for the win. Poor Tina.

Elisabeth reminds me of Colleen in both demeanor and the way she looks. Michael has a very, very high opinion of himself and Jeff from Greensboro needs to get a CLUE. Ugh. I don't like the majority of the people in this round.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

I've noticed we're back to alternate teams winning immunity challenges again. It's only been two episodes, but it still seems rather suspicious.
Tina was great for saying "I'm the one who should go." If Kimmi hadn't been able to eat the worm, you know her ass would have been voted off the continent.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

I wouldn't have eaten the cow brains. It freaks me out that they picked the one food on earth I wouldn't eat (brains of any sort, really). That's how people get Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

It's interesting, I'm reading everyone's responses and I find the Jerri thing confusing. I am not a fan of Jerri, but I may also have some respect for her because she hasn't "toned down" her personality to "fit in." I get the feeling that a lot of them are only operating at about 50% if you know what I mean. Some of them will start shining through in a matter of time, certainly we saw this during the first season. Jerri's just showing through a little early.

In addition, the editing is very tricky. The producers intentionally want us to be mislead about the people in danger of being voted off. How many of you thought Kel would get every vote - how many of you thought it _would_ be Jerri because of the way she was portrayed? Now, I know she can only be portrayed a certain way because she's actually doing those things, but editing is a key, too.

This show is a study in psychology on sooooo many levels. :)

By the way, anyone out there watch "Gilmore Girls" on Thursday nights? I'm torn not just between Survivor and Friends, but also Gilmore Girls!


-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Too funny not to post. From Page Six:

THERE'S one scene caught on tape for "Survivor II" you won't see on the air. Insiders say that after days of subsisting on rice, the hungry and cranky contestants began to suspect that one man who kept sneaking off into the bush was cheating by secretly eating food he had smuggled in. After telling the producers of their suspicions, they searched through the suspect's belongings, but found nothing. Then they arranged to follow the suspect to his hiding place with a camera crew and catch him in the act. But when the trap was sprung, the suspect wasn't eating-he was pleasuring himself. "He'll never do it again," laughed our source. "He's traumatized."

So that's why Kel really got voted off.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Man, the whole Kimmi-vegetarian thing...I kept thinking "not that I don't understand, but having principles is SO not going to work here." No wonder she downed that worm so quickly, having been given a second chance to save her ass (And I for one would rather eat a dead worm than cow brains. Not that live worm, either!). I actually didn't hate her as much this episode.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

What's the name of the idiot who caught the fish? The one who gave a loud, Castro-lenght prayer thanking God for making him the Leader?

Surely he's gone if the next group loses? Then again, maybe they'd rather vote off someone strong (like Kel), figuring they can outsmart the idiot when the time comes.

I'm so ashamed for liking this show.


-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

So, is it pretty much a sure thing that Kel wasn't sneaking beef jerky, that he was really jerking the beef?

If so, then the rest of them are passive-agressive paranoids--even Mad Dog, who I was so hoping would have more integrity.

I thought Kel was honorable when he confronted Jerri et. al. He swiftly tried to diffuse an awkward situation. To no avail.

Either these people are a lot more vindictive than the cast from the first season, or the producers have gotten better at forming a narrative and/or putting a spin on everyone's personality, be it accurate or not.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Does anyone have Realplayer? What does Kel say about the beef jerky incident in this The Early Show interview.

It looks to me like he was ousted by Jerri's stupidity.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

I didn't see the Early Show interview and I don't have Real Player on this machine, but I did see what he said in a confessional (it's on the website). He basically demonstrated chewing the grass and was just sort of laid back and denied the whole thing. He came off pretty well, I thought.

Oops. Poor choice of words. I didn't see that video clip.

I don't think they voted him off because they caught him masturbating. I think they voted him off because Jerri saw him as a threat, and she rallied the others. Loners are the easiest ones to vote off, and they were likely to be even more uncomfortable around him if they really did catch him whacking off ... can you imagine? First you accuse him of stealing and then you accidentally catch him masturbating? How would you look him in the eye over breakfast?

I don't think Madalyn's vote was vindictive or related to the masturbation. He had been getting on her nerves before, but she stood up for him about the theft. She really couldn't not vote for him if it was clear he'd be the next one voted out, because that would set her up as the loner who'd be the next to go. She voted smart, that's all.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Its hard for me not to see how Jerri's tribe can't see she's playing them like a violin, that Kel probably didn't have any food, and if he did, well, wouldn't the rest of them do the same? That's the part that's really irritating (and of course, addicting) to me (though I acknowledge I am warm, dry, rested, and eating cooked food), both that they can't see and the hypocrisy. I'm pretty sure Jerri's going to win, at this point. Although she's pretty volatile and that could fuck her up.
I think its really dumb to think that the gourmet cook could cook well over a fire. And if he leaves, there goes that paella pan they're cooking their tortillas in. (When Jerri said, "I knew that flour and water would make some kind of dough" I was thinking: "yeah, paste"). And I think Kell should have really confronted them, since his goose was cooked at that point, and told Jerri off. In front of everyone. That's what I want to see!

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

My husband swears that last night's immunity challenge was rigged by the show. It *is* a little strange that Kimmi was going to lose it for her team, then got a chance to redeem herself. I guess it could be coincidence, though.

I just kept thinking, "Those people are so mean!" The Survivor I cast was underhanded and slimy, but they seemed to hide it better.

How can you be a "castaway" on a continent?!

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Survivor Jerri is the Anti-Christ! I'm sure of it.

-- Anonymous, February 02, 2001

Jerri pisses me off more and more with each second that passes. And i was sad that Kel got booted because he seems like a genuinely good guy. Also, is it just me or are the rest of them stupid anyway? Kel was the only one trying to catch fish so that they might have something to eat when the rice runs out. Or perhaps they would rather hang out in their "hot tub" eating Jerri's flour tortillas.

And how much of a prick did Keith sound like with his over the top praising of those tortillas?

I also equate Elisabeth with Colleen, in that she's cute and sweet and low-key. This could help her out a lot.

I really like Rodger, though Maralyn is my current favorite. I was disappointed that Jeff was such a total asshole after being so ungodly cute.

And someone please help me. Mar? Mo? Me too. I sit there and catch myself thinking "Jeff Probst is SUCH a dweeb. Hmm, he looks kinda good though..."


-- Anonymous, February 03, 2001

Okay ... I just watched the Early Show clip that Dave linked to. Nothing very exciting there, but Kel seemed like a good guy. Very believable. He pointed out that their bags were searched beforehand, so he really couldn't have snuck in any beef jerky. He doesn't say so directly, but he gives the definite impression that Jerri made up the story specifically to turn everyone against him, and that the others voted for him because it was easy -- the accusation gave them a reason to vote someone off.

He seemed like a nice guy, and he's way cuter in the studio than he was in the outback.

-- Anonymous, February 03, 2001

OK...on the beef jerky thing, did you hear, Beth, on The Arrow Friday morning that some tabloid somewhere has said it wasn't beef jerky, just jerking? Don't know if that's true, but Bill Fox and Ned made the most of it.

Yes, Jerri is the most annoying person (now that Debb is gone). I'm rooting for Marilyn. Anybody who'd take her teeth out on national TV is one gutsy broad.

-- Anonymous, February 03, 2001

Do the Tina fans who think she was brave for volunteering to be booted because she lost the challenge remember who actually searched Kel's bag? I don't care if it was Jerri-bitch's idea, she hopped on that bandwagon awefully fast.

On the other hand, I still find Jeff funny. The puke sounds were tacky, but it did make me laugh.

I have to agree with Beth that if this level of nastiness is what we'll see the whole show, I'm out of here. My blood pressure does not need Jerri, that's for sure.

-- Anonymous, February 04, 2001

Episode 2 was just absolutely wacky. It was almost surreal. So much of what everybody said and did made so little sense. I mean, there was the beef jerky incident. We go from Jerri saying she *thought* she saw Kel eating beef jerky to half of them thinking he actually was. They actually think he somehow smuggled beef jerky into the outback.

And that prayer Mike said. This is what he said:
Dear God you know I said a lot of prayers today and you answered them with fish for us and I am so happy to be able to provide fish for the troops. I know that this could easily get turned around in some way to make me be the leader of the tribe but this meal is from the bottom of my heart. It makes me so happy to be able to provide for everybody here so... thanks for that. Amen.

Okay, that was kind of a weird prayer, true, but how the heck does everybody get out of that that Mike declared himself the leader? He didn't. No way. Next thing we see is Kimmi saying:
Mike thanked God for making him the leader of the tribe. I don't know when he was annointed but... apparently my back was turned at that moment.

This is followed by similar sentiments for other tribe members. Even the CBS Survivor site claims Mike declared himself the leader. He didn't! Watching people this stupid is painful.

There's just no way I can stop watching though... I thought about it, but no, gotta keep watching. I mean, something really nasty could happen to Jerri and make it all worthwhile. ;-)

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

Whoops, that should read:
"This is followed by similar sentiments from the other tribe members."

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

Well, Mike may kinda act "leader like" (though given the nature of this game how anyone can really manage "leading" I don't know), but you can REALLY tell that he knows any obvious "leader" will be kicked off. He keeps doing the Richard bit, yet goes around saying "I'm not the leader, I'm not the leader!" I think the rest of them are thinking "You protest too much, leader-boy," and that's where they're coming from on that.

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

Stacey is suing CBS and Mark Burnett. You know, Stacey from Survivor I. This is from The New York Times so you might have to register -- but it's free. Apparently she feels like her "ousting" was rigged. To protect Rudy. In that case, thank you, Mark Burnett. Thank you.

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

Oh, jfc, leave it to the lawyer to do that. Was this because the stupid Reebok commercials didn't pay enough residuals?

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

Here's the Reuters/Yahoo article if you don't wanna mess with the Times.

She's saying that Mark Burnett coerced Dirk and Sean into voting her off to save Rudy and therefore maintain the older folks demographic.

Good argument, considering the general stupidity and sheep-like nature of God's Dairy Farmer and The Stupidest Doctor in the World, but it won't hold water. Sure, she's a lawyer but she's going against CBS. They'll just throw some money at her and tell her to shut the fuck up.

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

It ate my "ml" off the url. Sorry folks.

Gonna try again, though y'all know how to cut and paste I'm sure.


-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

"No, Stacey, we didn't vote you off 'cause Mark Burnett told us to. We voted you off 'cause you're a bitch..."

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

Oh, she's just jealous because Jerri is a better bitch than she ever was. She had too many virgins and old guys and gay guys on her team, so she couldn't use her hot little bikini to sway them like Jerri can.

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

And don't forget... She didn't have Jerri's cowboy hat. And the attention of "thank GOD i'm a Texan!" Colby.

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

But wait.

Stacey was like a what, 3rd year at Brobeck? Unless my own prejudices (bitterness?) holds true, that means she's a fairly bright legal mind, and if not that, has definite access to bright legal minds. There has to be *something* to her suit.

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

I can't remember where she worked before, but she is now at Wilson Sonsini. She was admitted in 1998, so she hasn't been in practice very long. But yeah, you'd think she'd have some basis for this.

It does sound like Burnett talked to Sean about his vote. But Burnett would have to be insane to actually mess with the outcome; the show is covered by quiz show laws.

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

There are quiz show laws?

Now I've heard everything.

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

Umm yeah, ever since the scandals in the 50's there have been laws preventing the fixation of the winner. I do believe there were several movies made about it. It's not that wacky of an idea really.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

Hmm. After reading the suit... I'm actually quite inclined to believe Stacey, as much as I didn't like her. Interesting.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

Yeah, me too. That was a little disconcerting, reading that complaint and nodding along, totally believing it could have all worked just like that. Sean's denial didn't contradict her facts, either; he just said he didn't "feel" coerced.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

I will probably lose all of my friends for this, but looking back now, I liked Stacey on the show. I think they made her look really shitty in the editing process, and that they were playing on the stereotype of "woman lawyer=ballbuster nightmare of a bitch", because they knew people would buy it.

I might just be terribly naive, but it would suprise me that a lawyer would instigate a suit like this, unless it had merit.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

There are some lawyers that instigate frivolous suits all the time (see the protective dogs thread and read up on those two charmers), but they're a special class of lawyer. Most lawyers I know are fairly lawsuit-shy, just because they know exactly what a pain in the ass it is to live through a lawsuit. Very few things are really worth that.

Expect a settlement, with a confidentiality clause. That's my guess.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

I haven't had time to read through the whole suit yet, but I read a story yesterday that said Stacey went to CBS with the story and gave them the opportunity to settle with her so that she would shut up (which is what I assume Beth means by a settlement with confidentiality clause), and they didn't do it. Now, it's possible that CBS is just dumb, or has bad legal advice, but I found it telling that CBS didn't settle when they had the chance.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

Actually I'm not surprised they didn't cave before the lawsuit was filed, especially considering she was asking for a spot on another show. That just sounded like blackmail.

But now that a complaint is filed, assuming it survives a demurrer (which, honestly, it looks like it will), she'll have to start coming up with evidence to back up her claims, and I really don't think she'd have gone so far as to file a lawsuit unless she had something. And that's when it gets embarrassing for CBS.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

Well, her luxury item was a camera. Maybe she has a lot of photos of the producers talking to individuals?

I saw Sean "sucking up to the tv people for all it is worth, regardless of what the truth might be" Kenniff being interviewed last night, and he sidestepped it a lot, but did say he wished she won the suit, and that Dirk guy hired a lawyer who is 'no commenting' everywhere.

I hope she really has something to prove this case.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

I read on Survivor Sucks this morning that Dirk will testify on Stacey's behalf, and that he is the one who told her that Mark tried to influence him and Sean. Gretchen was apparently interviewed this morning and conceded that the contestants were influenced behind the scenes -- it looks like they all agree on this -- but says that the fact that they were always told to "vote their conscience" made all the difference.

The thread is here, and there is actually some interesting legal analysis buried in the "I hate Stacey" posts. This could be a pretty interesting case. It looks like it's not the facts that are in dispute, after all, but whether or not Burnett's tampering will constitute "fixing" under game show laws.

-- Anonymous, February 07, 2001

Okay, I was really going to stay out of any and all Survivor discussions, this season, but since this concerns the previous season, I don't feel so guilty.

I just had a couple of thoughts while reading through the complaint.

A) The complaint is stressing the interaction with others as a vital part of the game. We all know this is true. They were sure to note that Stacey persued good relationships with her tribemates.

However, persuing something does not guarantee that you acheive it. Susan didn't like her, and Rudy and Richard voted for her until she was gone.

I don't disagree that she was, more than likely, edited out to be more bitchy than she truly is, however, I don't think she is a complete angel. You can only twist someone's words so much.

B) She is suing for lost prize money.

Was the amount of money that each person received, after being voted off, ever determined? How does she know, if she hadn't been the third voted off, WHEN she would have been voted off? What is this 75K number? Is it arbitrary? Or is it an actual computation of monies lost? If so, how did she arrive at this figure?

C) The complaint also stated that after Stacey was voted off, the alliance between Rudy, Rich, Susan and Kelley was formed; however, Rudy and Richard have always claimed that their alliance was formed from Day One.

On the one hand, it does seem like there is some merit there, especially considering all the support Stacey has from Dirk, but on the other hand, it really does just seem like Sour Grapes.

She's making it sound like if she hadn't been voted off, she absolutely would have been the winner, and we all know that's not true. I think if Rudy had gone third, then Stacey would have been the next Tagian to go.

Unfortunately, that's a complete hypothetical and something we'll never know.

-- Anonymous, February 08, 2001

Stream of conciousness thoughts while I watch the third ep:

Dude, no wonder their rice tastes so bad, they putting it in the pot at the same time as the water. Of course they're going to get glop.

And I hope to hell they didn't toss those fish parts. Keith should know that would make an excellent fish soup with a little rice and stuff.

Howcome they're all unshaven, didn't Kel leave his razor?

Maddog has a beautiful voice and I adore that song.

The challenges are getting good...

Oh god they're gonna give Rodger a heart attack.

Wow. They didn't go one then the other this time... I'm amazed. Bad for my kids in Ogakor though...

Tina! Tina you twat! Oh my god I can't believe you! You're worse than Jerri!!

NOOOOOOO DON'T YOU TAKE MY MADDOG!!! Oh Tina you bitch! *sob* She gave Amber her haaaaatttt....

Man, that's a classy redneck. Waaahhhhhhhh!!!!

*choke* Nice Bud Light commercial.

Bwahahahahaha...hahaha oh god..hahaha Mike... hahaha Mike and the pig blood...hahaha he's Jack from Lord of the Flies! Hahahahaha oh that's grea

-- Anonymous, February 08, 2001

Now this is bizarre. They opened the show with a sound byte of Mike saying, "Dear God, thank you for making me the leader of the troups." It sounded a litle disjointed, like they pieced it together... I have last week's episode on tape, and he never said that (unless it was cut for a commercial or something).

Most annoying player this week: Jeff.

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

Man, I'm torn. I'm pissed that I can't seem to figure out who the hell is going to get voted off each week. I'm mad at Mark Burnett (a.k.A. "God") for making sure the editing is even tighter this time around, so you rarely have a clue as to what's _really_ going down. I'm mad that all the Survivor spoiler websites have been wrong, really wrong. But then again, there's just so much anticipation. At 7:59 last night I'm sitting on the couch, legs tucked in Indian style, two cats surrounding me, just waiting....waiting.

And I got teary eyed when they got rid of Mad Dog. I don't get teary eyed about anything!

Oh, the drama!

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

Man. I was bummed about Mad Dog, too. Looks like the start of "vote off the old ones" once again, and guess who'll get offed next time Kucha bombs. God forbid you ever fall down and look old while doing it. (Anyone else hear Elisabeth say she'd never vote Rodger off and think "$50 says that you'll vote him off next week?") Shoot, Maralyn could actually be useful, unlike Mitchell, who sits around and whines and bitches and is only good for getting stuff off high shelves. (Way to admit you're weak, dude. Blood in the water for the sharks..oh, wait, you think there's no fish anywhere :P)

Once again, the whinin' Kuchas bitch at the idea of someone going after food, even if he's um, doing that Flies thing. (Can't one of them EVER get off their ass and work? Oh, wait, Nick made the kitchen...and Kimmi does the water so they won't boot her ass...) Jeff and Alicia are scary. Bet they turn on each other by next week. And who else was thinking when Ogakor won the fishing stuff, "Gee, maybe we shouldn't have booted Kel, because he actually knew something about this..."

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

I just did another long entry on Survivor here. I'm embarassed by my lack of survivor-predicting ability (although I agree, Elisacolleen will probably vote off the beloved Kentucky Joe next time).

It seems like Ogre-core is just downright mean and selfish, the last people I would want to be stranded on an island with (well, maybe except for Amber, and I sorta like Keith). The koochie tribe seem to be much more into having fun. Sure, it's a game and they know it's a game and they're thinking along those lines, but they are also making the best of the situation, I think. Except for Jeff, he's a bitch.

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

This whole group is so much whinier than the last bunch. It's like they only watched Richard the last time around, so they're all looking out to see who is scheming, and none of them are worrying about what they're going to eat. Mark Burnett said they got a lot hungrier and suffered more, but frankly, they deserve to.

Mar, I'm sorry, but I just can't endorse your Mitchell love any longer. That boy's gotta go. (But I doubt he will, not until after the merger.)

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

That's ok... he's gotten quite pathetic and I will cease my endorsement and sit silently wishing for Greg.

Have I mentioned how much I miss Greg?

Why do they call Rodger "Kentucky Joe"? I'm slow.

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

That was on the CBS website. It was just a nickname they came up with when he said he was from Kentucky. Kimmi calls him "KC."

I notice Elisabeth doesn't call him that, though, and she's the one who likes him. I'm not sure how affectionate it is. It sounds more like they're making fun of him.

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

Thanks a lot, Beth, for making me go back on my "no more message boards" vow. Do you have *any* idea how much time these things suck out of your day (oh wait, of course you do).

I just read the CBS site. They are really pushing to make it look like Jerri, Colby, Amber, and Mitchell are forming an alliance. I could easily see them picking off Keith before the merger, then maybe Tina. Koochie doesn't seem to be scheming that much. Jeff is too flaky to be part of an alliance, Rodger's too nice, Michael is too individualistic.

It could also be that MB Productions is deliberately leading us down this path to "trick" us and that Mitchell may be gone soon, voted out by his compadres. Amber could get in a fight with Jerri or something. I dunno. Still, I don't think it's just good soundbites that have the editing crew focusing largely on Jerri and Michael, I think those two will be in the final 5. I'm not sure who else will be though.

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

Are there rules about what they can and cannot take as their luxury item? Like, they can take eyeliner, but can't take matches?

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

Yeah, they can't take anything that could be considered a "survival" tool. So no knives or matches or anything like that.

Plus, they actually choose three luxury items, and CBS tells them which of those they get to take. I read this in an interview with Debb. I can't remember what her other two were, but they were a lot more sensible than eyeliner.

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

I think it's interesting that a few of the people seemed to take "dual use" luxury items, like Colby's Texas flag which he admitted he took along to use as part of a shelter. I wonder if MB productions will get a lot more strict about that sort of thing in the future.

I also think it's interesting that a few people took games and stuff, probably because of the analysis of Gervase's "charm" and his deck of cards from season 1. Personally, I'd go the way of having something to keep you occupied and help maybe deal with teammates. Something not too competitive though, you know how some people get when they lose at checkers.

That or I'd take my stuffed bear, which conveniently enough, doubles as a good pillow.

I'm surprised no one has pictures of their kids/partners. I wonder if they don't allow that as a luxury item or no one thinks of it or whatever. I also wonder what the rules on clothes are. Do you get to bring changes of clothes? Can you wear like thirty layers on the first day? Are there any restrictions?

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

I was thinking less of them, that no one thought to bring a fishing kit as a luxury item, but now I just think less of them for being kind of annoying and stupid all the time. Thanks!

For clothing, I read somewhere that they are sponsored by a clothing company - they are all wearing the same brand, although I can't remember what it is, and are outfitted for the trip before they are dropped off - I think they bring very little of their own stuff.

-- Anonymous, February 09, 2001

If they're not ever lifting a finger to try to GET food, and voting off anyone who tries, then I think they deserve to suffer.

I also think Mitchell is a whining pathetic jerk who should get voted off ASAP. But if he's under Jerri's spell, that means he's got more episodes to go, until she kills off Keith and Tina anyway *sigh*. Yeah, they're the nastier bunch.

-- Anonymous, February 13, 2001

"I also think Mitchell is a whining pathetic jerk who should get voted off ASAP. "

You got your wish Jennifer, and Jerri loses a slave-boy. Has Jerri overplayed her hand?

I'm so ashamed for enjoying this.


-- Anonymous, February 16, 2001

I'm glad Mitchell is gone. Though, Jerri might have been a better idea because if Colby goes back to her Tina and Keith are screwed. And as much as I dislike Tina, Jerri is six billion times worse. I like Colby and Keith a lot. Mitchell was a shmuck who can't count.

"I spent most of my days and nights thinking about my friends, my family, and food, pretty much. Those four things."

Gee Mitch - friends, family and food are three things.

Hands up who thinks Kucha loses immunity the next two times so Mark Burnett has even tribes merging for a more interesting game? It would be ridiculous to put 3 Ogakor people in there, they'd be gone so fast. It would be interesting to see Jerri have to deal with Keith who she hates, and Colby who she knows turned on her for a couple more days. And I hope it works out like that because I know Kucha will crucify Jerri... Mike will kill her (dude, that was a BABY pig, why didn't he just jump on it and stab it instead of poking at it like a big dork?) gut her and roast her over the fire so his position in the tribe is secure.

And then they can use Jerri's tortillas and her yummy roasted flesh and have Jerritos.

-- Anonymous, February 16, 2001

"On the next Survivor:
Which tribe will be the first to eat long pig? Tensions mount as the tribes learn that the next person voted off will become the prize for the following reward challenge."

-- Anonymous, February 16, 2001

You're right, I'm delighted to see Mitchell Dumbass go =) I hope the Ogawhores continue the losing streak. I'd be delighted to see Jerri go next week while the majority still rules. I hope Kucha doesn't get into losing just because I'd enjoy the pickoff so much.

-- Anonymous, February 16, 2001

Did you notice that Tina said the strategy changed right before the vote? My guess is that Tina and Keith were trying to get Colby to vote Jerri off, but he seemed reluctant. He probably said he wanted Mitchell gone because they need strength for the challenges. Voting Mitchell off was probably the ONLY way to stop Colby from joining with the Devil's Triangle and voting off Keith. Tina has proven so spineless that I'm not sure she can be trusted not to vote against Keith next time (if there is a next time before the merger), and I'm sure Jerri will be working on seducing Colby.

My newest surivor piece is up.

-- Anonymous, February 17, 2001

And Stacey Stillman gets slapped with a $5 million countersuit.


-- Anonymous, February 21, 2001

Two kind of interesting bits I read today:

First, at SurvivorSucks, someone posted this analysis of the intro sequence. That turned out to be the best predictor of who stayed the longest last season, and it's holding true this season, too. Bad news if you hate Jeff and Michael as much as I do, because this makes it look like they'll be around for a long time.

Second, and related to that part about hating Michael, this site has e- mails from Mike and Jerri posted. Mike sure babbles a lot, mostly about Christianity and himself.

He's also a PK (that's Promise Keeper, not Pig Killer, although I guess he's both).

-- Anonymous, February 21, 2001

That Michael e-mail was interesting. He apparently got to know Amber well enough to know that she's an ex-cheerleader despite the fact that they're in different tribes, which suggests to me that they both made it past the merger.

-- Anonymous, February 22, 2001

well, I figure no one gets killed next week, as I don't think the network could (or would) keep that under wraps.

But something is going to happen -- and I wonder if they will have a tribal council?

-- Anonymous, February 23, 2001

I was thinking that they probably wouldn't. I was thinking next week's accident is probably why this season is running 42 days instead of 39. I'm thinking they won't have any challenges next week.

I'm a little confused though.

From the CBS site, under next week episode stuff:

"Ogakor is still one person short of Kucha. Will Ogakor win the much- needed immunity idol?"

Ogakor is one person short right now. Minus whoever gets maimed would make the tribes even. Does this mean that the injured party comes back? Or are they simply trying to be slick with their teasers?

-- Anonymous, February 23, 2001

one word.... tina!

-- Anonymous, April 30, 2001

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