This is the closest thing to doom they could find since Y2K rollover, and they are eagerly awaiting the end of the world under the guidance of their fearful leader Chuck.

clips...

*******

Ladies and gents, pull up a chair, crack a beer or a bottle of screw top red and settle in for a LONG spell. This is going to be a LONG emergency, since the problem is C*A*P*A*C*I*T*Y*. It has very little to do with the bankruptcy that will be announced tomorrow, or the second one that will be announced in a week or so. It has EVERYTHING to do with the fact that for 10 years there have been no plants built in Kalifornia.

the CURE will take YEARS to effect. The Kali'ians won't want to hear that, and will demand that the rest of the region "Share their pain". HOPEFULLY the rest of the region sez "Stick it in yer ear."

Chuck

*******

Good advice Chuck. Oh boy is this gonna domino!!! Just think of the lost hours of production, and refrigeration to that food basket...

*******

Chuck,

If you listen carefully, you can almost hear the real estate prices dropping from here. Would that make loan defaults? Bank defaults? Bigger bank defaults?? Market declines??? More bank defaults???? Systemic collapse?????

*******

The REALITIES of what's currently happening - the various energy crises, ME conflict, Crazy Cow diseases, anti-"Global Warming" experiments, etc, etc. all serve notice that nothing 'doomers' could dream up would be sufficient to account for all problems. Only the timing was ever in doubt.

'Koyanosquatsi' - Life [totally] Out of Balance - time to check out that movie one more time...it's here and it's NOW!

*******

I wonder if Al Gore is on his way there now to fix it.

Army Girl

*******

how many days of spin will the natives take before they get restless? Since the problem can not be fixed short of millions of people reducing their electricity useage (they have shown they are not willing to do this) I'm thinking in about a week people are going to get really pissed off! Then the tanks roll in...

*******

Here we are on January 18, 2001, 2 days before inaugration and we have an emergency declared in the state of CA, the Mideast about to erupt in war, the stock market on the edge of a cliff and who knows what else.

Ray

*******

Just went through a rolling outage at work...lost an entire kiln full of very expensive tile. Can't handle that kind of loss for very long. Our manufacturing plant runs 24/7.

What really blows my mind about this whole mess is the timing...last year this time it was a non-issue...so what has happened between last year and this year? Let's see...the .dot com got the dot beat out of it...lots of businesses closed in this area, lots of techies looking for a challenging new opportunity...that and the CDC is about the only thing that is "OBVIOUS" between this time last year and now....and all of us here on this board KNOW that Y2K (embedded chips and all) was a non-issue right? So someone please enlighten me. Is it all about the money/the middle guy/...or is there more? And if it was just about supply/demand why has it never been an issue before. Were the last nine months the LAST STRAW if you will? I thinks there is more to this "Emergency" than meets the eye.

-- (fun@the.looney.bin), January 19, 2001

Answers

link to thread

-- (end.of.the@world.again), January 19, 2001.

more fun stuff

These folks need to get prepped for the big one. Finally, they are getting generators and other preps. Finally, they are aware of life without electricity.

I think this is God's blessing and gift to CA. You might say this is a vaccine to prevent death from rabies. A little shot of trouble to prevent a worse situation later.

Please pray the leaders begin to publically talk about preparedness issues, esp. earthquakes. It is about time something shakes them up. Please pray the people come out of their slumber. One good earthquake with ruptured water, power, and gas lines and this will look like a party.

-- (heeheehee@it's.armageddon), January 19, 2001.

"Great minds discuss ideas, mediocre minds discuss events and you little tiny minds discuss people."

-- Who (s@id.that?), January 19, 2001.

"and the mentally ill minds discuss doom"

-- lol (i@said.that), January 19, 2001.

LATEST EZ POLL!

Majority of EZ loons think California will become a 3rd World Country!

-- (one flew over @ cuckoo's. nest), January 19, 2001.

Bill Gates would never let this happen.

-- (nemesis@awol.com), January 19, 2001.

One need not be a doomeroid or a conspiracy freak to be concerned about this. Anyone from California want to share their perspective?

-- Lars (larsguy@yahoo.com), January 19, 2001.

Lars,

Of course normal people are concerned about this. The point is that the loonies are happy about it. They can't wait for an excuse to use their guns on some humans instead of squirrels.

-- (rednecks@looking.for.disaster), January 19, 2001.

Actually, Chuck made a good point. Emergency measures may be able to keep the same amount of electricity flowing into California from other states as has been the case recently. However, it doesn't change the fact that California simply does not generate enough electricity for its own needs. That isn't likely to change until new power plants come on line -- maybe a year or two down the road.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13868- 2001Jan18.html

But the desperation of the past few days and the stabs at immediate fixes by the governor and the Legislature have obscured the fact that California's long-range energy future promises almost certain electricity shortfalls, more rolling blackouts and steep price increases.

In essence, many officials have begun to conclude that the state's hunger for electricity has outstripped its supplies, particularly as the rest of the West increases its need for power, making the other states less able to help California.

Kellan Fluckiger, the chief executive of the California Independent System Operator, which manages the state's power grid, said today that even if all the broken power plants in the state are repaired and all the hydroelectric generators have enough water to spin their turbines, "the likelihood remains high" that California will be battered by blackouts this summer.

P.S. -- I don't own a gun. Never have.

-- (in@energy.news), January 19, 2001.

Yeah, but crack open a beer and celebrate?

-- (sheesh@doom.losers), January 19, 2001.

For anyone interested, this the latest potential complication as a result of California's power crunch.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp- srv/aponline/20010118/aponline205853_000.htm

-- (in@energy.news), January 19, 2001.

the CURE will take YEARS to effect. The Kali'ians won't want to hear that, and will demand that the rest of the region "Share their pain". HOPEFULLY the rest of the region sez "Stick it in yer ear."

Chuck

I dont get it. What is up w/the crack bout the beer and the above statement.

Chuck: If you are around, would you elaborate?

Thanks.

-- sumer (shh@aol.con), January 19, 2001.

The Army of California continues its advance. We are on schedule to begin the Gray Davis Grand Canyon Dam in March. The Empire of California has declared Gray Davis to be President-for-Life.

I am beginning to climax.

-- (nemesis@awol.com), January 19, 2001.

How sad it must be to always live your life in fear......

Deano

-- Deano (deano@luvthebeach.com), January 19, 2001.

"Chuck the Fright Driver" LOL

-- CD (costavike@hotmail.com), January 19, 2001.

There were two types of doomers. Those that felt we were in for a disaster and were scared shitless by it, and those who felt we were in for a disaster and were thrilled by it.

Guess to which group Chuck belongs.

-- Clair I. Fication (@ .), January 19, 2001.

LOLOL nemesis!

-- (cin@cin.cin), January 19, 2001.

Chuck is a fucking asshole. What makes that stupid prick an expert on any fucking thing. He couldn't pour piss out of a boot with a hole in the toe and a tap in the knee.

-- Manny (No@dip.com), January 19, 2001.

California is the 6th largest economy in the world, and Las Vegas will go without lights before California. The rolling blackouts have ONLY been a minor inconvenience, and it's a message to the California government from PG&E not to fuck with them. This is all politically motivated and "in-your-face," to the enviromentalists. Dams and power plants will be built in the future, but PG&E and SCE are after rate increases. There will be a bailout, and the taxpayer will lose in the end. Remember the S&L deregulation and ultimate failure? It's the same scenario only we're dealing with the comforts of life. This energy crunch is not only in California, but in Kansas and a few other states. Also, people in California who signed up with other energy carriers are not exempt from rolling blackouts. If you fall into a grid block assigned to you, and it's your turn to be turned off, your going down no matter who you pay your bill to.

One more pin in the cushion. Gas refineries are unable to process gasoline and they are running out of storage capacity. They can't accept anymore oil because they have no where to put it. This means a shortage in gasoline and jet fuel. Oh well, if we don't have power there's no need for us to hop in our cars to go anywhere.

-- prepared (prepared@off.the.grid), January 19, 2001.

The folks at the City of Los Angeles Department of Water & Power are rolling on the floor about now.

-- Barry (bchbear863@cs.com), January 19, 2001.

There is no secret design in any of this. There are high-up people in the CA utilities, the CA government, the CA public commissions, etc, who are worrying about their jobs/appointments right now. This is just a big, messy, visible fuck-up, one without an easy fix.

Intel just said that they don't want to move forward with plant expansions or new plant construction right now because of this. That may be an excuse, just like the "Asian Crisis" of a few years ago was an excuse for lower earnings ('member that?), but it almost doesn't matter - it's hurting the CA economy, which won't help the U.S. economy. And I'm sure it's not fun for the residents of California to not know if their local grid is next - the folks who know will not give advance warning, in an attempt to keep looters away from the affected areas.

-- Bemused (and_amazed@you.people), January 19, 2001.

Christ, I sound like a doomer in that last one. Anyone have any Bourbon? OK. Red Stripe? C'mon, It's FRIDAY night!!

-- Bemused (and_amazed@you.people), January 19, 2001.

Doomers fearing looters!!! Oh, this is just like old times. Chuck is still fright driving? It's good to be home again.

-- Mac the Knife (long_time_pal@w/new.name), January 20, 2001.

"...Las Vegas will go without lights before California..."

Apparently you know nothing about Las Vegas (or who really runs the town) :-)

-- doobie doobie doo....be doobie doobie.... (PatriciaS@lasvegas.com), January 20, 2001.

I'm not in CA. I work more than one job. I should make sure I have all of my dishes and laundry done and ironing done at all times. I'm soooo tired that I don't do that every day.

We've been having blackouts for weeks. I wouldn't normally care, but it's winter and pumping water outside is no fun. I can pump water and heat it on the woodstove for bathing, but I don't have a flat iron and wouldn't know how to use one properly if I did. We have to use a backup non-electric alarm clock since the power became unreliable.

The biggest problem with lack of electricity is staying clean. I hate stinking. I hate stinky people. The wrinkled look is terrible. I don't care what some Paris designer thinks about the chic of wrinkles. I do not appear in public in rumpled, stinky clothing. Never. Won't do.

I take that back. There are worse problems. My job is impossible without power. My local gas stations are helpless without power. My grocery store is crippled by lack of power, and I think the manager got a new rule from headquarters to shut down if the power goes out long -- liability for customers stumbling around in the dark.

The power hasn't been out long enough for us to justify the expense and danger of a generator. Also I'm too tired to hook one up.

If CA doesn't resolve the power issue for business purposes, the businesses will move elsewhere. Life will go on. CA may not need to build more power plants in ten years if industry moves away. In the meantime, if CA residents suddenly show up at my door demanding shelter, I'll put them to work hauling water.

-- helen (b@r.f), January 20, 2001.

If this happened in Joisey, there'd be some responsible people with broken bones or found floating in the river.

-- That's Right (we@hold.them.accountable), January 20, 2001.

You are so correct Patricia. The City of Los Angeles has a private ‘grid’ and the Mormons will always keep the juice flowing for their neon cash cow.

-- Barry (bchbear863@cs.com), January 20, 2001.

"Majority of EZ loons think California will become a 3rd World Country"

Kalifornia already IS a Third World country, complete with small rich intelligensia and large body of under-educated, economically disadvantaged masses. Come see for yourself. It might help to learn Spanish if you don't know some already.

-- Expatirate (-@salis.su.puedes.con), January 20, 2001.

so...the mormons really run las vegas?

-- (cin@cin.cin), January 20, 2001.

Oh yes Cin….since the days of Bugsy S.

-- Barry (bchbear863@cs.com), January 20, 2001.

Well SOMEBODY rubbed out Buggsy. Who were they? And who really runs the Las Vegas gaming industry now? I know Kirk Kerkorian is a major player and he's Armenian. Seriously folks, who are the major power players there now?

Doc, do you have any isights, being a local?

-- Dr. Who (Who@said.who.said.who?), January 20, 2001.

I think the king-pin behind the Vegas Cabal is a mysterious person known only by his code name of "Fannybubbles".

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), January 20, 2001.

"Fannybubbles". Stop it Unk, you are killin' me. Doc must be a real riot in a hot tub. When you are looking for 'power' you need look no further than the MONEY. In Las Vegas the MONEY is spelled ‘LDS’. _____________________________________________________________________

Mormons started Las Vegas.

A small group of members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was sent to Southern Nevada from Salt Lake City in 1855. They were the first white people to arrive. After struggling in efforts to convert Paiute Indians and settle the harsh land, they went back to Salt Lake after a couple of years.

By 1905, the Las Vegas area was home to a railroad stop and a few growing saloons, and Mormons returned to establish their community. They built schools, ran the dairy, opened grocery stores. In 1915, they opened the first Las Vegas branch of the Mormon church.

In time, members of the Mormon church played key roles in the development of the Strip -- lending money that allowed for construction of prominent casinos.

As Las Vegas grew into its modern form, Mormons influenced votes on many public policy issues -- from the initial defeat of the Equal Rights Amendment in 1975, to the curb on neighborhood gambling in 1996.

Mormons also made up the inner circle of caretakers to Strip tycoon Howard Hughes. Later, a case would be made that Hughes willed a portion of his fortune to the Mormon church -- but the claim was determined to lack merit.

Today the city is rife with Mormon social services -- from food banks to neighborhood clean-up efforts. It also is stacked high with Mormon public officials -- from the superintendent of schools to state legislators and city council members.

At the junction of vice and piety, where the decadence of the Las Vegas Strip meets the modesty of the city's suburbs, the Mormon church stands -- and has always stood -- affecting the flow of development, the standards of neighborhoods, the delicate balance between an entertainment-based economy and conservative residential values.

"Our faith is very strong. It is a way of life that influences a community," said Ashley Hall, the church's public affairs director in Clark County.

"LDS people have certainly played a significant role in Las Vegas in maintaining a community and a moral climate in which to raise families and do business," Hall said. "Along with many other good people."

In Clark County, about 6.6 percent of the population is Mormon, according to UNLV's Cannon Center for Survey Research. Many religious leaders say that the Mormon population is actually higher -- about 10 percent of Clark County, compared with 2 percent nationwide.

Although faithful Mormons do not gamble -- ("The church officially opposes gambling on the traditional Christian basis," said Doug Nehring, an assistant recorder at the Las Vegas Temple) -- the Mormons' tradition of civic involvement and business acumen helped establish and maintain the tourist city based largely on the appeal of casinos.

"You can raise the question of 'How can good Mormons be involved indirectly in gaming?'" Hall said. "But to us, business is business. Gaming is not illegal in Nevada."

Hall echoes the sentiments of one of the key figures in the development of the Las Vegas Strip, banker Parry Thomas.

Thomas, a Mormon whose wife is a direct descendant of famed prophet Brigham Young, financed dozens of casinos through the Bank of Las Vegas beginning in the 1950s. Thomas worked with Teamsters leader Jimmy Hoffa to finance some casinos using union pension funds in the 1960s, and later procured casinos for Howard Hughes. At one time, Thomas owned the Riviera hotel-casino.

"I personally feel that Parry Thomas is primarily responsible for the growth of Las Vegas," developer Irwin Molasky told the British Broadcasting Company in a television interview this year.

When Thomas was asked about the apparent conflict between his religious principles and his involvement in gambling, he said that before starting to finance the casino industry, he struggled with the moral imperative:

"Should we extend credit? Should we do business? Should we accept deposits? Should we be in any way be involved with gamblers -- these dirty, filthy gamblers?" Thomas recounted in the BBC's 1998 documentary "Las Vegas and the Mormons."

"Well finally it dawned on us that in Nevada, gaming was legal, and as bankers, we were entitled to support every legal entity." ____________________________________________________________________

First in, last out.

-- Barry (bchbear863@cs.com), January 20, 2001.

"You can raise the question of 'How can good Mormons be involved indirectly in gaming?'" Hall said. "But to us, business is business. Gaming is not illegal in Nevada."

Too bad prostitution is illegal in Clark County. After all, "business is business". Driving to Pahrump is a drag.

-- Sheri (Sheri@Sheri's.Ranch), January 20, 2001.

And I can see some rednecks from CA going to Las Vegas and using "transformers" for target practice. I'm expecting things to get REAL ugly. There's a lot of investors pissed. I heard that utility exec's sold their stock in their company right before the dive.

-- time will tell (timewilltell@weshallsee.not), January 21, 2001.