Happy New Year everyone.

I'd like to get people's opinion on which lightmeter to use for a Leica M2. I've been doing some research on lightmeters and I've narrowed down my choices to either three:

1. Voigtlaender VC; 2. Sekonic L-208 Twin Mate; and 3. Gossen Pilot 2.

I chose the three above because I'd like to be able to attach the meter on the camera's flash mount. Which would you recommend of the three? Are there other lightmeters that you can recommend if not any of the above?

-- Ron Gregorio (rongregorio@hotmail.com), January 03, 2001

Answers

Sorry, the title should have said "Lightmeter opinions for M2" only.

-- Ron Gregorio (rongregorio@hotmail.com), January 03, 2001.

Ron,

One of the other participants on this site and I had a talk about this before, but I couldn't find it in the archives, so maybe it was off-post via personal e-mail. Essentially, after many inquiries and much correspondence, we found out that for all of the positive reports on the Voigtlander meter, it has one important weakness. The meter must be aimed for the subject, (the meter has an angle of view matching the 90mm lens), but unlike the leica MR meter, you must match diode meter by turning an f-stop and shutterspeed dial on the meter while watching the LEDs. The problem?... How do you maintain the aim while looking down at the meter? If you hold the camera at eye level to aim it, you can't see the meter... if you look at the meter, you can't sight it. The narrow angle of acceptance of the meter could lead to an inaccurate reading if not aimed at your true subject... especially in tricky lighting. The MR meter was better because you sight the camera, and while still at eye level, press a button on the meter, which caused a needle to deflect to indicate the correct exposure. Upon releasing the button, the meter froze, allowing you to set the f-stop / shutterspeed combo for the subject. My feeling is, if you want a camera mounted meter, this is the best. Another advantage is that it mounts and couples to your shutterspeed dial, so you need only set your f-stop after checking the meter needle.

I also have a Sekonic L 308. I love it. It has incidence, reflective and flash metering. After the reading, you can toggle through all of the possible combinations for the exposure, picking the best for the subject. It goes to a tenth of a stop, and is smaller than a deck of cards.

-- Al Smith (smith58@msn.com), January 03, 2001.

I agree with AL and am a long time user of the Leica meters. The only drawback to any of the shoe mounted meters is that you loose the shoe if you wanted to use a wide angle finder or flash. You also need to be careful putting it on and off especially on a pristine camera-- people even put tape on the top plate to prevent scratches. The later, battery powered Leica meters are very accurate even in fairly low light, and I really like the fact that they are shutter coupled-I can work almost as fast as with an in camera meter. I usually get every single shot on a roll exposed correctly with the Meter MR I have on my M3. It is very handy that the meter holds the reading of what you aimed at while looking through the finder. If the Voigtlander does not hold the reading, you might as well just carry a small meter in your pocket or hanging from your neck. For the $200 they get for it, you could get quite a nice meter.

-- Andrew Schank (aschank@flash.net), January 03, 2001.

The Sekonic L-208 Twin-Mate with the same angle of acceptance as the MR-4 Leicameter has a button which locks the reading for a short time, long enough to aim at eye-level and then hold the camera where you can read it, just like the MR-4. A minor advantage to the MR-4 is that it is coupled to the shutter speed dial. Major disadvantages to the MR-4 are the high price for one in good shape, the need to find Mercury batteries or use a substitute or adaptor, the lack of some parts availability so that repairs involve cannibalizing another meter in worse shape, and the relatively slower reactivity of the CdS cell as opposed to the silicon cell in the L-208. The Sekonic is by far the best clip-on meter available new today. The only disadvantage is the esthetics. If you want your M2 to look authentic then an MR-4 is de-rigeur.

-- Jay (infinitydt@aol.com), January 03, 2001.

The Sekonic meter costs about $150 and that's about what the MR meters go for a decent used one. I just checked out the Sekonic product page and that is a nice little meter. The ability to do incident readings is an advantage.(of course you'd have to probably remove it from the show for that) What does it look like sitting on an M camera? Does it get in the way of the shutter speed dial or stick out into your forehead?

-- Andrew Schank (aschank@flash.net), January 03, 2001.

The MR-4 (with the side switch) meters I've seen in 9+ or better shape have been in the $250-350 range, due to the collector market. I don't know what the Sekonic looks like on an M, I have seen them in the sales pictures, etc. One thing they have over the Leicameters is they could be fitted to an M6 or M6TTL as a backup if the internal meter happened to conk out.

-- Jay (infinitydt@aol.com), January 04, 2001.

My MR-4 works great, looks terrible and was around $125US. The black chrome meters wear faster and look worse quicker than the silver chrome meters, so that is what I would recommend you get. If your camera top plate is not scratched already put a bit of tape on tha bottom of the meter to keep it that way. The angle of the meter is easily adjusted by loosening the three screws securing the foot to the meter and then turning the two small adjusting set screws. I am happy with my MR-4 though it does not see too much use now that I have a M6TTL.

Cheers

-- John Collier (jbcollier@home.com), January 04, 2001.

I just picked up a chrome MR-4 for my meterless cameras for $120 US. Works perfect - even looks good!

-- Ken Shipman (kennyshipman@aol.com), January 04, 2001.

That's an interesting observation regarding the Voigtlaender VC. I'm sure that it's something that I would have regrettably found out later on if I had bought it first without asking this question. It looks like it's either the Lieca MR-4 meter or a handheld Sekonic meter that I'll go for. I'll check out ebay and see if I can get a good deal on a black MR-4.

-- Ron Gregorio (rongregorio@hotmail.com), January 06, 2001.

Just an update, I bought the Voigtlaender VC instead of the MR-4 or a handheld meter. Basically, it came out cheaper than I expected ($180).

I found out a way to overcome the problem mentioned by Al above. First, I set the aperture on the meter and the lens with the Voigt VC mounted on top of the camera. Second, I place my right index finger almost on top of, but a little bit in front of, the LED display, which is on top of the meter. I'm also careful not to cover the photosensor in front of the meter. I then meter the scene by placing the meter at eye-level (almost directly in front of my right eye) and by covering the metered scene with the light meter (which covers approx. the focal length of a 90mm lens). The bright LED display lights (red>-green- I preferred this to the MR-4 I handled because it was just a bit more complicated to take the MR-4 off my M2 than the Voigt VC, due to the MR-4 being coupled to the shutter speed dial on the M2. I also like the way the VC looks on top of the M2. It seems like it was made for M cameras because it fits with the body's lines. The only problem I encountered with the VC is that it's easy to press the On button because it protrudes at the back of the meter. However, the meter stays on for only 10 seconds of not activated all the time.

Thanks for everyone's the suggestions anyway.

-- Ron Gregorio (rongregorio@hotmail.com), January 11, 2001.

Let me repost again, since some parts of my message was cut off:

"Just an update, I bought the Voigtlaender VC instead of the MR-4 or a handheld meter. Basically, it came out cheaper than I expected ($180).

I found out a way to overcome the problem mentioned by Al above. First, I set the aperture on the meter and the lens with the Voigt VC mounted on top of the camera. Second, I place my right index finger almost on top of, but a little bit in front of, the LED display, which is on top of the meter. I'm also careful not to cover the photosensor in front of the meter. I then meter the scene by placing the meter at eye-level (almost directly in front of my right eye) and by covering the metered scene with the light meter (which covers approx. the focal length of a 90mm lens). The bright LED display lights (red>-green- I preferred this to the MR-4 I handled because it was just a bit more complicated to take the MR-4 off my M2 than the Voigt VC, due to the MR-4 being coupled to the shutter speed dial on the M2. I also like the way the VC looks on top of the M2. It seems like it was made for M cameras because it fits with the body's lines. The only problem I encountered with the VC is that it's easy to press the On button because it protrudes at the back of the meter. However, the meter stays on for only 10 seconds of not activated all the time.

Thanks for everyone's the suggestions anyway."

-- Ron Gregorio (rongregorio@hotmail.com), January 11, 2001.

Sorry, I think the ">" key had something to do with it, this is the last try:

"I found out a way to overcome the problem mentioned by Al above. First, I set the aperture on the meter and the lens with the Voigt VC mounted on top of the camera. Second, I place my right index finger almost on top of, but a little bit in front of, the LED display, which is on top of the meter. I'm also careful not to cover the photosensor in front of the meter. I then meter the scene by placing the meter at eye-level (almost directly in front of my right eye) and by covering the metered scene with the light meter (which covers approx. the focal length of a 90mm lens). The bright LED display lights (red, green, red) reflect on my index finger so that I can see the lights and adjust the shutter speed dial on the meter at eye- level to get the correct exposure (green light). Finally, I adjust the M2's shutter speed dial by taking my eye off the meter and looking at the M2's top plate. This is the only time I have to move the camera from eye-level."

I just felt like clarifying this for those interested.

-- Ron Gregorio (rongregorio@hotmail.com), January 11, 2001.

Ron,

I think that if Cosina had simply placed the LEDs on the rear of the meter, ala Bessa L, the meter would be very much improved. You could meter by using your right eye to see the LEDs (albeit blurred), while framing with the left.

As nice as some of the offerings from Cosina are, I believe the placment of the LEDs on top was not the way to go. Glad it works for you though.

-- Al Smith (smith58@msn.com), January 11, 2001.

Al, you're 100% correct on this one. I don't know what they were thinking by placing the LED display on top. There's lots of space in the back where it should have been placed. They could have also recessed the On button, or they could have made it a switch. If I could design a flash-mountable lightmeter for the M2, I would include a window similar to the "eye" on the DR 50/2 Summicron, which covers the viewfinder. The LED display would be incorporated in the window where one would see it as one looks through the viewfinder. Oh well, at the moment, I've found another purpose for my index finger.

-- Ron Gregorio (rongregorio@hotmail.com), January 11, 2001.

Cosina states 30 degree metering angle (which is close to 90mm lens). This is the same angle as my Gossen Luna Pro SBC meter without attachments. I think the meter was designed to be used below the eye level (mid-chest) to set up the exposure. Camera then brought up to eye level, focus and shoot. To me this allows for candid set ups. I hold my Gossen at the middle of my height to take a reading. If I use the spot attachments then there is optical sighting built in. 30 degrees seems normal to me for a hand held meter.

-- Jon Ladd (jonladd@mediaone.net), June 24, 2001.

I've been using the Voigtlaender VC meter, hand-held, with my M2. It's pretty accurate and aiming it hasn't presented a problem. It's so small, I can stick it in my pocket.

-- Dennis Couvillion (couvilaw@aol.com), September 20, 2001.