Sorry I haven`t been posting much recently, but it`s been a busy few weeks for me. Christmas preparations have taken up much of my time, of course, but apart from boring food shopping, I`m all done and dusted! Pressies all wrapped, cards sent, tree up (most of the time)! I`m thinking that I should have followed Yelli`s advice and instead of my usual artistic decoration, I should have just laid the tree on the lounge floor and scattered the baubles around - Bentley seems to prefer it that way! Anybody seen the advert with the cat that goes `clubbing`? Boy did I miss out there - Bentley could have done that blindfolded!

I could have done with the extra income too! While Yelli was having an exciting time at the Arsenal match, I was rushing her other cat `Jarvis` to the vets with a blocked bladder. In consideration of the fact that this is a predominantly male BBs, I won`t go into detail about the treatment - suffice it to say that after day and a half at the vets I was presented with a very grumpy cat, and a breathtaking £225 bill! Ouch!

Christmas here is a pretty traditional affair, with all the usual trimmings. Always enjoyable, but for the first time ever, all three of us could have happily done something different - maybe gone away for the holidays. (Especially New Year`s Eve - I detest it!) I`m also finding the demands of two sets of elderly parents quite hard work too, though there have been some very interesting snippets of family history come to light over the last couple of weeks.

Off to sort the washing out now - I shall continue my ramblings later.......so you`ve been warned! (;o)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Answers

Ramble on Gal, ramble on!

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Okay - upstairs done - first load of washing in!

Pete`s family have always been a bit of a mystery - not just to me, but to Pete too. But in a recent trip to see them in Cornwall, there were some revelations made which were fascinating.

Though Pete remembers very little about it, there were several tradgic events early in his life. To give you some background, when Pete was eight years old, he, his sister and his Mother were involved in a car accident on Christmas Eve. Pete`s Mother was killed in the accident, his sister was just a toddler and was unharmed, and Pete had pretty sever injuries. He doesn`t remember the accident, or anything prior to the accident. Pete`s sister, just to complicate his family history further, was not fathered by Pete`s Dad (her father is `unknown`.)

Two years later, Pete`s Dad remarried - to a lady who by sad coincidence had lost her husband on the very same Christmas Eve that Pete`s mother had died. He had driven his car after drinking too much, hit a tree, and had been burnt beyond recognition. (Pete had only previously been told that he died in a car accident - he hadn`t been aware of the full horrific circumstances).

Anyway, with such awful events in the family, it`s understandable that the family history was never really discussed, and Pete couldn`t give me a single piece of information about anyone in his family apart from his Dad. However, Pete`s Dad, for some reason, possibly the Claret, started talking about his Dad (Pete`s Grandad). Fascinating stuff. By all accounts he was a bit of a ladies man!

Originally married to an American lady (of some substance apparently) and having a daughter from that marriage, he fell in love with Pete`s Grandmother, (who by all accounts was stunningly beautiful and considerably younger than Pete`s Grandad). Pete`s Grandad was 54 when Pete`s Dad was born in 1914. He must have been bowled over by this lady, because she was only `in service`, and quite outside his usual circle. I`m quite intrigued to find out more about Pete`s Grandma, but I didn`t want to interrupt the flow!

It transpires that Pete`s Grandad continued to be a bit of an old devil - not much liked by the rest of the family for being a `stage door johnny`). Apparently the house was always full of theater folk, most infuriating that Pete`s Dad couldn`t recall the names - the only one who was stuck firmly in his mind was a character called Uncle Will, who was, in fact Will Hayes.

Pete`s Grandad was also in the London and Scottish Regiment with his elder brother - who according to Pete`s Dad, was killed in the Zulu Wars. He thought it was at Rouke`s Drift(?), but I did a bit of research as it`s pretty well documented, and couldn`t find a name that would correspond in the list of fatalities. So I`m guessing that maybe is a bit of family `folklore`, and he was maybe killed in an earlier skirmish. I shall continue my search on that though.

Now Pete`s Grandad died of bowel cancer when Pete`s Dad was only nine. And Pete`s Dad was brought up by his sister (who was only a few years older!) Sadly she is now deceased too. Which leaves me with a bit of a mystery as to what had happened in the mean time to Pete`s Grandma.

The only thing his Dad told us about her, apart from the fact that she was a real `beauty`, was that her brother was the Duke of Northumberland`s butler! He travelled with him everywhere, and was allowed to take the family to visit the Duke of Northumberland`s London residence - which was/is(?) spectacular. His country seat was at Aycliffe(?) according to Pete`s Dad. Wouldn`t it be interesting if he had been recruited into the position of butler in the North East, and Pete`s maternal Grandmother had originated from there too!

As I said, a very revealing twenty minute conversation - from no family history one minute, back to 1860 the next! (:o)

Since then I have been totally absorbed in trying to build up the family tree - my side to, which has had some interesting results.....

I`ll save that for later to-day. (;o)

Good job Sting`s on holiday, he was complaining that my postings were too long!

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Gal
Why don't you go the whole hog and adopt the penname Cookson ?

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Sorry Pit Bill - I do tend to ramble a bit, don`t I! (:o)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

That wasn't an attempt to stop you rambling, pet, it's just you don't need an imagination if you've got stuff like that lurking in the woodwork. :-))

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

I must admit, it really whetted my appetite for digging a bit deeper, which I have been trying to do on the internet over the last couple of weeks. Trouble is, other more mundane things keep demanding attention. I`m hoping that I can find a few days over the holidays to really spend some time searching.

I`ve also learned to proceed with a bit of caution. I rather clumsily pushed my Dad into a conversation about his Dad, when I was telling them about our Cornish visit. Although, like most people of that generation, my Mum and Dad are constantly regailing us with stories of what it was like `in the War`, Dad has always been very tight lipped about the death of his father.

Like thousands of other merchant seamen, my Grandad was lost at sea, and suddenly, at the age of fourteen, Dad was the man of the family. But I was really taken aback to discover that, even a couple of weeks ago, Dad still had very big problems dealing with it. Of course, after fifty odd years, he doesn`t think about it as often as he did, until I blundered in shook the dust off.

The only information they ever received, was the standard `missing - pressumed dead` telegram, (no details whatsover) and a standard unsigned letter with his posthumously awarded medal. Dad was an apprentice at Swan Hunters, or possibly Wallsend Slipway, I can`t remember which - and from then on he was the breadwinner of the Gray family!

Dad had heard a story that someone, possibly from South Shields, had survived the sinking of the Empire Turnstone, then spent time on a Japanese Prison Ship, and survived the sinking of that, and for all these years my Dad`s greatest fear was that a similar fate may have befallen his Dad.

Well, me being me, I had to start doing a bit of sniffing around on the internet. Once again I was quite surprised at how much can be gleaned, even in a couple of hours searching. And I am so pleased that I did. The information that I have found, while not changing the fact of my Grandfather`s death, seems to have done my Dad so much good. After tactfully ascertaining whether or not Dad would appreciate more information, and I have to say he is soaking it up like a sponge, we`ve managed to piece together quite a lot.

The exact co-ordinates of where Grandad`s ship went down, the route it was taking, it`s destination. Just south of Iceland en route for Port Sulphur. The history of the ship - built at the end of the First World War in Portland, Oregon - when it was renamed and handed over to the British etc. The number of the Convoy, the name and number of the U boat that torpedoed it, which was itself sunk in the Bay of Biscay later that year with `all hands lost`.

Being ex merchant navy himself, all these little details mean such a lot to Dad. We also concluded that we could find no evidence to support the story about Japanese Prison Ships in the Atlantic, and in hind sight, Dad feels that it was probably either mis-heard, or a kind of `urban legend`, which is not surprising in the circumstances. Dad also felt, with some degree of reflief that survival time in October, in the North Atlantic, even uninjured, would be mercifully short.

So many fascinating (and terrifying) fact about the Battle of the Atlantic which Dad didn`t realise were available now, including some powerful and moving accolades and tributes to the merchant seamen. I personally have been totally bowled over by the whole `Atlantic` story (and now have a list of about fifty books I want to read!) I have a lot more stuff to add to my ever growing family history file too, but most of all, in a way, and I make no apologies for sounding pathetically sentimental, I feel as though it has helped Dad get some sort of closure on the death of his father, but at the same time it`s kind of helped him get him back too. (if you understand what I mean).

On a lighter note, in the course of my searching I came across a site called NE Diares 1939 - 45. With every war related incident that was reported in the North East. Well Mum and Dad are just loving it! Mum used to tell us about their closest encounter with a bomb, when one landed on an Anderson shelter in Glebe St., just behind them - and blow me, there was the report in the Diaries. Also lots of other information on the site about films, music, shop prices etc., highly entertaining in fact, and well worth a look. (:o)

BTW, that was the site that you sent me Duncan - thanks! (:o)

I expect you`ve all nodded off now - and I know that you all must have tales in your family of a similar ilk - but now you know why I have not had much time for posting in the last couple of weeks! (;o)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Just a little postscript to that - I also came across a report from HMS Firedrake, that at the beginning of November 1942 they picked up four bodies from a raft from SS Empire Turnstone. I am currently trying to find out (without success so far) if the bodies were ever identified, and also how/where they were buried. It would be amazing if one of them did happen to be my Grandad......I`ll let you know if I find out.

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

What an absolutely fantastic story Roz.
I'm sure you're probably right in thinking that you may - after all these years - have helped your Dad achieve a closure on an open-ended tragedy that will have lurked in his subconscious all this time. Even his participation in the research will have helped him, I feel sure.

Having got just an inkling into your complex family history, we can probably all understand just a little better the 'femme fatale' that all these geet hard Geordie blerks on here have come to appreciate so much.

BTW, the vet would probably have put the cat down for about £10!!!

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

40p. for a teapot spout brush, and I could have sorted the problem myself Clarky! Ouch - maybe not! (;o)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

More power to your elbow, Roz. Fascinating. Keep it coming.

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Galaxy

The word "Cookson" was uppermost in my mind as I read your piece and I see Pit Bill came to the same idea.

There's some great material there that would make into a novel or 3 plus I'm sure you're fascinated to dig deeper for your own interest. Keep up the good work and I hope you can still remember your old BBS mates when you're rich and famous.

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Gal
If you like, I'll have a word with Waterstones in the town to get them to organise your first signing session. How about it, eh ? ;-)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Rich and famous - ooh I wish!(;o)

No it`s purely personal interest, and a desire to have some sort of chronicle to pass on to future generations. I know that not everyone will be interested either, but at least if I make a start, and it doesn`t get thrown away, even if it skips a generation or two, someone in the family will pick it up and be interested.(:o)

Pete has another slant on it - he suspects it`s my age, and a subconscious fear of death, and thinks that I am just searching for a sense of continuity. Trust him to wizz on my bonfire! You wait till I find conclusive proof that he has Geordie roots - that`ll laarn `im! (;o)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

God I must remember to wear my glasses, I thought you said `singing session` - then I nearly choked on my coffee! (;o)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Very fascinating history, Galaxy! What I know of mine isn't anywhere near as exciting. Do keep up the research. I'm sure it will be of interest to future generations of your family.

The problem with my family history is no one ever wrote anything down nor were terribly interested in the past. Once I started getting interested, my grandparents were too old and senile to remember much beyond scattered details. Someday when I've got a bit of time and money it will be fun to see what I can find out with the scattered bits of information. Great thing, the internet! :-)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Exactly the reason that I felt if I didn`t make the effort now, I would never get the insights into my Grandparents generation. But it`s worth looking Ciara - it`s amazing what you might find.(:o)

-- Anonymous, December 15, 2000

Galaxy, brilliant pet, so nicely put over, crowd is shouting for more. never bothered too much about my past apart from two true stories that spring to mind. My Granda, Big Bill Largue (french connection moi) was at the time (40`s) the strongest man in the area, the only man who was capable of lifting this gigantic stone in the village (The Leazes) He had fought in the Tyneside Irish as a machine gunner winning medals for bravery which were intended for me but I never did receive, Having survived the war, years down the pits he died in the most bizzare of circumstances , after visiting the local known as and hosted by the famous `Jack Allan` center forward Newcastle Utd, 1932 Cup Final fame, he walked into a hawthorn bush which pierced his eye and he died a week later, My grandma (nee Gartlan) who died in 58 never once told me where she came from, a tough lady but gentle with it if you get my meaning. Moving on to 1970 having just come out of the marines I was living in Dunston , The News of the World in those days (may still do) used to have on most pages little boxed four liners in bold print , looking for people,unclaimed money . I did not see the original which read `Anyone having knowledge of "Scotch Johhny Gartlan" please contact Solictors, Merrion Square, Dublin. However this scheming Auntie and her workshy husband did and travelled post haste to Dublin, without saying anything to other members of the family. The solictors must have took the deadly duo to the cleaners cos I then received a visit from my mothers sister who explained things and felt I should be entitled to something as my mother was dead. I sent my details and as much of the family tree as I knew which was precious little to Dublin and thought no more about the matter. nine months later on a Saturday morning the postie delivered a most welcome surprise for me, a sizeable cheque, at least in those days which enabled me to get the white stuff for the house, my first car, (Beetle), nice holiday. Also a letter depicting the share out in organagram form, I was one of the top three equals, fifteen on a lesser amount and over thirty on a much smaller amount. The money was left by two old ladies, obviously related to my grandma whom I had never met or even heard about in conversation. Suffice to say the deadly duo were way down the pecking order and "Scotch Johnny Gartlan" last seen in Ryhope ,Co Durham never did make an appearance. Can be productive as well as interesting Galaxy.

-- Anonymous, December 17, 2000

Nice one Buff! I just love `true` stories, so much more fun than fiction. Same with humour - I love listening to someone relate a funny `true` story, rather than telling jokes.(:o)

-- Anonymous, December 17, 2000

Galaxy, do you have the web site address for NE Diaries? I'm sure it would be very interesting.

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Can`t do the old html thingy Kegsy, but the address is

http://www.swinehope.demon.co.uk/NE-Diary?index.html

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Typo in there, it`s a / not a ?

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Galaxy
There's a very effective way to counter ageist cracks. Every time you're in their vicinity, just sniff the air.

Curiosity will eventually get the better, and you'll be asked to explain what you're playing at, to which you reply that you're just checking for incontinence, and as soon as it's detected, you're putting them in a home.

Works every time with me. :-))

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Oh you are so cruel Pit Bill! (;o)

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Thanks Galaxy, it's swinhope not swinehope but I managed to log on okay. The strange thing is that none of the pages seem to open they all refer to .404 meaning the page doesn't exist. Weird hey?

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Hmmm - so not only can I not do html - I can`t type accurately, and I need my eyes tested (yet again!)

I`ve just tried it again myself Kegsy - and I`m navigating the site OK. So that is a bit odd. (:o)

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Don't worry Galaxy, I'm having one of those days and everything is against me. Trust me this is probably my worst Monday on record so I wouldn't expect something as complicated as a web site working for me!

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

You're tarring me with the wrong brush Gal. It's people sniffing in my vicinity that does the trick, is what I meant. ;-))

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Another cracking thread. I don't underestimate the time you must have spent piecing this together, not least in actually broaching the subject and getting the details out of your relatives before it was too late. Sadly, I think we left it too late as a family (my father and both grandparents having passed away) although I've been meaning to piece bits and pieces together. The only Cookson-esque melodrama I'm aware of is some story about my geat great grandfather. My grandparents were very methodist and I remember my father always talking about a shameful 'secret' in the family. When we eventually managed to get to the bottom of it, it was just that my g. g. grandfather's first wife died young, after having had I think two kids. He was a shipwright. After his wife's death he married what we think was a German or Polish immigrant, whose name was ? Gnant, who already had two kids of her own from an earlier marriage. So the two sets of kids basically grew up together as brothers and sisters.. and as you've probably guessed, two of them ended up getting married, and seemingly ostracised at the same time (the practise of interbreeding so popular on Wearside was obviously frowned upon further North). Anyway, right up to my grandfather's dying days about 5 years ago, he still thought that his grandfather had married his own blood sister, until we managed to prove to him (via birth and marriage records) that they weren't.

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Great stuff Windy! What a lovely story. (:o)

-- Anonymous, December 18, 2000

Don't put it off any longer, Windy, cos you'll regret it. My father spent years and years in Oz trying to get the dosh sorted to get my mother out so they could marry, but when the crunch came, she didn't want to leave my grandparents, so he had to come home and marry her.

I think he regretted the rest of his life having to come home, but he died before it occurred to me that there might have been some interesting history there.

I've regretted not talking to him about it more than I did.

-- Anonymous, December 19, 2000

Sadly I already have left it too late to get much info directly, which is probably the most fascinating thing. I suppose it's something you think about more only when you've got kids of your own. When you're younger, the past seems dull and irrelevant and there were always loads of things preferable to spending an evening listening to your grandparents reminiscing (football being an obvious exception ;-))).
What I do still want to do though is piece bits and pieces together from what other people have found out. One of the brothers of the abovementioned g. g. grandfather ran away to Canada when only 12 or so (probably to get away from the scandal that wasn't a scandal) and ended up becoming a something in Calgary, possibly Mayor. In fact I think it was his relatives getting in contact (North Americans being very into this tracing one's roots thing) that opened up the sore again - I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't even get much help from my grandfather.

-- Anonymous, December 19, 2000