I am presently teaching about patriotism and symbols of our country to lower elementary children. I love what our constitution and symbols of our country are supposed to stand for (flag-blue for truth, red for courage, white for purity etc.). I can teach these things and be rah rah for the old U.S. of A. or I can tell them some of the truth as to how things have changed. I'm not quite sure how much to tell them. They want to respect the members of our government but the truth is that they aren't really all that respectable. We have discussed the 2 Chronicles verse about a land being healed if they seek God and turn from their evil ways. It says alot about God's forgiveness but I know my kids have no idea how far we have strayed. Just wondered if anyone would have an opinion on how to approach these issues with younger children without killing their patriotism or scaring them? Thanks!

-- Denise (jphammock@msn.com), December 10, 2000

Answers

I teach it by comparison---God said " Thou shalt not kill" and America said " let's bomb the life out of them" ! God said "Thou shalt not steal" and how did America get the land she possess's ? I trust the individual mind of a child to sort thru BS and locate truth. When they scream that isn't fair than I tell them that the fair comes once a year and if you study hard and save your pennies than you can go to it ! I urge you to treat children more precious than gold and teach your children the truth no matter what the text says to teach. They can either be our greatest asset or our worst liability and that lies solely in the teachers hands. Teach truth.

-- Joel Rosen (Joel681@webtv.net), December 11, 2000.

Denise. I agree w/ Joel, kinda. Teaching how the republic was set up and about the founders is great. I suggest you contrast that w/ examples of history where those original ideals weren't followed.

Finding examples of the latter shouldn't be too difficult. We never really did that in a formal way when we were teaching hx. But referenced often to the news and current events (still do this) so they could see how actions by individuals in our government or bodies of the government didn't follow the original intent of the framers.

The more they see and reason the clearer they will understand. One thing I'm proud of is our kids BS meters are pretty accurate. John

-- John in S IN (jsmengel@hotmail.com), December 11, 2000.

Hi Denise. Good question to be pondering. It is a delicate balance. I do concur with Joel, the bottom line must be truth. But parceled out, as they are able to absorb it. The good news, is that we have (as a country), much to be thankful for and proud of. And of those things that do not measure up to biblical standards can be discussed and shown to be in opposition to the Word of God. How individuals are dealt with and how Nations are dealt with. Blessings or cursings. The big picture shows clearly that we are sinners. We come back to this time and again. And that even the really "good" guys dealt with sin, perfection will not come until Jesus Christ reigns over His earthly kingdom.

As it is with adults, children can understand and be comforted with the knowledge that God knew, He knows and there is nothing new under the sun. Also, it is important they understand "degrees". The "degree" to which our country operated under biblical principles. The "degree" to which individuals accepted these biblical standards as the norm, and other values/standards were clearly "outside" of this accepted standard.

History and government provides wonderful biblical lessons. I think that to teach these things without the bible would be very difficult. One thing to keep in mind, is the "discernment" our children will be learning as we teach them layer upon layer, that they will be able to sift, sort and shake out......

But the foundation must be the Word of God and everything else is built on that. The history lessons we learn in the bible are so aptly applied to our history as a Country. How society's either accept or reject God and what the consequences are. Righteous leaders vs ungodly leaders vs lukewarm leaders of Nations...how God uses them all, ours included.

Hope this makes sense. BTW, my children are 7, 5, & 3. They have a very good understanding of our government and our history. Principles, principles, principles! Specific workings of government will come as they get older. God Bless! Wendy

-- Wendy@GraceAcres (wjl7@hotmail.com), December 11, 2000.

Just to be obnoxious, Joel, but the original translation is not "Thou shalt not kill", it's "Thou shalt not murder . I'm still not sure who the judge of murder vs non-murder was supposed to be, but that's just one of the erasor-edits in the Bible that heve occured in the many translations and revisions. Have a nice day!

-- Soni (thomkilroy@hotmail.com), December 11, 2000.

Haven't had time to think about this one, but I want to applaud you for caring so much about what you're teaching your children. This is a very important subject, good for you.

-- Cindy (atilrthehony_1@yahoo.com), December 11, 2000.

Hi Denise,

If you don't want to squash your children's enthusiam, then help them to become part of the process. This is a republic that has elected representatives, right? And you may agree or diagree with what they say and how they vote. So get you kids searching on the Web for their state and congressional representatives. Find out what they're doing. Send them an email. If you're afraid about Big Brother watching, then get their mailing address at the state house or Washington and send them snail mail. Politicians love to get letters from kids. You can tie it in with lessons in English, spelling and grammar. And who knows, you may even get a response. :)

(:raig

-- Craig Miller (CMiller@ssd.com), December 11, 2000.

As an addendum to my earlier post: Backwoods Home Mag has a 6 part series going called "the Coming American Dictatorship" by John Silveria. Part 2 out now. Very informative for both kids and adults.

Some of you may not like the magazine in general- somewhat militant libertarianism at times. Don't let that stop you from enjoying this, so far, excellent series. Rated G. At their website. John

-- John in S. IN (jsmengel@hotmail.com), December 11, 2000.

Yes, we need to teach children about the warts as well as the good things, but I think that for the little ones, the warts should come in much smaller doses than the good stuff. Let's not disillusion the small children too soon -- they lose their innocence too early as it is. They don't need, while still very small, to be troubled with any more adult problems than can be helped (I know they are going to be exposed to some things unavoidably). My feeling is that the warts shouldn't be taught much before twelve years of age. Let them have their childhood as free as possible. This is one thing I did wrong with my children -- I had serious concerns about where the economy and the world would be going, and wasn't trusting God enough, and in trying to prepare them to survive in what I thought might be a very bad situation, I gave them too much to worry about too soon.

-- Kathleen Sanderson (stonycft@worldpath.net), December 11, 2000.

Denise, As with every subject, start with the Bible. God set Israel up with a good government. When they obeyed, they prospered, when they disobeyed, they were oppressed by the nations around them. Our country had a good start too. We use Peter Marshall's material and David Barton's material for the younger and older ones. Marshall has material for every body young and old. I agree with one of the other posts that with the young ones just teach how it is supposed to work and as they get older and wiser show them how it has failed.

Truth at all times is vital but we don't give our children all the details about sex all at once or even tell them everything about our own pasts.

Also, our children will reflect our own cynicism, disrespect, and lack of trust if we are not careful. We have had to watch ourselves so that we present a respect for our President because God put him there as his minister. It is possible to respect the office if not the person. "Salute the uniform" as someone said.

You know what they are ready for and what they are not. Keep up with current events. Explain our freedoms. Compare it to other countries. Show how we must be ever watchful to protect those freedoms just as the Israelites were to be ever watchful and obedient. Our ungodly rulers are a result of disobedience as a people. Teach your children how to be good citizens of the Kingdom of God first and being good citizens of the US will follow.

I think the best time to really learn about how far our country has degnerated is probably from about 8th or 9th grade on. It is important that by the time our children are readly to vote, that they can really understand the importance of voting for godly leaders. I was clueless the first time I voted. Just voted for whom my parents were voting. I will teach my children to be more discerning.

Pray and seek the Lord in this and all matters and I'm sure you will do fine....not my promise but God's.

-- Heather (heathergorden@hotmail.com), December 11, 2000.