I sometimes find myself making disparaging comments about rich people that I would never even think about making about any other segment of the population. Do you think I am motivated by thinly-veiled jealousy (not being rich myself)? Am I just a big ol' jerk? Or, if you don't want to point out my personality flaws: why do a lot people make catty/bitchy comments about rich people with the greatest of ease?

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

Answers

How do we define "rich"? Having servants, or having his'n'hers SUVs? Being one or two standard deviations to the right of the median under the bell curve, or way out in the tail?

Also, do you think rich people (by whatvere definition) make snarky remarks about you? And how do you feel about it if you do?

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

Hmm. I was referring to the friends I have with trust funds when I wrote "rich", but I know that is a really narrow definition. And I'm sure that they periodically complain about me, but I don't know if they ever bring my lack of personal funds into their complaints. I'm not advocating mocking all rich people; I guess I was wondering why a lot of people (including myself) are more free with bitchy comments about 'em.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

Some people are born wealthy, some achieve wealth and others have wealth thrust upon them. If you're one of the former then you don't know what its like to not have that holiday or kiss the cat when you get a tenner up on the Thunderball. The rich and they know no different types are an easy target and quite right too - do they give proportionately as much back as we do? On the other hand, the ''boy done good' worked for their wealth types don't deserve the abuse - just charm them, marry them then get a quickie divorce and an out of court settlement. Miss Spears are you reading this?'

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

I think it's more acceptable to be bitchy about people with money because, hey, they can cry their fucking tears with some hundred dollar bills if it bothers them that much.

I'd watch out with who you're terming rich, though. A lot of people you'd think are rich based on their possessions are actually in severe debt because it's all on credit.

As for trust funds and inheritances, if you have one, it's down to someone bestowing that gift upon you. It can happen to just about anyone.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

Except me Jackie cause everyone in my family is dirt poor.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

I've been po' and I've had money and money is better. The misery it bring is easier to tolerate due mainly to air-conditioning. The trick is to be happy with what you've got because if you're into "keeping up" or one-upmanship, you're going to be miserable no matter how much money you have. I've never been envious of people with more money because I've always felt I could have it too if I was willing to make the sacrifices it takes. I have been entertained by the antics and presumptions of people with "real" money, however. I've worked very hard to get what I've got and when I detect a sneery attitude from someone, I feel sad. I haven't had a "paycheck" or a "job" in twenty years and my mind doesn't even work on those levels anymore.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

GForce, you could still end up with some kind soul leaving you a monetary gift in their will or something. You just never know...

*goes to edit will*

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

Arrrg, one of my buttons. My, hopefully, soon to be last, job based performance evaluations not on work, but wealth. If you couldn't talk about your portfolio, new car or house, you were an outcast. I was verbally abused almost daily for 3 years. They hated single moms or anyone who had any kind of personal struggles. I was told by HR not to talk about my personal life. I was told to talk about Orchids (they all collect them) or chocolate. No shit. My lawyer has 15 single-spaced pages of everything else I was told.

A guy I went to grad. school with was always very independantly wealthy. He informed me that the first job he lucked into netted him six figures last year. His wife is an Ob/Gyn. I tried to be humorous and asked if I turned myself into a charitable contribution, would he make a sizable donation, but the reality is it hurt like hell.

I've become very, very selective about who I talk to about my personal life. Empathy is one step from abuse.

I've never met a down-to-earth and generous rich person. I know that most charities get their money from hard working folks. It is very tragic when bad things happen to people, but do you think Christopher Reeves would really be donating so much time and money to spinal cord research if he were still Superman? I'll take my stump away now.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

I have met some down-to-earth outright nice rich people. I can think of a handful right off the top of my head without even trying. And some privileged brats who think that being born wealthy is a license to sneer.

I think we just remember the nasty folks longer. The rich people that I know who are nice I thought were nice long before I even knew they had gobs of money. But the nasty folks, well, somehow money seems to come up in conversation rather quickly.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

Vicki, I'm speechless. My Gawd....

Like Bubba said, I've been both poor and, if not rich, then financially comfortable at various times in my life, and I agree, having some money is better. That horrible, soul-sucking feeling when you can't pay bills and don't know who's going to call and harrass you next... that sinking feeling when you know you can't even afford that $2 used paperback novel for a class... having to refuse invitations to go out with friends or family because you know you can't pay your share of a couple drinks, even....

But on the other side of things, right now, after years of work, I'm out of school and me and The Husband-Type Man are comfortable. We just bought a great house and have been able to travel some. This is due to 1) hard work on both our parts and 2) a *very* careful, anal- retentive budget. But something weird's been happening in my family... maybe because my mom's been bragging about how "well" we're doing, or maybe because the monthly trips back and forth from each coast *sound* a lot more impressive than the work-related/frequent flyer mile stuff they really are... but some of my family members have pegged us as "rich." We're not. Far from it. But now various cousins and such are making disparaging... and wildly inaccurate, I might add... remarks about how "rich" we are and how we can afford to buy such-and-such and we aren't having children because we want to afford to buy nice things instead and we don't know what it's like to struggle and (the one that especially burns me) how isn't it nice that Dwanollah married a rich guy who can take care of her- Whaaa? I've been absolutely gobsmacked when one of my Hanfordian cousins (yes, THOSE cousins) made snippy remarks wanting to know why me and THTM didn't buy her children expensive birthday presents because "It's not like you can't afford to!" Um, dearheart? There's a vast difference between being able to afford to pay one's bills and rolling in surplus cash... and maybe we'd send you cards and presents again if you could bother yourself to send us a token card for birthdays and holidays or even a thank-you note? Another cousin was supposed to come by our house and pick up our boxes from moving, because he and his wife were moving a month later. He got lost, and ended up in a bad neighborhood. He ranted to his Grandma (my great- aunt) that "I thought they lived in a mansion! I thought they lived in a nice area!" Huh? Unreal.... It's actually beginning to really bother me, to the point that I think I'm going to have to "have a talk" with a few relatives if the comments don't stop.

Really rich people, the trust fund kids, the ones who get cars and trips and college educations without struggle, and people who're surface-oriented and buy for labels and status, however, I think are deserving of at least a *little* bit of bitchy commentary! I mean, my scorn for the Spelling clan has no bounds....

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

I hate it when people say stuff about how the rich can be just as unhappy as the poor. I think yeah, they can have their hearts broken, but I'd rather have a broken heart than a broken heart with an empty stomach and rats and roaches all around.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

I hear you Gwen...I've been there. I've always tried to help the truly disadvantaged because of my experiences. I put myself through college and graduate school by driving a cab until 2am because I had a family to support. That's the worst shift. You can get killed and drunks puke in the back and you have to clean it up. I walked door-to- door at businesses selling advertising for a magazine that didn't exist yet (try that if you think you're tough) and had people sneer and even write down my license plate when I left. On the other hand, there are people who just don't put out the energy or make the sacrifices necessary to succeed. Because I own a business, I've had people think the easiest way to make money is to sue me for some imagined slight or other crackpot reason. Those people hunger after a better life, but won't clean puke to get there. Or do without. I have no sympathy for them, just contempt.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

Oh, one more thing. Some of the rich, privileged types I went to school with often rode in my cab on the weekends with dates and acted condescending, etc. But a lot of them are either unemployed, working for daddy, or have a job where they're only paid what they're actually worth and they hate the world.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

A lot of people think my family (meaning my Dad and stepmother) are rich, and make snarky comments about the kind of cars they drive or vacations they take or whatever. What those people don't recognise is that my father's worked his ass off for years to get to where he is. When I was three years old and my brother was a newborn, my Dad lost his high-paid job at Ford due to lay-offs. He worked a lot of shitty jobs for the next couple of years, because the economy was so bad and he couldn't find a job in his field (he has two university degrees), including bartending, which left him feeling horribly guilty for serving people he knew were probably alcoholics. Our family probably wouldn't have been able to get by without the help of my grandparents, who brought groceries and treats for my brother and I every week, took us out to lunch and bought us the stuff we needed that my parents couldn't afford, and even lent my parents money so we could scrape by.

When my Dad finally got a decent job, I remember my mother crying because she was so happy. He worked his way up through the company and is now the President & CEO. My Dad is one of the nicest, most down-to-earth people in the world, and he dislikes nothing more than people who think their shit doesn't stink. My Dad makes a lot of money, but he also volunteers about twenty hours a week with various charitable organisations, and has done so since he was not-so-flush. He's well-respected and a pillar of his community, but there are still those who would begrudge him his success because they feel he has something that should be theirs. Apart from making no sense, I think these people are bitter and probably holding themselves back from achieving what they'd like to in their lives because they're so consumed by what others have and they don't.

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000

I quite agree w/ Jackie and BC. There are some people who are willing to work very very hard toward not only financial success but interesting careers and comfortable lives...and then there are people who would like to reap these benefits but aren't willing to make sacrifices to get there, often don't even comprehend how many sacrifices are involved. When I see people with more $ than me I figure they've been willing to make even more sacrifices than me, whether giving up more of their leisure time or time with their family, or maybe they're more willing to give up their own shot at a career and trust their financial future to a guy than I am. Or maybe they're less willing to spend their time chatting on a fun bulletin board, heh.

But if someone were to imply that I got what I have by getting some kind of lucky break, it makes me think of all of the years I've spent studying my brains out, pushing myself to take the hardest classes I could comprehend, and then working two jobs and saving it up for the next semester's books and fees, and it kind of makes me want to kick my foot up their ass so far I'd lose my shoe.

There are certainly some people who will have it easier, whether due to their family's wealth or connections or what have you. But envying them does nothing but waste valuable energy you could be using to improve your own lot in life, and anyhow no one ever said that life was fair.

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000

When I was a teenager, I envied the hell out of rich people and even disliked them a little. Then I met several nice rich people and got over myself. I thought about how I'd feel if I somehow got rich and then people hated me for it.

A few years ago my husband's niece told me that she likes to break the hood ornaments on expensive cars. She said, "Those people are rich. They can afford to fix it." I asked her how she'd feel if she busted her ass so she could afford a nice car, and then punk kids vandalized her car once a week or so. She played it off, saying she wouldn't care, but I hope she actually thought about what I said.

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000

I know nobody cares, but the reason my grandparents were able to help my parents out when times were tough (I do believe we made use of foodstamps for a while, there) is not because we come from a long line of money or anything. My grandparents came over from Poland, my grandfather quit school at 16 so he could make money for his family during the Depression, and he went on to work in a steel mill for 45 years. During those years, he only missed one day of work, and according to my Dad, he was practically on his deathbed and the only reason he didn't go into work was because he couldn't walk two feet without throwing up. When he finally retired, he got a nice golden handshake and pension, every penny of which he deserves. He earned the right to be able to help out his family in times of need and pay cash for his cars and give everyone nice presents. If I ever get really rich, I'm sure it won't be through having a work ethic as solid as his or my father's.

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000

You've all given me a lot of stuff to think about. Thanks!

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000

oh therw was this real rich kid in mytown. he thot he was soooooo coooooool just cuz he drove brand spankin new geo metro! he would just cruise up and down the street in that thing i thot it was ugly and thot by then bf gremlin was alot cooler

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000

Word. I've been broken-hearted and depressed when all my bills were paid up and I was doing okay financially, and I've been broken- hearted and depressed when I've been heavily in debt and wondering how I am going to eat, much less put gas in my car so I can get to work to get a paycheck eventuially to go towards more bills, etc., and it may suck to be broken-hearted and depressed, but it sucks even more when you have financial misery tied into it.

All things being equal, it is a crock to say that being financially secure is no big deal. Money is a form of power. If you have no money, even if you don't owe anyone anything, then you have limited options because nearly everything costs something and most people don't work on the barter system anymore. Heck, most of us don't have tangible skills that we could use to make anything useful to barter with! If we had a nuclear holocaust and were stumbling around trying to survive, how much good would your ability to crank out RILLY KEWL PowerPoint slides do you? It'd be the folks who had some proactical earthy skills that would be able to survive. Not the folks who can't even sew a button on their own clothes ('I'll just give that to my personal tailor to take care of').

If you want to travel, then logding, transportation and (if you leave your country) legal documents all cost a mint. If you want to move from one household to another, you have to have bucks to put down as a deposit, plus $ for the inevitable hidden expenses like more strapping tape and lightbulbs and so on. Everything costs money. When you don't have it, due to financial mismangement, poverty, cumulative misfortune, unemployment, whatever...you really feel it. It's not even that people are so materialistic, though that is a factor. We keep trying to buy happiness by throwing gadgets and new stuff and toys into the gap of self-worth within and they're only temporary fixes if you're deep-down depressed. And if the Joneses have something, then by GOD we have to have it, too! We all, myself included, buy unnecessary crap that doesn't contribute in any way towards our basic needs (food, shelter, etc.) because we want our toys. It's not the buying of toys that is so satisfying, it is having enough expendable income that we can afford to do with it what we want to, no matter how foolish or short-sighted, that is the motivator (I think).

I've been surrounded by the extremely wealthy and priviledged all my life. I went to private schools and my grandparents had memberships at the local yacht club. All that crap. Yet we are truly the working poor. (If my father hadn't died when I was very young, then yes, perhaps we would have more material goods, but we wouldn't be better people because of it.) I've worked for pocket money since I was 6. I had peers who were getting brand new cars every year from age 16 on up and going on European vacations each summer. I didn't begrudge them this, and most of them weren't evil people. It is those who thought that their material possessions and good fortune made them superior to others that I--and others--didn't much like. Those who felt that the poor were poor only through laziness, not ever due to any other circumstances. Those who had never had to, for even a minute, deny themselves a whim. If they wanted something, they whipped out their allowance and paid for it, and then scoffed at those who couldn't do the same, accusing them of being financially irresponsible.

It isn't money that makes people intolerable and obnoxious, it is their lack of compassion, empathy and tact. Some of the nicest people I know are so wealthy it would make your eyes pop out and roll around on the floro with shock. And some of the most evil people I know are poor. And vice versa. Money has nothing to do with attitude and behavior towards others.

That said, money is a clearly a social lubricant. The more you have, the easier it is to recover from setbacks. A lot of problems go away if you throw money at them. If you're sick, you can go to any doctor and not worry about whether or not you can afford the prescription medicines he'll put you on. If your companion animal is ill, you can afford to take them into the vet every day until the problem is taken care of. If you hate your job, you can quit and look for another. You can afford to take classes if you want to do something else in another field. You can be a full-time student your entire life if you choose. You never have to worry if your car develops a "funny sound". If your computer is old and obsolete, well, [a], you have one and [b] you can upgrade, with all the bells and whistles. If you want to move to another country, you can bypass a lot of immigration hassles if you can prove that you have $X in the bank and won't be a burden to the country you want to move into. You can have a home anywhere you want to have one, if you have money. If someone wrongs you, you can afford to sic lawyers on them, legal fees be damned, until the problem is resolved. If you don't feel like cooking, then you can go out to eat. If you have an accident, you don't have to worry that your belongings will be repossessed while you recover. If you don't like how you look, you can join a gym, or have beauty treatments, or even have elective surgery if you're that crazed about it. You don't ever have to worry about transportation, parking or even driving if you have enough bucks, you can pay someone else to tote your carcass around. You don't ever HAVE to work if you don't want to, so you have no empathy for anyone with a work ethic and no personal life, nor do you understand why someone would put up with a shitty job one second longer than they have to, or take one that is unpleasant--out of desperation--in the first place. If you have a chunk of money, you have no frame of reference for how it feels to live on ramen, 57 soup and Captain's Wafers for two months while trying to put your English or Art or whatever degree to good use. If your dad is president of the United States and you read some statistics that say children of presidents end up bums and that scares you, you don't have to DO anything yourself, you can have a baseball team bought for you to manage. Money is power, like it or not. And I suspect that it isn't so much the money itself or the goodies that piss us off, it's the flaunting of power and privilege that really annoys. Someone who has never known want or deprivation or had a worry that money couldn't be thrown at, who has the ill manners to behave towards you in a way you don't like...it just adds that little extra *grr* factor. Especially because it isn't necessary to treat other people like poo.

Anyway, there ya go.

-- Anonymous, November 09, 2000

Alright, enough of the excuse-making on behalf of rich people. You know they're being snarky about you, too. I'm not rich but some people have seen some of my material goods and decided to be semi-snarky. All mild stuff. Usually things such as, "you make too much money, you really need to have kids."

But if you've made some "disparaging comments" about those rich bastards, let's hear 'em!

-- Anonymous, November 15, 2000

This is for Paul, who asked for my disparaging comments!

Most of said remarks involve somewhat-gentle-to-not-so-gentle-chiding, like when my trust fund friends (TFF) complain that they don't have time to return videos or go grocery shopping, and me and our other friends scratch our heads and think, "You don't have jobs, you don't volunteer anywhere, you don't have time-consuming hobbies...all you *got* is time, people!!"

I guess if I'd thought more original question through more, I would have asked why people feel more free be judgmental of rich people.

-- Anonymous, November 15, 2000

And I guess if I proofread at all, I would have realized that that last sentence only vaguely resembles English...but I think you got the gist of what I meant.

-- Anonymous, November 15, 2000

I like to tell rich people, "That bag is SO five minutes ago."

Just kidding. I tell them, "You think your poo doesn't stink? Huh? HUH??"

Just kidding. Sometimes when our rich in-laws go to Hawaii for the zillionth time or buy something really expensive, Paul and I say, "Must be nice." That's about it. Okay, actually, we used to say way more than that. But it hardly counts because those people are family. You can rank on your rich family way more than you'd rank on rich strangers, I think.

-- Anonymous, November 15, 2000

Yeah, I tell my dad "Must be nice to be rich" all the time. But I also know he was poorer than me growing up and when he started out on his own.

-- Anonymous, November 15, 2000

I've been in the place where the collection agencies call every 4 minutes, on the four minutes. And the house was 40 degrees because I couldn't afford to turn the heat on. Getting the phone cut off was a relief because then the collection agencies couldn't call...

And right now, I'm working a good job and can buy my toys for $10 on ebay and not worry about eating.

I'm rich.

No, I don't have a trust fund or a Mercedes SUV, but I think I'm rich...

I guess the bit about "rich people" that irks me are the ones who don't understand that you can't run out for a $200 dinner at a swank bistro right now because the rent's due. Thankfully, they seem to be a dying breed. At least in my circle. And those freaking Mercedes SUV's, for some reason, just IRK me. What do you need a MERCEDES SUV for? To haul your gold bricks around? (Sorry. I'm not an SUV fan in general, although I do understand in some places they serve their purpose. But a MERCEDES SUV??????)

Still.

It's not a matter of cash, usually. It's a matter of general classiness. If I hit the lottery tomorrow and can be IDLE rich, not just rich-by-my-lights...I hope I'll handle it as graciously as some of the truly classy people I know who just happen to have a lot of cash.

-- Anonymous, February 03, 2001

Long-time readers of my site may remember that my parent's neighborhood is changing. A lot of people are buying up the old houses and remodeling them into "charming cottages" that they then sell for 5 times what they bought them for.

The other day I went to a Neighborhood Watch meeting which was made up of people who'd bought these remodeled homes. They were concerned because of several petty crimes that had taken place recently.

I hate it when people steal or vandalize my stuff. I hate crack dealers.

However, I couldn't help but notice that a lot of these new rich people were just hateful in general. Their attitudes seemed, to me, to say, "I paid good money for my house, and now I want all the Mexicans, who are all undoubtedly criminals, to get the fuck out of my neighborhood."

A couple of us invited them to volunteer at ANPO (my place of work) and help make a difference in the lives of the poor kids in the neighborhood. Some of them answered rather rudely, and some of the others ignored us or pretended to misunderstand. They invited us to join their association. I don't think I could stand to associate with a bunch of hatemongers who wish they were cops, though.

I hate it when assholes have power and money.

-- Anonymous, February 04, 2001

One thing in favor of Mercedes SUVs; I believe they have full time all-wheel drive and not all SUVs do. So when you spin out on the icy road they can pass you by in style. A bunch of other features make them pretty safe cars... If I had kids to drive around I'd consider getting one just for that reason (if they weren't so doofy looking).

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

or, for 1/4 the price, you could just get a Subaru.

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

Well... those are kind of doofy looking too.

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

As my wife and I were looking for a new car, which ended up being my station wagon, we test drove a few vehicles. Among them was, yes, the Mercedes M320 and the M460. My beef about Mercedes vehicles is still the same as it ever was: how in the world can they possibly justify the price of their cars and SUVs? I mean, every Mercedes anything I've ever been in has been sweet, but overpriced by $15K at a minimum. Anyway, the SUVs have their appeal. For one thing, they handle differently than other makes. They feel pretty good, if you like Mercedes trucks (Mercedes makes trucks and, like many other manufacturers, they started with a truck platform as a base for their SUV models). They have power, but their torque is fairly high up the power curve, which means I couldn't get off to a jackrabbit start like I wanted to in the test drive :-). They have good ground clearance and are roomy. And, inside and out, they are well made with great engineering and fine materials. They are unique, and certainly not meant for off-roading (yeeee-haw!). And ridiculously expensive, to the point of absurdity. You can meet all your SUV needs with some other vehicle, but I suppose there are some people for whom Mercedes is in their veins and everything they drive has to bear that name even though there may be better SUVs on the road and certainly nearly every other SUV on the road is a better bargain. Last year a man in the foothills near here bought a brand new Mercedes SUV and within two weeks murdered his wife in their driveway by driving it over her. I guess he wanted something really snarky with which to commit homicide. :-/

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

Trouble is, SUV's don't make a blind bit of sense in my part of the frozen Northeast in winter because....4WD does you no good whatsoever on black ice, which is mostly what we get.

Midwest, I grant you. New England? Try again, sonny... :)

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

maybe in recent years.. I live in the northwest and we've had packed snow on our roads for weeks now.

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

Oh yeah, it's actually very amusing to us out here in Denver, when we're not being irritated by skating SUVs and/or dodging for our lives. Every year, particularly around the first decent snowfall in September, the TV news is filled with images of SUVs stuck in ditches because their drivers went hog-wild because they were duped by the "4WD is invincible" myth.

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

Back in the dark days when I worked for an answering service, we used to dispatch tow trucks. Anytime we got someone calling in for a tow with 4wd who'd obviously bought into that myth, the tow drivers and I used to cycle them to the bottom of the tow list, during bad ice storms...(sighing wistfully...)

It was a LOUSY job, but it had its bright spots.

-- Anonymous, February 05, 2001

What a bad attitude! You should feel sorry for them. Most of them don't know what they're doing. They need your love. They need your help. You should be ashamed for taking advantage of their misery. Go find one and give them a hug. But for the grace of God go you. You could be that rich fool. You should be thankful you don't have it so good. (wink) James

-- Anonymous, February 06, 2001

I get it. A SUV is a 4WD

we just call em 4WD here (in Aust)

and yeah, ya gotta wonder why they bother. Shit handling, crappy fuel economy (oh yeah they're rich so it doesn't matter) and if they hit ya in yr little japanese 4-cylinder, ciao doode.

-- Anonymous, February 27, 2001