B*gger off Number 8, your time is up.

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Had enough of Kieron Dyer now. Patience finally exhausted. The main reason we aren't scoring more goals is that the man currently charged with lending close support to Shearer and Cordone/Luax2 won't go for goal. Wednesday and yesterday he was presented with dozens of opportunities to run at goal and he bottled it every time. If I wanted to watch someone running backwards and forwards along the line before passing it out to the fullbacks who had been available 30 seconds before, I would stick with Rob Lee in that position: he can at least hold the ball up.

Why do our ex-players have blinders against us and yet Dyer seemed positively reluctant to play against Ipswich? He was good at running the wrong way and disappearing when they countered but was conspicuous for laying the ball off whenever he had a chance to threaten.

This lad has most footballers' dream position. Freed from some of the defensive responsibility by being played behind our striker (+ partner for the day) and charged simply with making himself available whenever we get the ball. The trade-off is that we either lose a man at the back or risk a lightweight midfield. For that we do expect to improve our scoring chances by having a third man up at all times. Not, however, if the man in question is too scared to shoot but falls over himself trying to lay the ball off instead when he is the man who should be making that final dash and shot, Shearer has already pulled his marker(s) out wide, and what is called for is someone to twat the bloody thing, not jink away from goal and cross to Mr Nobody. I'm bloody sick of it.

This would probably be more acceptable if he showed any sign of trying to change his ways, but he seems to get worse if anything. I'm sick of being reminded of that goal he scored at Goodison Park - it's the exception that proves the rule. On Wednesday night, the only time he got into the box for a cross from Shearer he only had to run into the ball it was going so fast, yet somehow he managed to bounce it over the bar.

He's not a wingback (in case Keegan reads this forum - just thought I'd point it out for him), he's not really a winger, he'll nick the ball off your toe if you show him too much of it but will otherwise pull out of any challenges, he's unlikely to make a first time pass, preferring to arse about with it, he won't shoot unless he has time and space to pass it into the net (not likely when you take 3 extra touches to make it look good) and seems to step over the ball regardless of whether or not it's appropriate to do so.

Combine all this with his seeming inability to control himself off the field: not interested in his 3 in a bed romps, but his continued insistence on getting plastered. The money we throw at football these days you'd think it was reasonable to expect almost complete abstinence considering the obvious ill-effects binge-drinking has on you physically. When these guys sign a premiership contract they effectively never have to work again, and if that means waiting until you are 35 before getting arseholed every weekend then it seems a small sacrifice to pay.

It really is "shit or get off the pot" time for us. We have to sell him this Summer before he loses any more value, because I have no faith in him either hanging around or getting any better when he's 23. At the moment he's taking up a valuable berth in the team that has to go to someone with an eye for goal (even if he misses loads like Bowyer or Parlour - at least they have a go). Comparisons between him and Beardsley are ridiculous: Beardo's passing was better, his dribbling was more controlled, he was more likely to get stuck in and he scored beautiful, priceless goals from every angle and looked after himself. Dyer is just an extra 3 passes in any move at present and one of the key reasons for our "pointless posession" as Dougal so memorably dubbed it.

So far Bobby has been careful to not let Dyer hide and has clearly bollocked him on several occasions judging by the changes in some of his displays after half time. I just can't make my mind up whether he genuinely thinks Dyer will come good or is simply making do until Bassedas is fully fit. As it is, yesterday we had Dyer in "support", and the best run came from Rob Lee in the last 10minutes and the only shots from midfield came from Nobby, Speed and Acuna. No wonder Shearer has to work so bloody hard.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

Answers

..........Are you Pit Bill in disguise?

Sorry Softie after that I needed a lighter moment.

I think YBR might be working on the premise of taking a footballer with all the skills then get out of him the ones you need, rather than a player with speed or some skills and change everything else about them.

Having said that his recent displays reminded me of Terry Shedinghams performances in Euro 96? I think where every time he got the ball he went side ways or back wards. I will remember til I die on one occassion he got the ball on the edge of the oppossitions box and ran with it til it was safely at Seamans feet. 75 yards away from the goal he was attacking!

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


Well said Softie, I have to agree with the great majority of that.

I'm also fed up with being reminded of the Goodison goal. Yes it was a great goal, but so was the one that JDT got in a friendly match, and look how we loved him so!

Listening to the match on the Metro Webcast yesterday, it sounded like his most telling contribution to the game was when he cleared off the line just before the penalty, but all this faffing around and two/three touch stuff is, as you rightly say, getting very very tedious.

I wouldn't necessarily agree completely with the views on his drinking habits, I can't see anything wrong with him, or any of the others having a night out in the town after the match, but he has to show some control on that.

Back in the 70's I used to spend most Saturday nights in Grey's Club in the toon, and at that time, most of the players did as well, regardless of whether they were playing at home or away, (in the case of a certain number 9 at the time it was mainly playing away) and they used to get pretty rat-arsed, but the main thing was, during the season Saturday was the ONLY night you used to see them.....(well with the possible exception of Terry Mac).......and while we obviously didn't set the world alight in those days, we were reasonably solid and the players at least looked as though they were trying.

So all in all, I will agree with the suggestion that YKD is dropped in favour of Bassedas and lets start at Leicester next Saturday. Being dropped may well be the best kick up the arse he could get, just show him he can't just walk into the team.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


Disagree.

The Beardsley analogy is unfair. Beardsley joined us in the old second division when he was a couple of years older than Dyer is now. Yes we've paid money for him but forget about the money and think about the player. He's still a kid and still learning. Presumably as soon as Hughes makes a mistake and gives agoal away you'll want rid of him, and Lua Lua did bugger all yesterday, and just what have Ameobi and Coppinger ever done.

I'm not at all suggesting that he played well but for me it's an unbelievable load to put on him. Lee, Speed and Acuna are all defensively minded. As these three play so far back and don't threaten at all then we are left with Dyer as the only person that the opposition have to worry about. Okay stick two players on him and he's out of it. In days of old Beardsley had two wingers to help, there was also an ever helpful Bracewell/Clark/Batty type, AND Robert Lee wanting to get forward. This just isn't there at the moment.

We don't have a short (5-10 yard) passing game any more, we have a 15- 20 yard passing game and those sides with the ability to close down quickly have an extra second to get there. Just as the Shearer apologists reckon he doesn't get the service I reckon Dyer doesn't get the support. When he has played well it has been with Solano on the wide right. Yesterday there was no wide right, there was no wide left, there were three defensive midfielders (or a sweeper).

I won't criticise young players. I think we expect an awful lot from Dyer just cos we've seen him do well for England and us. I know a Rangers fan who says Barry Ferguson has the same problem at Ibrox. Cos he can be brilliant they expect it very week. After a couple of years of this his consistency is improving and he has now been made captain. If the Rangers fans had had your attitude they would have lost him over the last two years.

Clearly you want the Keegan approach back. Buy in 26/27 year old players at the peak of their game and try and win things. Lets make these kids no for sure that if they have poor games they'll get barracked. I'm not sure which is worse knowing you'll get stick or knowing your manager won't pick you. In 5 years time the next Michael Carrick will be saying he didn't join Newcastle cos he was scared of the crowd having a go at him.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


YKD is certainly our biggest dilemma, and I agree with Softie in so far as his relative failure this season has been perhaps our biggest problem.
He is playing in role largely free of defensive responsibility, and is a talented player that should should be showing more signs of maturity at this stage. He's the one who should be providing the creativity, the spark, and also should be the m/f player most often driving into the box to support AS, and contributing a few goals.
The reality is that he is not delivering, and does not appear to be developing into the player we all believe he should be.
I personally believe he got into the England set-up far too early, played well against Belgium, has had his head filled up with cr@p, and hasn't really progressed since that point.
I don't think he's the sharpest knife in the box, and his lifestyle has probably contributed to his problems. Nevertheless, he is undoubtedly a talent and one we must just hope Bobby Robson can develop.
I happen to believe that giving him a settled role in the team will help his development, in addition to which he needs our patience and continued support.
BTW macbeth, I don't recall him being barracked as you appear to suggest.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

Sorry to be pedantic, but I'm going to be anyway.

I really don't think we are getting sugfficient return from him to see his consistently hold down a regular place, and the flashes that he does occassionaly show are so often too few and far between to linger long in the mind.

I am not advocating dumping him altogether, but I think a couple of games warming his arse on the bench could do him the world of good. I think that to a certain extent he has a touch of the David Ginola (at his Toon prime) about him.....when he does want to play he can be possibly the best player on the pitch by a mile, but when he doesn't, he is as good as a man missing and we are basically down to ten men.

I have to again agree with Softies question/statement about ex-toon players playing blinders against us.....and again ask, if he couldn't get himself motivated for the game yesterday, then what game do we expect him to get motivated for.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000



I know where you're coming from Ken, and indeed I suggested on here dropping him several weeks ago in an effort to sort out what appeared to me to be an attitude problem. I'd just been the Riverside to watch a training session, and didn't like his attitude one bit.
This is what I was getting at in my comments about him playing for England too soon. Somehow he seems to have formed the attitude that he's "made it", the finished article. The reality is that a talented kid who's nowhere near the finished article, or indeed anywhere near performing to his full potential.
Whether Bobby can get him past this stage without coming down on him really hard, I really don't know. At this stage, you have to wonder whether such an approach would work, or whether he would just take the hump and bog off to another club.
Without doubt, it is a real problem and one that is hurting us, and hindering our progress.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

....forgot to mention - the really bad news in this troublesome situation is that there is strong speculation Peter Taylor is going to include him in the England team to play Italy.
Frankly, this is the last thing he, or Bobby, needs at the moment.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

MacBeth, you point out that Acuna, Speed and Lee are defensive, so how come they all had a go at goal yesterday while twinkle- toes failed to take a single opportunity to even move towards a position where there was a danger of this happening.

Far from wanting players out who fail to play like superstars from the off, I'm talking about a kid who has had a season and a third to show us what he's made of and is unfortunately going backwards. The problem might well be that he's getting something like 20k a week and, as clarky says, it's gone to his head. Stark contrast to Caldwell who is probably on 600quid a week just now and appears to want to make a difference rather than cherrypick which parts of the game he gets involved in ("I think I'll just fanny about, not do any tackling, dwell on the ball and not go near the goal in case I miss and everyone laughs at me.").

I don't expect instant returns, I expect hard work and a willingness to improve. Robson recognizes the problem and gave him a "10 goals or else" warning: did you honestly see anything that would lead you to believe that Dyer wanted to score a goal yesterday? If so, please let me know what it is, because we can't trust all our opponents to put every third pass straight out of play to help us keep posession.

As for Beardsley playing for us in the Second Division, was that not a climb up from the Vancouver Whitecaps? Until Dyer shows a desire to do something more than piss about with the ball, he'll never draw markers the way Beadsley did. Who do you see doing a man-to-man job on Ketsbaia, Tomasson, Cordone and the rest of the limp-in-front-of- goal brigade? Nobody. And nobody does a man-to-man marking job on Dyer either. No need, he does the job for them by keeping the ball away from Shearer.

Simple equation:

Player in free role without defensive duties must = goals

He's not doing the rest of it for us, so he has to score or it's just harder on the rest of them. I don't expect him to score 1 every week, but I do expect him to make some attempt to score. If he's one of those players who has to get angry before he'll do it then I will happily go down to the changing room at half time and slap him about.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


If he's one of those players who has to get angry before he'll do it then I will happily go down to the changing room at half time and slap him about.

and he would no doubt get it caught on video and sell it!

Sorry, just a very poor attempt to lighten up the Sunday morning postings!

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


Over a few beers in the Strawberry it was decided that we needed a controversial posting to liven the place up a bit. Might have to start on about the Ghosts of Managers Past again....

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


Gordon Lee

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

On the RTG site they are starting to talk openly about Super Kev not being so super and it may be time to cash in. Same here by the looks of it.

1980s sell Waddle, Beardsley, Gazza as they are getting too big for their boots, don't win game son their own

1990s Sell Lee Clark, too slow, can't get a game. Sell Darren Huckerby, not as good as Shearer, Ferdinand, Tino. Sell ferdinand as we've got Sheraer and Tino, Sell Tino cos he doesn't do it consistently when he plays on his own. Sell Robbie Elliot, dodgy knees. Sell Stevie Watson, not really good enough. Sell Ginola doesn't defend well. Sell Peter beardsley too old.

2000s give Dyer ultimatum to perform in his free role or cash in on him. Now we have a truly awesome midfield, with great potential. Lee, Acuna, Speed, Solano will frighten the living day lights of everyone. Bassedas I don't know, but the others are damn good journeyman Premiership midfield players. Dyer at 20/21 is just a kid. He is still learning, and we are on here discussing that he isn't making chances, scoring goals. I'm not saying he's beyond criticism I'm just sugegsting that at that age we should be playing with decent players near him.

Yesterday Lua Lua was hopeless when he came on. I felt he suffered from exactly the same lack of support that Dyer does. Shearer is a good target man, but has no pace. A couple of breaks yesterday foundered cos there was no one for Lua Lua to centre to and another cos Shearer just couldn't get away.

I say again that when Dyer look sgood it is when he is interchanging with Solano, or Glass. Yesterday Speed, Lee and Acuna didn't seem to have the mandate to get forward. Dyer therefore had Cordone and Shearer. I don't think we'll see the best of Dyer while he is expected to compete against 3 or 4 defensive midfields camped in front of a solid back 4. We need another forward minded midfield player, either near him or on the wings. In the first half yesterday Solano was isolated at right back so there was no support, to me we looked like we were playing a sort of 1-2-2-2-1-2 yesterday with no width, 5 defenders, 2 defensive midfielders and a gap up to Dyer, Cordone and Shearer.

If we drop Dyer as suggested then I suspect that means that Gary Speed is our fastest player (no criticism of him intended). We need to look to avoiding relegation if we have become that static a side.

One last one. Shearer gives 100% but just isn't good enough anymore. Nothing to be done about it, but his pace has gone, his idea of sewing up the game with 5 minutes + injury time to go is to slow down a break and hold the ball. I expect more of him. Maybe a spell on the bench will do him good when Cort comes back.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


So you thought Shearer was hopeless yet again yesterday Macbeth?
Well I can only assume you were at a different game to me, because I saw a CF whose overall contribution to our cause was immeasurable, who caused the Ipswich defence problems throughout the 90 minutes, and who was the actually the difference between two evenly matched teams.
As for his fabled lack of pace, he didn't look too sluggish to me when he took longs ball from defence on his chest, ran on and scored one with his left foot, and was tripped for a penalty on the second.
IMO, he was also noticeably faster off the mark than his 25 yr-old striking partner yesterday.
BTW, running down the clock with a few minutes to go makes perfect sense, unless of course you still prefer the Keegan style of kamikazi fooball in going for 3-1 instead of 2-1, and finishing up 2-2 or even 2-3. I still have nightmares of sitting at Anfield during the first 3-4, when at 3-1 we were going flat out for 4-1, and I just knew inside we were going to lose it.
Get off his back man - he's not quite as good as he was five years ago, but he's still sheer class, he's one of us, AND one of the best we've ever had.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

Softie,

One of the things that been sorely missed on here recently has been your contribution.
I'm sure I speak for many others in saying we hope that YBW is progrssing to the point where we can look forward to reading a bit more of your wit and wisdom on a regular basis again.
Sorry I missed you at the Strawberry yesterday. In securing a 2nd season ticket this season I am finding myself tied to being a taxi driver for the other family member who feels like going - and then usually not before 2pm. I must catch up with everyone again soon.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


As I was talking to Mr Soft as we exited the ground yesterday I wanted to take up this line on here but Mr S beat me to it. I care not one jot what he (LKD) does in his spare time as long as he performs on the pitch. The word that keeps being raised is 'potential' but how long can he be in this mode. Personally I don't see much improvement from him at all and would be happier to see Bassedas get a few games. Dyer hasn't impressed me this season, but I'm from Blyth and you've got to be better than Eddie Alder to get me worked up. Its wrong to compare him Beardsley. He's not that good, even potentially. As for Shearer, I agree with Mr C, he remains the dogs bollocks. 'Nuff said.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


Just want to say thanks for the discussion. I've read some of the disquiet on this BBS about YKD but being 6,000 miles away and only seeing the very occasional game on tele its difficult to assess what's going on. So thanks very much.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

Is this the same Kieron Dyer we were drooling about after the Smoggies game when he ran himself ragged, scored a great goal and also picked up the man of the match award.

Got to disagree with a lot of what is being said but I reckon Macbeths comments are probably the closest sentiments to mine.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


It is the same Dyer who played a blinder in the Middlesbrough game this season, but that's as far as it goes. He was exceptionally poor against West Ham and by all accounts he's not been at his best at all this season. The Everton goal that everyone goes on about came when he was substitute, he injected some pace in to an otherwise flat game. He rebounded well from that and I think it's time he went back on the bench, get the hunger back.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

I thought LKD had a poor game yesterday. I believe he should be rested, given a spot on the bench, or perhaps only on for 45-60 mins. Bassedas must start to figure soon , and perhaps when Diego gets fit, that could allow Nobby to come inside - he seems to like drifting in anyway. LKD has to realise he isn't a permanent fixture.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

reference Kegsy's Mungo's and Screachers postings.....does this not prove the point I was making earlier.

Kegsy/Mungo, yes he played a blinder at Boro, but has been absolute crap against Wham, Soton, Charlton, Everton and Ipswich. As I said earlier, Daveed used to do the same thing, play one good game, several bad games, ond good game and the cycle went on.....thus making it difficult to state hand on heart that he should be dropped, as you run the risk of dropping him just on the game where he hits the button.

Now I for one thought that game was going to be yesterday....playing against his old mates....WRONG!

Which brings me neatly round to Screachers point, I was also, in my round about cack handed way suggesting that he be on the bench waiting to come on if necessary.....god forbid that he didn't have some part to play in most matches, injury/suspension permitting.

Finally......I might be wrong, but that great goal he scored against Everton last year.......remind me, didn't he come on as substitute in that match.

Good discussion people.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


Trouble is, we could end up with 11 on the bench and only 5 on the field. Sadly, I think LKD could do a crackin' job off the bench - just like LuLu has done in the past (not Saturday). It's the YMO syndrome. Bring 'em on when the oppos knacked. But I still maintain, he can not expect (at least until he justifies it) to be an automatic choice every week.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000

ITK, I was agreeing with you and if you read my posting very closely you will see that I said that The Everton goal that everyone goes on about came when he was substitute. No where is the copy right character in HTML ;-)

I also agree with Screachers idea of bringing him on when the defenders are knackered. Imagine facing a fresh Lua Lua and Dyer after 70 minutes when Shearer et al have given you a torrid time. It would certainly freshen things up a bit. And it would IMHO have forced at least a draw against West Ham.

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


agreed Screacher. Which is why YBR has bought Acuna, Gallacher, Bassedas and Gavilan.

Just a thought but - you don't think the manager's one step ahead of us do you....? it'd be a first since Keegan, admittedly...

; o )

-- Anonymous, November 05, 2000


I hate to say it but he looks to be similar to Rio Ferdinand - has stood still despite having shown enormous early promise. I think we may have to look at whether our team is bringing the best out of him. Having said that, he has had some of his best performances as a sub.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

Shearer had a fantastic game - almost singlehandedly defeated Ipswich. I don't know why he gets so much stick. He is a Toon all-time great.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

Believe it or not Gus, I was sort of defending KD when Softie and I got onto this topic in the Strawberry on Sat. Being a miserable owld git, I took the 'He's still just a kid' line of defense, although I do agree he was crap. What concerns me is that we overreact and get shot just to teach him a lesson, (or what's more likely, to rake in some dosh).

This argument probably would stay bubbling under the surface if we were winning consistently - along the lines of 'Look how good we are now - we'll be world beaters when KD starts to deliver'.

If I was Bobby, I'd persevere with him until it's obvious the writing on the wall can't be cleaned off, although that could cost us money.

I reckon if he can't do it for Bobby he can't do it for anybody, and we'd lose out whenever we decide enough's enough. Maybe the answer is to drop him for a couple of games.

Who'd be a footy manager, eh ?

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


With Nobby reportedly out for a while and Gavilan still out it would seem that we need Dyer to play. I would have dropped him as well, but without him we have only Domi's pace and we wouldn't get anywhere.

Does anyone who does to the training ground see him stay behind to practice welting the ball at the goal? Surely Shearer could teach him how to knock a barn door of it's hinges! If Dyer could hit the ball 75% as powerful as one of Shearer's efforts he'd score shitloads!

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


I've never seen LKD stay behind for shooting practice. It's usually Shearer, Speed, Cordone, Solano and maybe a few others such as Gallacher when fit.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

This is pure devil's advocacy before anyone starts berating me, but I read a debate on some BBS between an Arsenal fan and a Manc where they were saying that they'd love to see Dyer playing in a decent side.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000

If he played for another team I reckon they have him on the right wing as much as possible, something I have suggested we should do. But I have been converetd by Solano's form and ability to pick out Shearer with his crosses, to an extent that I doon't see why Dyer should be in the floating role position.

Now that Nobby is injured, though, it is a different story. Dyer may have to play wing back if Bobby sticks with the Sweeper system.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


Just as an aside, has the game changed so much that it's now impossible to play without suffering serious injury ?

Time was when most of these guys would have been allowed to make as dignified an exit as possible after suffering some of the injuries that are now every week occurrences.

I'm not that convinced that however skillful the repair, they ever get back to where they were.

And what sort of troubles are they storing up for when they do eventually pack in ? Is this just another aspect of the effect vast transfer fees have had ?

It's not so painfull writing off a few thou, but having to write off millions ? Or is the insurance cover appropriate to the transfer fee, and Where do those considerations come into a club's thinking, if at all. ?

Who'd run a footy club, eh ?

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


Still strikes me as a matter of necessity. If he can't deliver goals in the floating role then he shouldn't be allowed to play it. This system trades vulnerability at the back for an extra attacking option. If the extra option is toothless then you have just accepted greater vulnerability for negligible return.

He's a highly skillful runner and can pass sublimely when he's in the mood. However, he doesn't really cross the ball: depends on the striker getting ahead of his man at the near post since he knocks them in at waist height rather than whipping it over defenders. As a result he has to skin his man and deliver a ball across the face of goal and you need bodies in the box to make that worthwhile so everyone else has to be on form before he is a threat. His favourite trick last season was to get into the 18 yard box and fall over - people have done their homework since then and either usher him into the corner knowing he can't cross or show him inside when 40 yards out (as Ipswich were doing - as they know exactly what he can and can't do) and watch him pass the ball rather than take the invitation.

When we say Lua Lua was ineffective on Saturday because he had no support we are surely still talking about Dyer, aren't we? If we have to play an extra defensive midfielder in place of a defender to compensate for Dyer's limited tackling ability and now have to play another attacking midfielder with the ability to score goals since Dyer's scared of shooting, why bother playing him at all? All he is is a roadblock to attack since he invariably slows down a move as we wait for someone with shooting boots to take over.

Cordone gets barracked for going wide and looking for someone to cut back to or cross to since unless Shearer is available or Speed has risked a forward run, there are no options (unless you want to see another Dyer step-over). I would rather see him in the floating role (as he may well be when Cort comes back) since he at least has a go when he has sight of goal. He also takes the 3 extra touches Dyer seems to like but at least you know he'll try to shoot at some point.

Dyer's a luxury player for us unless we can discover a couple of Patrick Vieras who can pass, tackle, shoot and the whole caboodle to give Dyer the freedom to dance around between 50 and 35 yards out passing the ball to his heart's content. At the moment we simply don't have the players to both hold and win the ball as well as getting forward to support Shearer as another striking option for Dyer to choose from. Better by far to sell Dyer and get someone who can shoot as well as create while Dyer is still a saleable asset.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


Sorry Pit Bill, I was just perpetuating the myth, tongue in cheek mind :o)

I do not think Dyer is Premiership quality yet. I think we should have a "feeder" club to give these players the chance to sharpen up.

I have been told YBR is looking very seriously at an offer which has been made.

The club which has made this offer is awaiting the start of the new Corinthian League as Shilbottle WMC is to announce the signings of a couple of YBRs underperforming starlets!

You heard it here first!

Who would run a football club PB? ME!

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


I agree regarding Cordone. In the hole behind the front two he will do pretty much the same as now but instead of just Shearer to aim for Cort will be there too. I think we will see the emergence of Cordone as our main playmaking attacking midfielder and could well signal the demise of Dyer when every other midfielder is fit. At least Cordone knows when to have a pot at goal and he doesn't mind doing so.

He may well need to bring Shearer into the game a bit more sometimes,but Shearer is making sure he is in every bit of the game so far!

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


Gus
My pet lip was tongue in cheek as well, just missed the smiley off the end.

I'd like to take you up on one point, though. What's the advantage of a feeder club over a decent reserve team programme ? Other than the maybe obvious one of who's paying the salaries.

I'd have thought there'd be a higher standard in a premiership reserve league than in non-league games. Or would this be in addition to the reserve league ?

I must admit, I can't see any advantage other than the possible monetary one.

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


Re Dyer from Ipswich site...

SW15 blue posted on 06/11 1:52 pm Email this Message | Reply out on the toon with kieron excellent vodka bar on the quayside; trebles for B#1.70. and "planet earth" was excellent, with several town fans. met kieron dyer in the taxi queue about 2am. well when i saw him he had a pizza slice in one hand and a girl in the other. no sign of johnno and wrighty who presumably had their own food and entertainment arrangements !

-- Anonymous, November 06, 2000


What he does after a game doesn't really worry me. He's a young lad and we shouldn't judge him for going out after the game for a few beers. The bloke never said he was stumbling around vomiting, as if to say he had far too much to drink.

Apparently the Mirror today is saying that Leeds will use their Champion League windfall to make an offer for Dyer. The option to sell could well be a reality. Two questions here a) Would YOU sell him? and b) Would YBR sell him?

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000


Possibly, DB, but YBR has asked him not to go out on the razz at all. I imagine it depends on how much Leeds offer and what we think we could get as a replacement. Personally, I think we'd be foolish to sell yet another player to yet another PL club without giving him a real chance.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

From the Online Mirror:

>>DYER FITS THE BILL

LEEDS plan to use their Champions' League windfall to launch an audacious pounds 10million bid for Newcastle midfield star Kieron Dyer.

David O'Leary's side are on the verge of qualifying for the lucrative second phase of the competition and the 21-year-old midfielder is the man they want to bolster their injury-ravaged squad.

If the 10mil is right I think we should go for it!

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000


This is a very, very difficult one - asuming it's not just the usual Press BS, which is what I suspect.
I don't think BR will be inclined to sell - unless he has concluded that he can't get Dyer to do the business. B#10mm would be extremely tempting, especially given the Club's financial situation, but I wouldn't expect any pressure from the Board to cash in on him. If we did, I feel sure it would be Bobby's decision alone.
The reality is that we desperately need the creativity going forward that Dyer could provide, and I'd be inclined to hang on to him and keep trying - it could well be worth it in the long haul.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

What's going on here ? What's the point of trying to build a world class squad if we just write off the guys that in Bobby Robson's opinion are the ones who'll do it. Is Bobby not the messiah we reckon he is ? Is his judgement not what it's cracked up to be. ? Cos that's what it looks like if we're going to start writing off Dyer so soon. And who'll be next ?

I can't disagree with the opinions on Dyer's play at the moment, but for gawd's sake give him time. Mebbe it's the opportunities available here compared with Ipswich that have got to him, hopefully just for the time being.

What are we all thinking about with this 'grab the money if we get the chance, just in case he does stay as ineffective as he is at the moment' approach. We'll never have any credibility as a world club with that attitude.

Let Bobby sort out the daft little bugga, and any of the rest of them that might need re-railing. When he throws his hands up in despair that's when I'll start to really worry.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000


agreed PB

Read that press 'blurb' again and you might just miss the bit at the end about his age: 21

We'll have a thread saying Aaron Hughes is too old at 22 next, or Lua-Lua has a silly name and should change it so we can think of a few songs.....

; o )

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000


Learn to score or learn to tackle. We're scrabbling around in the bargain-basement for players and have a saleable asset who's going backwards. If he fails to improve by the end of the season then we'll be lucky to get our stake money back. A swap for Bridges plus cash would suit me just fine.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000

Can't say I've noticed yet that KD doesn't have the ability to learn. As for the munchkin, he seems to have dried up as badly as did AS when he had to forage for the ball. I think I'd rather have somebody who's sh|te at the moment, but who might come good, than somebody who was world beating for a while, but has now dried up a bit, with no guarantee he'll come good again.

I still say leave Bobby to manage. If he decides Dyer has to go then so be it, but I think we might regret pre-empting him.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000


Pit Bill,

Forgetting the whimsy for a mo, Re feeder teams. Perth Glory had a great midfielder, 20yo Ivan Ergic. We were interested along with some Jormans and finally Juve bought him.

He did pre season with them then went to their feeder team. I think it was FC Basle in Switzerland. He gains experience in a league better than here and probably better than the Eytie reserve comp.

Ok I know it is only Perth Glory, however tell that to Danny Hay and Milosevic at Leeds, Stan Lazaridis at Birmingham.

Done correctly feeder teams are OK. BTW Rangers have bought the controlling interest in one of the teams in our national league.

-- Anonymous, November 07, 2000


Gus
I take your point. I hadn't thought it through to the conclusion that the feeder club wouldn't necessarily have to be a local non-league club.

From that point of view, there could be quite substantial benefits for both clubs.

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000


Pit Bill,

Shilbottle WMC will however be glad to accept Mr Dyer for next season in the Corinthian League!!

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000


One thing - he's about our only player who the Makems are bricking it about.

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000

What do they know! They reckon Phillips and Quinn will easily dominate Hughes and Goma and they reckon Shearer will be marked out of the game!

-- Anonymous, November 08, 2000

Looks like Dyer could get another England call up today. The press are all saying he is having an excellent season and is worthy of a starting place! I would tend to go with the opinions on here due to the fact he has been watched every week.

-- Anonymous, November 09, 2000

They reckon Shearer will be marked out of the game. Why of course he will especially after being responsible for the defeat last season (quote TDO). Why, Shearer will not get a kick.

He'll just head a hat trick instead.

-- Anonymous, November 09, 2000


In an article about the probable England squad, The Journal this morning referred to him as the "...fast improving KD"!!

-- Anonymous, November 09, 2000

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