This is incredible. I'm beginning to understand the "MARP is dying" crowd's reasons for believing that. Everyone picks on every little problem they can find and beats it to death. The messages posted on this board in the last 24-48 hours are like a bunch of kids fighting over their toys. "You did this." "Yeah, but you did this." Geez, get over it people!

As far as I'm concerned, there have to be rules for a site like this, and someone has to enforce them. If not, just like in the rest of real life, someone is going to take whatever advantage they can to stretch them to an absolute. I've always been amazed at the number of people who will cheat in a competition where THERE ARE NO PRIZES.

I also agree that there should be some type of notification process when a score is DQ'd. If you're someone like BBH (or anyone else in the top 30 or so), you have a zillion recordings submitted and keeping track of ones that might have been DQ'd is pretty tough.

And, the incredible bickering that has taken place about the KoA tournament is, to be blunt, pretty pathetic. Everyone has a different interpretation of the situation and takes complete and total offense to anyone else's opinions. As far as I'm concerned, Chris is running it, so final judgment should probably be his. He's damned if he does, and damned if he doesn't.

There, now that I've probably aggravated nearly everybody, this message does actually have a point. My suggestion, because round 2 has caused so much turmoil and animosity is to allow everyone from round 2 (except me, because I'm the only one who didn't submit a recording in time because I was too damn busy at my job!) back in for round 3. Make the rules absolute, just like they're supposed to be, and if a recording doesn't play back or is recorded on the wrong version, it's DQ'd or allowed up to the point it plays back, just like in MARP. Make absolutely no exceptions for rounds 3 and up and live and learn.

I love MAME and I love the MARP site. I think that it's so cool that we can play all of those games we played as kids, plus 2000 more, and actually see other people play them better than we'd ever dream. Obviously, competition brings out the best and the worst of people, and it certainly shows in this community.

That's just my opinion. I could be wrong. Flame away....

-- boxster (qmjcd@hotmail.com), September 20, 2000

Answers

'And, the incredible bickering that has taken place about the KoA tournament is, to be blunt, pretty pathetic.'

Fair enough, but it has always been my belief that rules are rules, and they should be adhered to no matter what. Chris has gone back on the original rules he stated. His decision in allowing screenshots to be ok is akin to an Olympics official saying, 'ok, even though I didn't actually see the full race, I'll award you a medal based on snippets of what I saw from the video replay'. It just does not cut the mustard as far as I am concerned, especially given his treatment towards Vaz. Anyway, I have decided to withdraw from the KOA, so consider the matter dead from now on.

-- JSW (usagi@dingoblue.net.au), September 20, 2000.

umm, since when did I say I accepted their screenshots, as you see on the scoreboard, they were only credited with what it played back to 1,000 pts. The only reason they were given pass to round #3 was. A) Two withdrawals, (Boxster and Tickenest), already was an eliminating factor for groups A & D. B) Dq's of Vaz and Jazz (note, one is pissed, other realizes they made the mistake) in groups A & D caused two to be out in A & D. Therefore, the withdrawal wouldn't be out of the competition, but gave their seats in the competition to the two who tried all competition to make a working recording, and acted in good faith. People say I don't compromise, they being in Round #3 is because of a compromise. If you wish to leave, JSW, that is your own doing. The only other move I could do would be to eliminate all 6 people? Would that suffice you more? As for the first note, I agree, I am damned if I do, and damned if I don't, so I have to make the ruling, and let the chips land where they may, as the saying goes. R3 begins tomorrow, good luck all

-- Chris Parsley (cparsley1@hotmail.com), September 20, 2000.

JSW,

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here. You stated that rules are rules, but wasn't Vaz's recording DQ'd because he used the wrong version? If that's true, in effect, you're criticizing Chris for breaking one rule (allowing two people back in because of the DQ's) and also criticizing him for adhering to another.

Please don't misunderstand. I'm not trying to say that Chris' decision was right or wrong. What I am saying is that if he doesn't make the decisions, who does? As long as there is some consistency in the decisions made (DQ'ing both people who used the wrong version), I don't see why this is such an enormous issue.

Just my two cents. Patiently waiting for T5 to start.

-- boxster (qmjcd@hotmail.com), September 20, 2000.

It isn't an enormous issue.. just read the log that Vaz posted. Chris was itching to replace Vaz's score (which could've been played back on 0.36) to a recording that may have been stated as using tgmame, but could not be played back in any MAME version. IMHO, Vaz's recording should've been accepted in place of a non-playable recording. But, I don't really care anyway.. really it is Chris' ultimate decision, and good luck to the rest of the KoA partcipants.

-- JSW (usagi@dingoblue.net.au), September 20, 2000.

From that message transcript, Chris apparently wanted to DQ Vaz's score, but it also looks like he considered the options. He asked if Vaz had a legit score (no answer in the message transcript.) If all of Vaz's recordings were with the wrong version, his DQ'd score (0) would still be lower than the other people's legitimate scores (1000), so it doesn't really matter anyway.

Obviously, there's some bad blood between the two of you and between Vaz and Chris. As I haven't been around forever, I don't know the inner workings of this little dysfunctional family, but I'm learning as I spend more time here. It's interesting that you're willing to stomp all over Chris for this, but if you'll notice, BenJos brought it up and also made a fairly big deal out of it. And, Vaz might be overreacting just a tad. Again, as I don't know the history, I'm not going to speculate too much.

The rules don't appear to address the situation when people are DQ'd, so I think that Chris had to take a little initiative and make a decision.

Anyway, this is actually turning kind of funny. This is like some kind of conspiracy group. A lot of people are out to get a lot of other people and everyone takes every little thing personally to the hilt. I thought that this was supposed to be fun(?)

Somehow I don't think that Chris will be running anymore tournaments. Eh, Chris?

Time to go back to work! Have a MARPy day.

-- boxster (qmjcd@hotmail.com), September 20, 2000.

Yes, you're right Boxster. In the long run it is supposed to be fun.. I guess certain factors made me a little 'testy' to say the least.. but it's all about the games in the long run. So viva la marp etc.. happy MAMEing.. without that little program we'd have nothing to bitch about, would we? :)

-- JSW (usagi@dingoblue.net.au), September 20, 2000.

The bottom line is that it's pretty cool that there are this many people who are still so interested in the arcade scene, MAME, and MARP that it gets people fired up like this. The arguments may scare a few people off, but at least some decent discussions can sometimes come out of this board!

Oh, to have only had MAME when I was a kid. I would have saved a college education worth of quarters!!

-- boxster (qmjcd@hotmail.com), September 20, 2000.

Woooo ... take it easy guys Yes k1 is a little confuse , but it's just born ; I'm sure k2 will be better , but all I just see for the moment is that koa is based on a good principle : it concentrates the attention of several players on the same game , and after 2 rounds we've two beautiful new records

And for me king of arcade is definitely Brian ; congrats to him

-- phil (plamat@club-internet.fr), September 20, 2000.

What do I have to say, it seems the #marp channel has been made to stab knives in other people's back. I'm not referring only to Parsley's intentions to DQ my Arabian recording; I used MAME32 v0.36 because I couldn't TGMAME to work, as I have said many times before. OK; it's my fault, but I didn't have time to find the missing file, so I thought v0.36 would have been ok anyway. BTW, many thanks to Tommi for sending me the audiow32.dll file! You're THE man ;)

Back to IRC and the knives, I want to say that the same guys who seem so friendly with Parsley when he's in #marp are the first ones to bitch about him and his (presumed) attitude to "complain about everything" (as I've heard there). So guys, before hipocrisy kills us all, say what you think directly to ones you refer, and we'll eliminate (I hope) 50% of the fights that MARP is hosting nowadays.

-- Vaz (mrvaz@inwind.it), September 21, 2000.