Just a musing, a lot of people not wanting to get carried away with beating coventry/derby/spurs etc and waiting to see how we perform against the big boys before deciding wether we're any good or not. It seems to me that a lot of our troubles over the past few seasons have been getting results against the covs (e.g. bradfords, palaces, southamptons, etc) of this world rather than because of any deficiencies against the chelseas? Any thoughts?

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

Answers

Good point Tom, we turn it on for the big games then throw it away against the likes of West Ham last season - grrrrr!

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

It's more a general inability to be consitent away from home no matter who've we played against - London games being a particular problem. Last season we failed to get any sort of motivation on against Watford until they went a (very offside) goal up (although YBR probably wanted to get a 1pt and run to secure our PL status).

It's also a sign of how other sides view us these days. Teams like Southampton and Bradford think of us as teams they should get a result against, and they weren't wrong last year (was it in Soton's match programme who said they shouldn't take us for granted??? Who the f**k are they?).

That said, I reckon by the end of November we could be a very comfortable position. 3pts should be on for Charlton (h), Man C (a), Smoggies (a), Everton (h), Ipswich (h), Leicester (a) and the Makems (h). Trickies include: Chelsea (h), Soton (a), WHam (a), Liverpool (h) and Villa (h) before we go to Arse (a).

So, that's around 26 or 28pts from a possible 39. That'd do for Europe qualification and a firm 4th place.

Hopelessly optomistic? Why not be :-))

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

Ooooh Bobby, you want to watch it, you'll get in trouble with the superstitious lot on the other thread :-)

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

I reckon every game up to the end of November is winnable!

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

The league placement prediction superstition only holds for the next game to be played. So talk about our position in November is fine..for now. Just no talk about where we'll be on Saturday night. Thinking it is just fine, however. ;-D

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

In recent seasons we have undoubtedly failed to gain points from teams we should have beaten, particularly away from home. Earlier in this thread Bobby mentioned an apparent lack of motivation last season against Watford.

Well, there was an interesting and relevant piece in the post match comments of BR in this morning's Journal. I'll just reproduce this section of the article:-
The former England boss revealed that he told his team to treat last night's trip to Highfield Rd. as if it was a title decider, and Utd. were clearly fired up from the start.
"I said to the players earlier in the day that if we were coming to Coventry on the last day of the season to win the League, would they win the game? That was the question I posed and, of course, they all said yes. I told them that had had to win it, and we went out there highly motivated".

From this we can conclude that motivation was indeed a major factor in some of these defeats last season. I have to say that I find it highly unpalatable to contemplate a Toon going out to play for us with any lack of motivation, but BR certainly believes it to have been a problem.

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

I think positive motivation can be a difficult thing to a to achieve. YBR has had to change the team from one where survival was the thing to be achieved, and no more could realistically be obtained, to one where we dominate and it seems from the reports that we actually did that last night for much of the game. This is a team characteristic and if we have achieved it then I suspect we will beat teams in the lower half of the table more predictably than in the past 2 years. I think everyone who plays is motivated to do well personally, but if there is a feeling that another player is very likely to give away a goal through a mistake, or misses sitters on a regular basis then the team motivation may not be there.

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

Sounder, Spot on, fully agree with your posting

-- Anonymous, September 07, 2000

Thanks Buff!! Its an amazing difference playing in a team that wins and a team that is dodgy isn't it.

-- Anonymous, September 08, 2000

Excellent point Sounder - and probably explains why we fell to pieces several times at the beginning of last season as soon as we conceded a goal.

-- Anonymous, September 08, 2000

Just to labour the original point a little, the following cut and pasted from the football unlimited summary of the Man U v Sunderland game:

"On the first day of the season Arsenal actually lost to Sunderland. And four days after an under-strength United hit Bradford for six, Arsenal could only draw with them. As for Chelsea, they have been beaten by Bradford, Leeds have lost at home to Manchester City, and Liverpool had to accept a draw at Southampton. "

Its not just our problem then but if Bobby Robson can somehow keep the motivation up for these kinds of game then we can look towards europe whether we're capable of beating the top four teams or not. At this stage in our redevelopment is this a more sensible goal than concentrating on the 'bigger' games?

-- Anonymous, September 11, 2000

Saturday's game was a fine example of our hopes for this season. A draw against Chelsea is a good result for us at this stage of the season. We will get better rather than worse.

Despite the loss to Manure we have beaten teams who are in the top half of the league. Spurs could go above us tonight if they beat the Hammers, Coventry could have went top if they had beaten us. Chelsea are a team of stars who will be higher sooner than later. These teams have shown a bit of form this season and we have beaten them without conceding.

If you look at Leicester they have not played a team out of the bottom seven, teams which have shown no real form so I reckon once they face decent team they will start to slide down the table.

Things can only go up from here, we will impove as a team and a serious amount of confidence will see us stay in the top five for the rest of the season. We shouldn't worry about drawing with the top sides as long as we beat the rest often enough, which doesn't seem too bad looking at the last five results

-- Anonymous, September 11, 2000