18 = adult?

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Does 18 being the legal age of adulthood make sense still? Should the age be lowered? Or raised?

One reason I was thinking about this is the issue of teenagers getting abortions. On the one hand, I want teen girls to have privacy from their parents on this issue, if that's what they want. On the other hand, I understand parents' concern about their kids' safety, and the idea of a 14 year old getting cut open without her mom knowing is kind of scary.

Another issue is voting. I remember being FURIOUS as a kid that I did not have more of a say in my life. I would have voted at age 10 if I could *... um, not that we would have wanted me voting necessarily!!). I was pretty involved in things and my parents were cool about letting me be active, but the voting age really made me mad.

So, basically, does 18 make sense as the cutoff age between minor and adult? Why? Why not?

-- Anonymous, August 17, 2000

Answers

This is tough question to answer because maturity levels vary so much. Overall, I guess 18 makes more sense than anything else. It is an age usually where HS is complete and kids may already have a strong enough desire to leave home that not allowing them the freedom to go might cause more problems than it solves.

I do think though that we as a society need to be consistent. If at 18 one is allowed to live on their own, fight for the country, enter legal contracts, and vote, all hallmarks of society thinking that one is "mature" enough at 18 to handle their situations, than they should also be considered old enough to make a decision on drinking alcohol. Of course, I know 40 year old people who can't handle this yet, and there will probably by many 18 years old get into more trouble than not, but getting into trouble is the right of any adult, I guess ...

-- Anonymous, August 17, 2000


And what about the fact that you have to be 35 to be president? How did they decide that? What if a 34 year old could do the job really well? Grr.

-- Anonymous, August 17, 2000

I think it's the 18-thing because that's when you graduate. If you got to leave home before that, you'd have to juggle school, a job, housework and possibly family. We have emancipation, but I don't think you can vote or do much but stay out past your curfew and work without a work permit. It's just a lot of responsibility for someone who's just a kid, prob'ly.

A better idea might be to make you an adult when you graduate, or when you're eighteen if you either drop out turn 18 before graduation. But that would make carding people really hard; they'd have to, like, carry their diploma around or something. And what if you're one of those kid geniuses who graduates at ten or eleven?

And, teens have the unchallenged right, I believe, to have an abortion or have a child regardless of what their parents think, at least in the US. You /can/ keep it from them, but that's only if you're in danger if they know.

-- Anonymous, August 17, 2000


When the draft was mandatory, and young men of 18 were drafted to fight there was much talk about making the age of majority 18. If you could die for your country you darned well ought to be considered an adult. I still think 18 year olds probably ought to be considered to be adults.

On the abortion thing...ummmm..."cutting open" is not involved in most common abortion procedures I ever heard of.

-- Anonymous, August 17, 2000


The drinking age was moved to 21 years from 18 in an attempt to reduce drinking-related automobile accidents, which prior to the change in the law were disproportionately common among drivers under 21. The federal government pressured states into raising the drinking age by making it a requirement for receiving federal highway funding. The change appears to be working: statistics show a 55 percent drop in alcohol- related fatal auto crashes for 16- to 20-year-olds from 1984 to 1994,

-- Anonymous, August 17, 2000


When the draft was in force, 18 was considered adult for most purposes - that is why the vote was lowered to 18, and the drinking age was still 18 in most states. The military held out a long time before raising on-base drinking priviledges to 21, and it wasn't until it was an all-volunteer military that they did. (You're old enough to be drafted to die and responsible enough to carry a machine gun, but not old enough to have a beer?)

Other rights still varied from state to state, though - when my parents got married (at 20), my dad had already served a full tour in the Marines before crossing over to the Air Force, yet California law deemed my mother old enough to marry without permission, yet as a male, he had to get his mother's permission to marry.

-- Anonymous, August 17, 2000


Five years ago I would have had an entirely different answer for this, as I started getting information about lawyers and emancipation at the age of fifteen (I was an obnoxious brat, and my mother is a martyr for having lived through my teen years)

But I think 18 is a good age, even though I was on my own and supporting myself before then. In one month I will be old enough to buy liquor, and yes, I find the law inconvenient, but I agree with it, because it has prevented deaths. I just have someone else buy me liquor if I need it, it isn't an issue. However, it's hard to miss the irony that I've been running a consulting business since 19 and worked for several startups where I was wasn't old enough to drink at the company parties.

-- Anonymous, August 18, 2000


in Australia, drinking/voting/etc age is 18; you can't get a licence to drive until you're 17 in NSW (the state I live in) and you're on a provisional licence for a year. while you're on a provisional licence or under 21 (I think!) the alcohol limit is 0.02% - much less than the 0.05% which applies later to full-permit adult drivers. Plus, provisional licence holders have a maximum speed limit.

It's the "no drinking until 21" that floors me in the US. To me it seems completely weird, but I suppose it's what you're used to.

cheers a

-- Anonymous, August 18, 2000


The problem I have with the drinking age being 21 is that it makes alcohol a much bigger deal than it should be. Before 21, it is something forbidden that is therefore really exciting. Then, when a kid turns 21, there is an expectation that they will go out that night and drink until they get sick. It seems a bit screwed up to me... But it isn't the age itself that makes it, it is the cultural attitude towards the age limit and drinking itself.

As for 18... I think there needs to be some evening out of rights, and 18 might be as good an age as any to be an adult. As it is now (in the US), One can drive at 16, vote at 18, drink at 21, marry at various ages (depending upon state and gender), and so on... It's just confusing.

And then with voting ages, there is the sad fact that lawmakers don't give a damn about the views of anybody who can't vote. That being the case, I would prefer the voting age to be as young as possible. When I was 15 or so, this was a major issue with me. I think I'm just too tired to care now.

-- Anonymous, August 19, 2000


as anna said above, in australia the drinking law is 18, same with voting. Depending on which state you live in, depends on the age when you can get your license. queensland its 17, where victoria its 18, and south australia is 16. But all states have at least a minium of one years provisional license. have the legal age of 18 seems to work fairly well here

-- Anonymous, August 19, 2000


i think if you can join the military at age 18, smoke at 18 and vote at 18, you should be able to drink at 18. To me if adulthood is 18 then you should be adult enough to drink.you can be sent out to die for your counrty at 18 but you cant have beer. they should just make adulthood age 21 .

-- Anonymous, April 30, 2001

Jen Wade wrote:
The change appears to be working: statistics show a 55 percent drop in alcohol- related fatal auto crashes for 16- to 20-year-olds from 1984 to 1994.

That doesn't prove anything unless statistics also show no similar drop in alcohol-related fatal auto crashes for those aged 21 and over.

-- Anonymous, April 30, 2001


I believ that if they lower the drinking age hen there would be a dramatical drop in the drunk driving accidents

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2001

I think it makes sense. There's no one age at which all people become "mature," of course, and many do become mature enough to be considered "adult" well before 18. But it's a good, safe number that should make sure the legal protections and restrictions of being a juvenile extend to most people until they no longer need them.

But if that's the age, it really should be a uniform age for everything that goes with being an adult. Lower the drinking age, raise the driving age and make it a simple one-line measure of all of it.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2001


The idealist in me says 14 should be the age of adulthood. I find people in general, including teenagers, are much smarter than given credit for.

However, the saving lives/drunk driving thing and the dropping out of school/fucking up your life on a pretty permanent basis thing give me pause.

Still, I'd rather live in a society where everyone got drunk at age 18 but only a handful of people needed cars (cuz we had sane urban planning and good public transit) than in a place where every family with two teens needs four cars but booze needs to be made illegal until 21.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2001



I'm with you on that last, Dave. I think the artificially late age of 21 for drinking (when, at 21, people are considered to have been adults in every other way for years and are operating in an adult environment) contributes to alcohol abuse far more than it prevents it - it sets it up as a tempting taboo and way too many kids have the idea that the sole purpose of alcohol is to get wasted. They don't learn how to handle it properly.

Having spent my teen years in a country where it was legal for me to drink, I'm never going to be convinced that banning alcohol from older teens is accomplishing anything positive (other than the drunk driving stats that Jen mentioned, which I think are more appropriately addressed by raising the stakes for responsible driving). Nearly every kid I knew drank occasionally, but the only ones I knew who were committed to the idea of getting drunk were those whose parents were trying to make them live by U.S. drinking standards rather than those of the local populace.

I gotta tell ya, it takes a lot of the thrill out when you're heading out the door and all your parents tell you is that if you're going to the Gasthaus, make sure you WALK home in a group, not drive.

Germany's laws seemed to work much better because they didn't ban access to alcohol, but they did put very high penalties on any illegal behavior that resulted. It made it much, much easier to be responsible about it.

I don't know what their stats are for alcoholism, but I think our tendency to regard alcohol itself as so powerful that it must be outlawed (that evil brew!) actually breeds alcoholism - we teach kids they are powerless against it, don't teach them a think about responsible usage, and send them lots of signals that make it very attractive to try to break those rules and find out what the big deal is. We're setting them up for problems.

Banning things instead of expecting responsible use of things just almost never works, in my opinion.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001


Oh... but 14 for adulthood? Can I send you my kids to stay for a month when they're 14? They're plenty smart... they're also plenty nuts - 14 is like 2 all over again, except they have larger vocabularies. hah!

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001

Lynda,

Trust me, you *don't* want me corrupting your 14 year olds.

What's really screwed up to me is this push to try younger and younger kids as adults, while still saying, "16 year olds aren't smart enough to make their own decisions."

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001


I'd support 18 as the Big Benchmark Age for everything, including drinking. Here's the catch, though: in my world, driving would have to wait until 18, too. Yes, I'm aware of the issues. Yes, I still hold this basic opinion. If I were queen of the world, I would be open to negotiation on restricted licenses, but mostly, I'm set on this 18 thing.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001

Frankly, I've always thought the smarter arrangement would be to make the drinking age about two years younger than the driving age, probably 16 and 18. Let them get over the thrill of drinking and learn how to do it responsibly and get a couple years' experience so they know their limits before authorizing them to operate a piece of heavy high-speed machinery.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001

That's actually a really sensible idea, Michael. I wonder if the relatively young driving age has something to do with parents not wanting to cart their kids around? Kids in the suburbs usually can't take the bus and need to be driven places.

A few years ago California changed the driving laws ... I can't remember the specifics, but I think the upshot was that drivers under 18 couldn't operate the car with another minor in the car unless there was also an adult present, and couldn't drive after dark (except with an adult, maybe). I heard a lot of grumbling from parents of teenagers because they were going to have to drive their kids everywhere.

I think we have some Australians on the board ... aren't the driving and drinking ages there the same? At least in Victoria, I think they are. How do you think your system works?

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001


Maryland is moving in that direction - provisional licenses that only allow them to operate a vehicle from sunrise to sunset, and the rule about no groups of kids together unless an adult is there, as well as raising the age to get a learners by a few months.

I expect this will eventually go through all the states, just as the drinking age is, because it's being pushed by the insurance companies and I'll bet road funding is going to come into play at some point to convince states to get on board with it.

Driving the kids everywhere (esp. when they're going in different directions at the same time) IS a drag sometimes, but this is one situation where I approve - driver's ed is no longer offered in schools, and the driving test is a joke (they don't take them on highways anymore during the test because it's too hazardous for the DMV person grading the test - WTF???). There's been at least 1 traffic related fatality a year at the high school my girls attend, and most of them are due, not to chemical impairment, but to simple poor judgement based on inexperience. In addition, there have been a few accidents where others have died from the same - including one man about a mile from where I live that was clipped (broad daylight) while he was collecting the mail out of his mailbox.

I approve of anything that requires people to have a MUCH longer training time before letting them loose on the road - whether they're a first time driver in their teens or as an adult.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001


as a few Aussies have already said, basically the drinking/driving/voting age is 18. where i live(d), a state called victoria, you can get your probationary license at age 18 (meaning you can drive by yourself, you dont have to have an adult in the car with you) but you arent allowed to drink and drive at all. blood alochol level always has to be 0.00. the probationary license is for 3 years as well. so most ppl are age 21 when they are finally on the 'full' license.

i dont know whether statistically not being allowed to drive while under the influence of alcohol does actually work, but for me it meant i had to think about whether i would be drinking or not. if i was i would take alternate transport. at some clubs/pubs 'designated drivers' (ie., ppl not drinking for the night) were given free soft drink all night.

in my opinion the european system works best. i spent some of my teenage years in France where sometimes after school we headed to the pub for a beer or two. for me, this seemed to stem my attitude of drinking just to get pissed ( <- aussie term for drunk).

just a few random thoughts...

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2001


I actually quite like 16 as the cutoff age. In Eastern Canada, where I grew up, it is the cutoff age for several things - age when you can drive, age when you can legally consent to sex with whoever the hell you want, age when you can be emancipated from your parents if you don't want to wait for 18. Of course, all the other 'adult' laws are all over the place. I will say that it was personally Extremely Irritating to move to Colorado from Montreal and, having been free to get plastered (which I've never done) or hang out in bars til 3 am (now that was more common) for two years, suddenly be suspect. I actually *was* 21 and a half, but I got a lot of dubious reactions. And before I moved out here, I went to bars with my husband a couple times (ie the terrace at the local posh hotel) and got *turned away* because I was only 20. I was not so much pissed off as dumbfounded. So that particular law just doesn't make sense to me. On the other hand, I have also come to the conclusion that I was much more grown up or mature or whatever at 16 than I was at 18. Took me until 22 or so to get back to that 16-year-old 'peak'. So I find the idea of a steady progression of maturity somewhat implausible in the first place.

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2001

I found your responses to the query interesting. As a single parent of three teens I am totally convinced that the legal age should be returned to 21 or the completion of college if enrolled. Many people do not realize the wide range of ramifications to various legal issues that are affected by the change in legal age. Yes, I thought it mostly dealt with voting and drinking also. HOWEVER, it totally affects child support and the criminal system. Did you know that because the legal age is 18, no parent has to support you at all after your 18th birthday or completion of high school! Also in a divorce situation, neither parent has to commit funds toward a college education. If the law were reinstated to at least 21, funds through child support would at least be available! I don't know any 18 year-olds that are financially independent. Most don't have full time jobs, health insurance, transportation, car insurance, or their own living quarters. 60% of college graduates return home because they can't affort to live on their own. In the case of death of a parent, social security also doesn't offer a child 18 or over any help toward college. This is another change that came about when adulthood was established at age 18. So the legal age is not just about those immediate empowering privileges-the change in the law affects your life more than you realize!

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2001

I'm confused... when was 21 ever the legal age of adulthood across the board? Culturally and legally, childhood is getting longer, not shorter.

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2001

Barring the developmentally or physically disabled, no one should have the *right* to parental support after 18. Given appropriate incentive, the vast majority of 18 year olds could very well be self sustaining at 18. Much of the screw ups you see in folks 18-22 are the result of knowing there's no real consequence- Mom and Dad *have* to support them, right? I mean, they deserve it!

Whatever.

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2001


Dunno when the law changed from 21 to 18 for most things, but the last vestige of adulthood beginning at 21 ended in 1971? or whenever the voting age went down to 18. And went back up to 21 (not 20 or 22 but the age we were culturally familiar with) in the '80s for drinking. I don't know for certain historically, but there're literary and cinematic references like that Almanzo Wilder's parents could hold him until he was 21 or choose to emancipate him, and how old someone customarily is when they have full rights to their trust funds, and such like, that indicate a cultural understanding of 21 being the age of majority.

-- Anonymous, July 10, 2001

The state I'm from, basically when you do turn 18, you aren't considered a child anymore, you're an adult. Even Social Security won't even help your @SS at 18, because they will tell you go find a job, you're 18 yrs old and old enough to work(Like where can you find a job at, huh? Everything is full to the top until probably Fall!).

You can go fight for your country, vote, drive, own a car, get married, buy or rent a car, join this one travelling job, plus other jobs like customer service. Get cable tv and modem services, buy tobacco products and smoke, get gas and electricity services, live on your own, move to another state, go to college, buy or play scratch and lottery tickets, get a checking account, buy a house get AOL and other online services, and credit cards.

But the thing that I don't get, you can't even drink beer until three years. Why is that? I'm almost 18 and I'm nervous. That's the things you can do when you're 18 in my state. I don't know about other states, but I guess if you can do adult things at 18, like buying a credit card with a $10,000 credit line, why don't they make drinking legal at 18 in the States? In Kansas, you can go to nightclubs, but you can't drink anything but water and soda.

I think they consider 18 to be the age to enter adulthood in the late 70s to early 80s, but I have to look it up. But I sure can't wait to turn 18 next Saturday so I can find me a job and do 'adult things'. I think they should consider 18 to be the drinking age, too. Instead of having us wait three yrs. I mean, I know mature adults at 18. If the fools get in the car and drive drunk, let the fools play the consequences.

I mean, let's use this for an example. They lifted the age 21 ban to buy liquor to 18. You're 18 yrs old and want to buy beer. So you go to the liquor store and buy a 12 case of beer. You take the beer home and drink 6 cans, suddenly you're drunk. Instead of driving to your friend's house, you go to bed. Now that's the mature way. Immature folks would get in the car and drive drunk, now they are the troubled winos.

I mean, if you're old enough to buy tobacco, and buy a credit card, get a checking account, you should be old enough to buy wine coolers and other alcoholic beverages if you're 18.

-- Anonymous, July 23, 2001


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