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Battle System Gripes
greenspun.com : LUSENET : Monster Rancher 2 : One Thread
There are a few things that irk me about the way the battle system works in mr2.1) I don't understand how some monsters could POSSIBLY beat others when the computer determines their outcome. Ex: Take Rockgeiger versus Hyoue. Assume that their life bars look like this before the battle: Hyoue Rockgeiger IIIIIIIIIIIIIII VS IIIIIIIIIIIIIII And after the battle they look like this: Hyoue Rockgeiger IIIIIIIIIIIIII VS IIIIIIII Now in theory Hyoue's Speed is so high compaired to Rockgeiger's Skill that Rockgeiger should never hit Hyoue even once. But according to the computer, he did. Which brings my question: Compairing Rockgeiger's Strength to Hyoue's Defense and Life, how in the hell could Rockgeiger deal such a small amout of damage to Hyoue? Even with his weakest move, he should have knocked him down to at least HALF his health.
This leads into my second gripe. How does the computer figure out the To Hit% exactly? It seems arbitrary to me and here's why: No matter how high my Speed is on my (Speed Demon) compaired to my opponents Skill, they can always, without a doubt, 100% of the time, hit me at least once, and inevitably with their LOWEST To Hit% (which usually also means it's their strongest move). The only saving grace to this seemingly arbitrary definition of To Hit% is that when I do get struck by my opponent's move that has 30% or less to hit, I can turn right around and hit my opponent with my lowest To Hit% move.
Has anyone else noticed these things or is it just me? These are the things that really bug me most about this game, and sadly they have to do with my favorite part, fighting other monsters.
-- El_Buttweasle (el_buttweasle@yahoo.com), December 21, 1999Answers
For some reason the little picture I made to show Rockgeiger's and Hyoue's life bars came out funky, so imagine that when they start, they both have 15 I's VS 15 I's, and when the fight is over it's 14 I's VS 8 I's.
-- El_Buttweasle (el_buttweasle@yahoo.com), December 21, 1999.Ahhh, I now feel accepted at this message board.
-- El_Buttweasle (el_buttweasle@yahoo.com), December 21, 1999.Don't be so childish. Message board's member came from different country and don't expect them give you answer immediately. If you want immediate response, use chat.Return to you question. Have you figure your enemy cursor postion? Do you notice that when the cursor move, your hit rate will decrease 1 - 2%?
Do you notice that when your enemy fire their attack. Your monster will most likely escape the attack if you pushing difference button? Garboo straight punch could escape by R1/L1 button. But you will grantee to be hit if you just do a back and fore moment?
Do you notice that Garboo will not able to escape your double attack (fire the second attack before it return from its escaped position. Of course your monster need hight speed to do this).
Using appropriate button movment could help you win the battle. I have a worm with 200 spd could escape attack for ski 300+ with the above method.
-- Tornado (wind@death-star.com), December 21, 1999.My speedy monsters seem to get hit by opponents with 1%chance occasionally, but I miss opponents with a 99%chance all the time. About every other battle.And about the opponent vs. opponent I saw Rockgeiger hit Offrey and Offrey still survived and he won too! That was really messed up since I got hit by Rockgeigers weakest attack and it did more damage to me than Offrey has life(plus my defense was a few levels higher). But it's just a minor thing and I never noticed that whole low chance to hit for both. I just use really skillful monsters so it doesn't happen much.
-- Zack (belgrath16@aol.com), December 21, 1999.Why don't you try before you said so?I have found this on the most of the monster below class A. Currently, I am a rank 6 trainner. I can garantee the above work for most monster. You could incrase you change of being hit by certain attack using difference key combo. e.g. Garboo straight punch by L1/R1. a color parando attack (I forget the name) could be escape by move back and fore.
-- Tornado (wind@death-star.com), December 22, 1999.Sorry for typing mistake. I mean decrease the change of being hit.The attitude of "Bull shit without try" make you two so stupid.
-- Tornado (wind@death-star.com), December 22, 1999.It's not the matter of trying it or not. It's the matter of pure LOGIC. How would you know what buttons to press? How do you know how many buttons to press? How did you figure out the buttons for your monsters' attacks?P(a,b) = permutations, C(c,d) = combinations.
Do you realize that there are C(12,2)= 66 button combinations of pressing 2 buttons on the controller(not including start, select)?
By your examples, order is important. So permutaions should be used.
With regard to order at which you press them, you'll have P(12,2) = 132 button permutations of pressing 2 buttons on the controller.
Similarily:
P(12,3) = 1320 button permutaions of 3 buttons.
P(12,4) = 11,880 button permutations of 4 buttons.
P(12,12) = 479,001,600 button permutaions of 12 buttons.
After the button choosing, you'll also have to consider timing. At what time do you press the buttons? any time? So, just keep banging on the controller until your monster dodges, right?
Unless specified in the instruction booklet(or some other RELIABLE source), this idea of pressing random buttons to change the percentage system seems quite fallable.
Also, with regard to the enemy cursor position: It does not decrease your percentage of hit/dodge by moving that. You are most likely witnessing the effects of guts. When your guts goes higher, your hit% and evasion% increases. The reason why you see the %'s change, is because one monster is increasing/decreasing their guts faster than the other.
-- RNA (RNA@Ribosome.nuc), December 22, 1999.Ya'll the battle system ain't that screwed I have never been hit with 1% and I have missed once with 98% As for the rock geiger vs. hyoule does it matter all that matters is who you face not how you face him and that only matters in elimination matches. I have had plenty of matches where my monster with low speed can go through A whole match unhit as well as a monster with high speed get hit several times. it all balances if you play long enough but if you don't believe this take a monster with over 700 speed to the elder's cup and fight gadoc all his hit% are 6% or less and he hasn't hit my pheonix yet. I am currently fighting astound with my zilla and I like to complain about his winning almost every time but, all his stats are higher than mine.
-- tjmax (tjmax@tnweb.com), December 22, 1999.hey tornado,who are you to call people stupied,your messages were written so badly i had a very hard time to try to understand what the hell you were saying,next time try not to use so many words you dont know how to spell,i know that will cut down your vocabulary but it will help us out a lot.
-- matt (korn97limp@hotmail.com), December 22, 1999.matt, thanks for your suggestion. But please tolerance it since english is my secondary language.I am here just for sharing my observation result. I don't want to waste time to make people believe.
-- Tornado (wind@death-star.com), December 22, 1999.mew? mew mew mew? mew mew!! melenium link out~
-- Link (Gr Jarkeld@Aol.Com), December 22, 1999.I have a few beefs here too, not that it detracts from the fun of the game tho. But you ever notice how no matter how hard or strong your monster is its VERY hard for you to push youself forward or back if the CPU is move to or against you. Yet when the computer wants to force YOU into a position it always can with ease? And I had a Hopper with 700ski and 650spd going against a monster with around 40 or so ski and 50 or so spd and it could constantly hit me whereas I was rarely if ever able to land a hit on it even with my hit techs? And this is almost a constant thing not just occasionally. I ALWAYS have a harder time hitting them then them hitting me even when there is an INSANE amount of differences in speed and skill. sorry theres something a little buggy there if ya ask me. I think the computer cheats more often then not : )
-- Faeth (forlander2@aol.com), December 23, 1999.
-- Argos (stanrock@uwm.edu), April 14, 2000