(Yes, I'm bored at the moment)

I've been scrolling through the New Question list in search of interesting threads, and noticed a couple of individuals who seem into the habit of throwing new threads to stir up controversy. Which is very cool with me since I've been actively busy posting to them. So, in the spirit of the old board daze, lets have a contest!

Here's my 2 contenders:

Our resident Aussie who has been placing perticularly huge anthills, but hasn't been kicking them real hard himself, Pieter, zaadz@icisp.net.au

And "Decker's Fan Troll" (he goes by several trollish names, i.e. Bob Bastard and Frolicking with Fido).

(Oh please everyone, don't tell me to get a life I'll be hurt.)

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 05, 2000

Answers

Hawk (it's a love/hate thing)

-- cin (cinlooo@aol.corn), April 05, 2000.

I would say hawk, but he is serious!

My vote is for..............Jim Cooke-He is always quick on the keyboard and he is always found in the threads with the most debate. (obviously I do not think kicking anthills is a bad thing!).

-- FutureShock (gray@matter.think), April 05, 2000.

G'Day Chris,

A couple of weeks ago I nearly dropped off the screen with ennui and figured to retire into oblivion. The board wasn't really sparkling and sparking like in ancient times. Even the squirrels were conspicuously absent with the King Dude suspected of having been run over afterall. Dashed inconvenient when you must perchance rally the troops but discover the figurehead striped yellow in the centre of the road.

Thus I resolved to 'kick an anthill or two' & read the fray that may result from the agitations.

I congratulate all participants for once more making this a forum one to frequent often. I'll get into the fray as well, but gazing out to sea to spot Malcolm Taylor's humungous iceberg does require diligence and application.

I've also got a bit of pictorial gossip regarding Bro Possum's infiltration of the Olympic Games and shall table the results as soon as possible. This is hot stuff!!!

Meantime watch the news regarding a cyclone cat. 3 force at Cairns. It's about to go ballistic now.

Regards from OZ

-- Pieter (zaadz@icisp.net.au), April 05, 2000.

Please be careful, Pieter. My hopes are with you.

-- (I know@ I .saw), April 06, 2000.

Hey Peter,

As anyone knows lately--or so I've heard--I MAY BE "the favorite anthill." [grin]

Stay tuned. I spent the day with "Ken the Y2k Cockroach." I'm told that for some folks "down under" he is a familiar icon.

'Ever heard of him? [grin]

:)

-- FM (vidprof@aol.com), April 06, 2000.

Sorry for previously mispelling your name, Pieter.

I think I may have been in America too long...[grin]

:)

-- FM (vidprof@aol.com), April 06, 2000.

"I would say hawk, but he is serious!"

Not as serious as I may lead you to believe. ;-) However, your perception does seem to verify the effectiveness of my strategy.

The small of mind are bullies, they try to compensate for their lack of insight by using intimidation. Ignorant and narrow-minded people don't take you seriously until you use words that they perceive to be threatening, and they seldom back down until they sense a clear and present danger.

I am not a bounty hunter or a detective, but it was fun to see people like Ra and Sifting quietly slip away from the forum when they thought that I was really going to come looking for them. :-)

I wasn't joking about being 6'3", 240 lbs. and capable of doing some serious ass kicking, but it is not in my nature, and I have never seriously hurt anyone.

BTW, some of you people take language WAY too seriously. There are 16 different ways to arrange the letters C,F,K, and U, fuck just happens to be one of them. It is only in your mind that this is perceived as offensive, or "foul" language. It is meaningless. It is the manner in which a combination of words is used that true verbal abuse is realized. Flint and Decker are very good at doing this without using the "seven deadlies" but the actions speak louder than the words. I don't play games like that, I just let people know in simple terms that they are being rude without trying to conceal it or feign superiority.

You gotta admit, you love my honesty when I start swearing, and I keep most of you from being tremendously bored with yourselves! Like cin says, "it's a love/hate thing". :-)

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 06, 2000.

Hawk:

Define "seriously hurt anyone". It sounded like your finger twisting thing was pretty serious :^)

Future:

I guess I do qualify and I'm proud to be your favorite anthill kicker.

-- Jim Cooke (JJCooke@yahoo.com), April 06, 2000.

shhesshhh my feelings are hurt, I tried to get a 'contest' going along of the lines of 'whos is really who' but not much success....

Chris, I hope this is MMORREEE successful than mine....

My VOTE is.....HAWK......no contest. at all...

He is...the dude ya LOVE to HATE, and yes hawk I think your comebacks are the greatest by far....

Although most know you are in 'jest' still you are one funny fellow.

Somedays I'd wish with all that bounty huntin experience you'd come take me away from it all!!!!!!!!

{{{{consumer, whom you would have to draaaggg out of the whirlpool....

-- consumer (shh@aol.com), April 06, 2000.

G'Day,
Cyclone at Cairns downgraded from 3 to nuisance value according to an email I just got from FNQ.

In reply to FM re: Ken the Cockroach etc. That was a Kiwi thing from over the Tasman. We are more partial to galahs, larrikins, drongos and GM phenomenon calling themselves politicians.

Chris, This question of anthill kicking is premature I believe, because reading some threads over the past few days indicates that this forum isn't moribund. Indeed it may become rather interesting.

...err...Hawk who?

Regards from OZ

-- Pieter (zaadz@icisp.net.au), April 06, 2000.

Chris:

Define what you mean by anthill kicker. I would be glad to recast my vote if your defination is significantly different from mine.

-- FutureShock (gray@matter.think), April 06, 2000.

However, your perception does seem to verify the effectiveness of my strategy.

Strategy?? Uh oh. I think I've heard this before.

I am not a bounty hunter or a detective, but it was fun to see people like Ra and Sifting quietly slip away from the forum when they thought that I was really going to come looking for them. :-)

Hmmm. Deja vu. So you're not what you seem, but just trying an experiment to frighten your opponents, perhaps those you consider your "trolls".

Sounds familiar.

Are you also going to announce that you're marrying Mr. Polly??

LOL.

-- (hmm@hmm.hmm), April 06, 2000.

Chris,

I'm likewise a little unclear what how you wish to categorize "Anthill Kicker". If it's someone who posts to generate a reaction, then I'd say Lady Logic is a master at this. I also enjoy Hawk's more intelligent exchanges, but when he stays too long in 4 letter word mode it starts remining me of my 17 year old Punk step-son (not pleasant memories). Jim and Pieter also rate high on the list for stimulating more intellectual interaction.

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), April 06, 2000.

hmm, Are you thinking that Hawk is Lady Logic? No way, Jose.

-- (you@must.be kidding), April 06, 2000.

I was just pointing out the similarities. You know. Humor. Ha ha.

-- (hmm@hmm.hmm), April 06, 2000.

Future Shock and Flash, thanks for asking. I realize now that it could mean anything to anyone.

The contest is meant to be somewhat sarcastic, and the title Best Anthill Kicker is supposed to be something to be proud of, as opposed to be called a "troll". I do mean "stirs up controversy" and get people to talk and think, whether you agree with them or not, and the person is not directly attacking people (as a troll would). So Hawk would not qualify for me.

This contest is in honor of Flint, who was slapped the label Anthill Kicker by the Ezboard sysops, and that term seems to have become part of the Ezboarder's everyday vocabulary for anyone who disagrees with them or stirs up controversy. I want Flint to pass on the crown to someone else ;-)

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

I just realized I contradicted myself, or at least appeared to.

"Decker's Fan Troll" I don't really see as a full fledge troll because he just throws controversial threads and watches the resulting fray. Although in one of his subjects he does make a barb at Decker with "here's something else to sweep under the rug." But it's not lethal ;-)

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

Chris,

I'll have to defer to those of you who have been around here a lot longer than I, but I would nominate Jim or Pieter.

you,

I would agree on this, but am intrigued by the comment in another thread about "Lady Logic is not what she seems". Although this is decidedly vague, due to the fact that she is obviously quite intelligent, it is grounds for interesting speculation. I'd love to know what some of you long-time forum members interpret this to mean.

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), April 06, 2000.

Flash, in regards to Ladylogic, I don't know who made this comment, it's one person's opinion, but I would think that s/he means that his/her own assumptions about Ladylogic have turned out wrong.

Since you're new to this forum, you have the advantage of not having preconceived ideas about regular posters. I myself had to wipe my mind clean of all such preconceptions and publicly declared that I was from now on getting to know people with a fresh new outlook on this new forum.

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

Chris,

What an excellent viewpoint!

Using Lady Logic as an example, although I didn't experience her posts from last year, I was irritated and upset and her spamming that helped shut down the old TB2K. However, it seems to me that she HAS in fact changed a lot this year, and I am pleased to accept and experience that. Most of the posters here seem to be highly intelligent people, and we all can change our views with time.

Thanks for sharing your positive outlook!!!

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), April 06, 2000.

Thanks for being so open-minded Chris. It is sooo nice to have someone judge me as a whole person; not just some cut an pastes, or based on the opinions of a few others.

Flash, that remark was made by cpr back at Debunker's:

Link

http://stand77.com/wwwboard/messages/11908.html

I have an idiot troll named "archiver" who just can't understand that it wasn't a rank. (Of course, my trolls have IQ's that closely match their shoe size.)

Gotta go! Explaining what I said, and what other people said in the past, is NOT my idea of having a fun life.

See ya around, neighbor!

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), April 06, 2000.

My vote is for..............Jim Cooke-He is always quick on the keyboard and he is always found in the threads with the most debate.

Indeed, Mr. Cooke's title of Skeptic Extraordinaire is well earned.

-- David L (bumpkin@dnet.net), April 06, 2000.

FM/MM (also uses other "handles") takes the cake in my book.

-- Buddy (buddydc@go.com), April 06, 2000.

Flint is the definition of an anthill kicker, he even admitted it himself. He perceives himself as a mental "giant", and the rest of us as "ants". He has developed some skill with the manipulation of vocabulary and knowledge to make it appear that he is always "right", but the world today has little need for this kind of "intelligence without awareness".

I like to open people's minds by challenging them to see things from another perspective, because this is the way that awareness expands. There are 6 billion people on this planet, and our problems will never be resolved until we reach a state of awareness where we are willing to understand the perspectives of each and every one of us. No one needs to force anyone else to change the way they live, they just need to understand an accept it without intolerance.

But then there are always some nuts that are more difficult to crack, like Flint and Jim Cooke, who choose to be skeptical and contrarian on all issues, because it allows them to perceive themselves as always being "right". There's nothing wrong with disagreement or skepticism at times, the problem is when you stubbornly refuse to allow yourself to consider the possibility that someone else may have a different perspective. I respond to narrow-minded people as I do to make this non-productive behavior more obvious by providing an exaggerated demonstration of its utter futility. We've seen on this forum that this accomplishes nothing but non-constructive conflict. The answers to all of our problems are right in front of us, all we have to do is open our eyes, and agree to use them. It's easy. :-)

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 06, 2000.

Laura,

Thanks for the interesting link. It does provide some enlightening insights. It appears that you were/are attempting to write a book. If still true, on what subject? Is it about the Y2K hysteria, this group, or maybe even the psychology behind the various personalities that frequent here? I don't recall if you posted your degree specialty at ASU, but might it be psychology (abnormal or otherwise)? It's interesting to try and get a sense of what various forum members are really like in real life. I think that the people here are more interesting to interact with than those in a lot of other places. And, I especially enjoy the sense of humor that is often evident. Keep it up gang!

-- Flash (Flash@flash.hq), April 06, 2000.

Hawk, as hard as I've tried to bite my tongue, and even have my left hand force my right hand to click on the "back button" to skip such posts from you, I am giving in to my weaknesses this one time;

You are a first rate example of "projection".

There, I feel better.

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

From the Hawkster....

"I am not a bounty hunter or a detective, but it was fun to see people like Ra and Sifting quietly slip away from the forum when they thought that I was really going to come looking for them. :-)"

I wasn't aware that I had quietly slipped away. This must be some more humor from the Hawkster.

-- Sifting (through@the.rubble), April 06, 2000.

Not sure what you mean by that Chris, but I think a more accurate description is that I am a first rate example of "reflection". Since it is impossible for me to change people, I simply reflect their attitudes back to themselves. If they have any sensitivity at all, they will usually pick up on this, even on a subconcious level, and it eventually helps them to understand themselves, thereby raising their consciousness level toward others, which is so desperately needed in the world today.

For example, one of the areas in which you are rather repressive, and therefore intolerant of others is your sexuality. You need to get to be a little more comfortable with yourself in this respect, so that you don't continue to go around "projecting" your attitude on others in such a prudish fashion. I think you are intelligent enough to understand those words, but if you were more of an ignorant troll like some of the others, I would be forced to make the message understandable to you on a less civilized level. I would probably say something like... "you're a sexually frustrated bitch, don't preach your holier-than-thou morals to others". Get it? :-)

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 06, 2000.

Well, I hate to repeat myself, but Hawk and Flint would be at the top. I would put Al-D at the top, but it is my impression that he really believed what he was saying.

Best wishes,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), April 06, 2000.

For example, one of the areas in which you are rather repressive, and therefore intolerant of others is your sexuality.

Could you provide an example in which Chris demonstrates this repressiveness and intolerance?

-- (hmm@hmm.hmm), April 06, 2000.

"Could you provide an example in which Chris demonstrates this repressiveness and intolerance?"

Certainly, this is just one of the most recent of several examples.

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 06, 2000.

Thanks.

-- (hmm@hmm.hmm), April 06, 2000.

Hawk,

You old instigator you! You're either trying to get a rise out of her, or plain old barking up the wrong tree.

-- flora (***@__._), April 06, 2000.

I am not a bounty hunter or a detective, but it was fun to see people like Ra and Sifting quietly slip away from the forum when they thought that I was really going to come looking for them. :-)

So in other words you LIED!

That's OK Hawkarama, I'm not really the Nobel Prize winning astronaut/deepsea treasure salvor/trail blazing spelunker/gourmet chef/prize winning brewmeister that many here believe me to be.

Of course, unlike you, I never LIED and told folks that, they just sorta came up with it on their own.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), April 06, 2000.

Flash, I was thinking of writing a book last February. I decided no one cares about Y2k but us, and we're reading about it every day here. There's no market! (Besides, I'm finding e-biz far more interesting.)

Gotta go, it's gonna be over 90 degrees here again today, and I'd like to get my shopping done before it gets any warmer.

Later!

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), April 06, 2000.

Lol Unc!! I certainly wouldn't be the first to lie on this forum! Perhaps we could consider it a little harmless white lie in the name of having fun? I confessed too. ;-)

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 06, 2000.

Hawk, that's a bunch of crap. Chris has a right to her opinion without you telling her she's a sexually frustrated bitch.

How dare you? Who in the hell do you think you are? Chris is a very nice woman who rarely, if ever, makes personal attacks on anyone, so your attack on her is simply evidence that you are one mean jerk.

You said before you don't attack unless you're provoked, and I believed you.

Hold on a minute,... could this be a vicious loop that has developed? Someone said something, to someone, about whatever, whenever, and the attacks just keep happening because nobody can forgive?

How sick is it that people keep sitting in their house typing fights over the internet?

THIS SHIT HAS GOT TO STOP!

(Excuse me for now. I'm so pissed off I have to read some Breathnach.)

~*~

-- (Ladylogic@...), April 06, 2000.

LL,

It's about 74 up here in the cool Pines. Why don't you and Mr. Polly get married up in Sedona? I've known several people who did, and it was real nice. A lot cooler than PHX. Maybe up on the SF Peaks would be nice, too, or maybe Walnut Canyon. Anytime but Winter, of course!!!

-- Flash (flash@flash.hq), April 06, 2000.

My vote goes to Flint and zog, even though I don't recall seeing zog over here much. Tending somewhat toward the "doomer" side of the road myself, I have followed a good many of zog's links on various subjects and have had rude awakenings on many occasions.

Flint, on the other hand, drives me to distraction because he tends to make so goddamn much sense. He knows on some elemental level that we doomers just hate logic and facts (I highly recommend reading Bill Schenker's essays on the doomer mentality), and uses that knowledge to push the right buttons. I can just imagine him sitting at his computer, hands clasped behind his head, watching the latest shitstorm he helped create with a bseg on his face!

On another note, d'ya think Mr. Polly powders his big white ass too? Ahhhh! A marriage made in Heaven.

Jimmy

-- Jimmy Splinters (inthe@dark.com), April 06, 2000.

Hawk, since you're willing to be civilized with me (although it's thinly veiled, i.e. your frustrated bitch comment ;-) ) I'll respond to you. But I'm afraid this response will turn this thread for which I meant to be light and fun, into either a heated controversy, or get you so riled up that you won't be able to remain civil. But here goes nothing.

"Not sure what you mean by that Chris, but I think a more accurate description is that I am a first rate example of "reflection"."

"Projection" is Psychology 101 under the classification of Defense Mechanisms. If you haven't studied psychology, it'd be impossible for me to help you understand this simple aspect of it in a short post. So maybe you'd want to look it up either on the net or someplace else.

"Since it is impossible for me to change people, I simply reflect their attitudes back to themselves."

(Since you don't understand Projection, it might be difficult for you to grasp what I'm attempting to show you here.) In this sentence you demonstrate a frustration at your inability to "make" people understand "your" point of view. One cannot MAKE anyone understand anything, ever. We cannot FORCE people to understand. Hence your frustration, and your use of the Defense Mechanism "projection". Defense Mechanisms are ways we use to protect our ego, our feelings. There are many of them, denial is one (as in being in denial that someone is dead because it is too painful.) Projection then, is to project unto others what we ourselves do, or behave, as if it wasn't us doing it but the other person, when in fact that person isn't behaving in the manner we're acusing him/her, but it is ourselves doing it. (Hope you're still following me, it's not something I understood in one sitting myself.)

" If they have any sensitivity at all, they will usually pick up on this, even on a subconcious level, and it eventually helps them to understand themselves, thereby raising their consciousness level toward others, which is so desperately needed in the world today."

This is a very common fallacy Hawk, that of believing people will understand something, or what we think or do, without having to explain in detail what we mean. Lets take for example a very simple example (if extreme); a mother gets annoyed that her todler keeps biting her, and she uses this "reflect" method of yours, and bites her todler back to show the kid just how painful and annoying it is. Will the child understand what the mother means to do? I think not! The child will cry and think his mother is mean, and still have no clue that his own behavior was wrong. Using "reflection" at your adult, more complex level, has the same effect on the people you're using it on.

" For example, one of the areas in which you are rather repressive, and therefore intolerant of others is your sexuality. You need to get to be a little more comfortable with yourself in this respect, so that you don't continue to go around "projecting" your attitude on others in such a prudish fashion. "

Here Hawk, you're simply saying that you don't agree with my views on sexuality, and because you can't MAKE me see it your way, or enjoy sex the way you do, you believe that I am not comfortable with myself and I'm prudish. Hawk, I love sex, and I'm not frustrated with my own choices. If I was frustrated, I'd change something. Frustration is caused by a sense of powerlessness, and knowing that, one has the power to change his/her own environment when the frustration becomes too great.

"I think you are intelligent enough to understand those words, but if you were more of an ignorant troll like some of the others, I would be forced to make the message understandable to you on a less civilized level."

I think I am intelligent enough to understand the street language as well as the civilized language. I chose not to use the street language as much as possible because it puts people on the defensive, and I can't get my points across to them. IMO Hawk, your own sense of frustration at getting others see it your way is because you use too much offensive communication, and not enough of the civilized type.

" I would probably say something like... "you're a sexually frustrated bitch, don't preach your holier-than-thou morals to others". Get it? :-) "

I used to think the same thing about those who knew more than me. Like I told Halyx on another thread, I was an idiot once.

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

"Hawk, I love sex, and I'm not frustrated with my own choices."

LOL!!! Could have fooled me! :-)

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 06, 2000.

Well, if you see sex only interesting if porn is involved, then ofcourse you've been fooled 8-) But perhaps someday if you're lucky, you'll understand what I mean.

I mean, REALLY lucky. woohoo!

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

Z -

Al-D??? Yowza! I hadn't thought about him in months. I have to agree that for sheer ability to stir up the animals, Al was the all-time champeen.

Can someone explain the difference between an "anthill kicker" and a common-or-garden "troll"? Is the former just a more slightly elegant term for the latter?

-- DeeEmBee (macbeth1@pacbell.net), April 06, 2000.

"Indeed, Mr. Cooke's title of Skeptic Extraordinaire is well earned"

What a minute, I don't think I agree with that descrip.....oopps, well, maybe David's right after all :^)

"Skepticism, like chastity, should not be relinquished too readily"

--George Santayana

-- Jim Cooke (JJCooke@yahoo.com), April 06, 2000.

DMB:

I've always wondered how much of the info posted about him was true.

Best wishes,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), April 06, 2000.

Jim:

"Skepticism, like chastity, should not be relinquished too readily"

As I recall George didn't follow his own advice.

Best wishes,,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), April 06, 2000.

Z -

Well, the "court-awarded millions" was certainly true, as it was cross-checked with some news items and some of Al's own postings on other boards. Not sure what other info was posted...

Al-D. Gone (at least from this forum), but certainly not forgotten.

-- DeeEmBee (macbeth1@pacbell.net), April 06, 2000.

Buddy (buddydc@go.com) is a classic example of a "Guerilla Anthill Kicker," covertly posting under AT LEAST 6 different identities on various Y2K forums to DATE.

Perhaps this is because he can't GET one?

HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!HA!

-- Buddy is also (a@pompous.ass), April 06, 2000.

"Buddy is Also", do not mistake an anthill kicker for a troll, of which YOU are. Trolls are ugly and vile little spineless creatures who hide under bridges, hence posters who spew ugly, vile attacks at someone else under a fake, unrecognizable anonymous name.

Anthill kickers are respectable posters, who debate issues and get people to think, and some people who aren't able to think get upset at them and turn into trolls. Flint is a perfect example because well, he was the first to be given this adjective. And according to him, he has never posted under a different anonymous name.

(This should answer the question someone had about what was a troll.)

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

Hawk-

Your anima cannot be experienced until she has first been projected onto the opposite sex.

Let me introduce you to your anima:

"you're a sexually frustrated bitch, don't preach your holier-than- thou morals to others".

I say Hawk wins the "Animahill Kicker Contest".

-- Debra (anima@animus.com), April 06, 2000.

Chris said...

"Well, if you see sex only interesting if porn is involved, then ofcourse you've been fooled 8-)"

I replied to a similar comment you made on the other thread. Maybe you've forgotten already, so I'll remind you...

"What do you expect from a society where every man relishes porno"

"Every" man relishes porno??? That's an awful big brush you have there! There ain't nothin like the real thing baby, and I'm not interested in paper pictures.

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 03, 2000.

Then you added...

"But perhaps someday if you're lucky, you'll understand what I mean.

I mean, REALLY lucky. woohoo!

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000."

Woohoo!??? Wow, I see what you mean. Is that what happens when you are more "sensitive" than everyone else, you yell "woohoo!"? Lol!!

I got news for you, I've been VERY lucky, in more ways than you can imagine, and it hasn't "desensitized" me in the least. You are confusing those who are less repressed and less inhibited with behavior that you consider to be "desensitized" and "degrading" to women.

First of all, let's get something straight... you're using the wrong words. "Pornography" is art and literature depicting sexual activities, primarily print magazines and films or videos. It has nothing to do with differing preferences for a wide variety of sexual behaviors and activities. Some women love giving fellatio :-), some don't. Some women like backdoor sex, some don't. Believe me, these behaviors existed LONG before pornography did. What exactly is your idea of pornography, everything except the traditional Catholic missionary position?

You seem to be trying to say that you prefer an extremely inhibited style of sex, and that's fine for you. But just because other people are a little more open and experimental does not mean they are "pornographic". Who are you to go around telling other people that their sexual preferences are vulgar or degrading? Don't knock it till you've tried it. The bottom line with any behavior is that we should have freedom to do as we wish AS LONG AS WE ARE NOT HURTING ANYONE. Are you personally being hurt by what other women choose to enjoy, or are you just jealous? In my experience, women usually ASK me to pleasure them in their favorite ways, and they sure as hell don't seem to be "degraded" by it! I can't speak for all men, but I don't think there are many of us who "force" a woman to do something she doesn't enjoy. You shouldn't be preaching like a prudishly superior bitch to other people if they aren't hurting anyone, and especially if you haven't experienced it yourself.

On a different note, you also said...

"Anthill kickers are respectable posters"

I beg to differ with you on this as well. Perhaps you haven't fully understood the analogy that Flint used when referring to this forum as an "anthill". It's more than just a colorful metaphor. He literally perceives himself as a giant on an intellectual scale, compared to the posters on this forum, who he regards as puny little stupid idiots. I hardly find that kind of attitude "respectable."

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 06, 2000.

Good point Debra. But since Hawk did not understand what projection was, I doubt he would understand the anima.

He's probably thinking you made him a compliment by calling him an animal ;-)

(Hawk, peace! I'm having fun because this is supposed to be a fun thread.)

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

Hawk, we posted at the same time. I've explained in details my um..position on porn and sex in that other thread, and if you read it all, you'll know I've answered all the questions you've posed me here. Not gonna rehash it in here. It's clear to me we'll never agree on this, so how about we agree to disagree and leave it at that. If you can say ok to that, you'll be enough of a gentleman for me to continue other discussions with you.

And as for Flint, well, you'll just have to accept my view that I do consider him a giant on an intellectual scale, relative to this forum. I know this blows your brain, but I can't help it.

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

Did any of you read the exchange between Ken and Flint over at BIFFY? (now dead :-)

Ken was being his most sanctimonious (sp?) and Flint called him on it... tried to get Ken to admit that he was just "kicking ant hills" for fun and an EGO boost, just like he (Flint) was... just so they could feel superior to all the little ants... Kinda makes you wonder if he (flint) gets a kick out of tripping blind people or danceing in the face of paraplegics...

Flint has my vote :-(

-- Netghost (ng@no.yr), April 06, 2000.

Wow, just what the world needs, another narrow-minded intolerant person. Sorry to say this Chris, but the more I learn about you the more I pity you. May you someday find more joy in life. :-)

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), April 06, 2000.

And as for Flint, well, you'll just have to accept my view that I do consider him a giant on an intellectual scale, relative to this forum. I know this blows your brain, but I can't help it.

-- Chris (!@#$@pond.com), April 06, 2000.

Yup... he has a real way with words... just like Lawyers do... Politicians do... used car salesmen do, Real estate sales persons do :-)

Would you really want to know one of "those" people?.... call them your better?

You really need to get a grip.... slime is slime, and you need to recognize it when you see it :-)

-- Netghost (ng@no.yr), April 06, 2000.

What the hell is SEX?! =)

-- cin (cinloo@aol.corn), April 06, 2000.

I must confess,

I used to be CONVINCED that Ladylogic was really a man. Not so sure anymore, hmmmm.

But I DO still think that LL and Agentleman are the same person, among others as well.

Just my $2

-- moi (isit@hotn.here), April 06, 2000.

moi, you are dumber than most that post at this forum.

-- (I saw@her.I know), April 06, 2000.

Is sex dirty? Only if it's done right, sez Woody Allen.

-- Sheeted One (fun@under.the.sheets), April 06, 2000.

Sheeted One,

Are you "between the sheets", or wearing one with cut-out eye holes?

-- David (david@tri.k), April 06, 2000.

Donna, what the hell do you need sheets for?

Girls should bare it all!

-- (Girlfirend@in.bed next to him.), April 06, 2000.

Chris,

In the spirit of lightheartedness, dont feel so bad someone else on another thread told me I was a frustrated bitch also.

All I had to do was mention I was 'into' hot tubs, hence no frustration....lol

-- consumer (shh@aol.com), April 07, 2000.

Tiny bubbles... in the what?

-- Loveing (Bubbles@good clean.fun), April 07, 2000.

Haven't kicked an anthill since I met fire ants in Texas!

-- grannyclampett (notress@pass.ing), April 07, 2000.

WINE!

Make me happy....

-- cin (cinlooo@aol.corn), April 07, 2000.