Paper and Developer - Establishing my style

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Hello All:

I'm pretty new to B&W and clearly have much to learn. According to those who claim to know, my exposures/development methods are good, negatives are close to correct density etc. Meter 18% gray in shadows if the scene is more than 5 zones and so on. I am using Delta 400 and ID-11 1:1 at 11 min. Negatives seem fine. Seems I've learned enough to at least begin to start to print.

Now it comes to printing and I'm struggling with a selection of papers/toners etc. I tend to like cold tone, Pure RICH black blacks and bright whites. Could I get some recommendations on paper and developer/toner/enhancer from those in the know? I have taken great lengths to expose to the correct density. (overexpose/underdevelop etc.)

I am also looking for an extra step to remove the blue in the blacks and "brighten the prints". I've read about Selenium toner and chromium intensifier on negatives and prints. Any "winning combinations out there you could recommend or website with relible cookbooks? I don't mind a little extra effort if the results are worth it.

My instructor says he uses Forte Polygraph VFB in Dektol 1:5 for 5 min. Bruce Barnbaum uses the same, though I think his development time and Dektol solution is different (longer). It could be the hardness of his water.

Thanks in advance, Joe Lacy Dallas

-- Joe Lacy (jmlacy@flash.net), April 02, 2000

Answers

There are probably as many favourite combinations as there are forum members. My suggestion would be to get a few small packages of different papers and try them out. You may come to the conclusion that maybe you wish to stick with cold tones, but that you need this paper for a specific negative and that one for a different negative, for all papers have their virtues, though in different sections of the characteristic curves. And even when you mainly use cold-tone paper, every now and then, you may come across a negative that looks just splendid on warm-tone paper, or split-toned (such as warm in the shadows and cold in the highlights, or vice versa). I don't think there is a way to short-cut a certain amount of experimentation.

-- Thomas Wollstein (thomas_wollstein@web.de), April 03, 2000.

This is somewhat scary. You are new to photography and already have a firm idea of what technical methods you want. Choose one normal paper and film, and go with it. You don't have portfolio prints, but you are already concerned about Bruce B's water hardness and how that might affect your experience? Wow, do people get too deep too quickly. In fact, you are way too deep in the film already, too. Leave the meter at home and go take some night pictures as an escape. E.L.

-- E.L. (elperdido65@hotmail.com), April 03, 2000.

I'm with E.L. Keep It Simple. I would say pick a variable contrast RC paper (and since you say you like cold tone I'd suggest good ole Ilford MG IV for starters) and print a few of your negatives... then print a few more. While you're in the Ilford store pick up some Multigrade developer and Hypam Fixer and away you go. I can't imagine starting your printing with a 5min developer step! That will drive you nuts! I've used Dektol (1:1 and 1:2) but can't tell any difference between them and the Ilford stuff. The Ilford's just easier to store rather than mixing up powder Dektol into stock solution. Tone the finished prints (the keepers) in Kodak Selenium Toner and enjoy. When you've got control of the finer detail od burning and dodgeing, switch to a FB paper and experiment with your developer to get the result you are trying to obtain.

-- Nigel Smith (nlandgl@eisa.net.au), April 03, 2000.

Wow! Are you by chance a professional pilot?

The reason I ask is that I once helped an airline pilot get sorted out in photography; it took him a _full year_ to come to grips with the notion that photography isn't like flying and there's no instrument rating.

Or iow, it took him a year to get around to just enjoying the process.

Pick a paper, any paper, something that's readily available locally rather than something weird that has to be brought in by camel caravan, and pick a developer, also a "standard" that's readily available.

Print a few boxes of it. Get to know it. If you like cool tones don't buy a paper labeled "warmtone." See what toners do to it.

Then, later, if you see a print that you like, give that paper a try. You'll be working from some experience, not just picking a combination because someone else uses it and trying to force it to fit _your_ work or forcing your work to fit the character of the paper.

Suggestions? Ilford MG IV FB in Ethol LPD 1:3 toned in selenium 1:4 two to three minutes. Neutral tone.

Personally I have reservations about someone who stands around developing paper for five or more minutes....

-- John Hicks (jbh@magicnet.net), April 04, 2000.


Thanks to all that responded. Yes I agree that I am in too deep for my years of experience and maybe I should just have fun. Still I want to make photograghs not just take pictures and to that end I feel a working knowledge of film/exposure/developer is essential.

My subjects tend to be contrasty either in subject matter or light and so I compress the zones. My goal would be to print what I felt when I exposed not just what the paper and developer will deliver. I suppose therein lies the magic.

I read somewhere that film exposes to 12 stops however paper only sees 5. Is this true? If so, are there any papers that see more than 5?

Thanks again to all, Joe Lacy

-- Joe Lacy (jmlacy@lash.net), April 04, 2000.



If you really want to get into this, read "Post Exposure" by Ctein. It is true that the range of tones on paper is much narrower than that of the film. That's why it is sometimes nice when the characteristic curve of a film/developer combination has a shoulder that compresses the high densities. Many of today's film/developer combinations, however, have no observable shoulder, which means their linear section stretches far beyond anything the paper can handle in a straight print. You may succeed in squeezing the high densities of the negative into the paper range by burning, and of keeping detail in the low densities by dodging, but the overall range of a given paper will remain the same, and is determined by the difference between its minimum and maximum densities. All you can do (by selecting a suitable grade, by dodging and burning) is apportion specified ranges of negative density to specified print densities. If you need more separation in the highlights, you can get that at the cost of separation in the other tones. Some of the older (aka "alternative) processes are much better at handling long-scale negatives, e.g. platinum printing, but they mostly rely on contact printing from large-format negatives.

Back again to your last post: Personally, being a physicist, I wouldn't call it magic. But you are in fact right. Still: There is no shortcut. You have to do your own testing to get to know your material. Then you will know which combination of film, developer, film processing, paper, and paper processing will best suit your intention in a specific case (for it will not always be the same). I would second the opinions expressed so far: Go out, burn some film, make prints, and learn. Start with standard material, see where it matches your needs, and get other material to fill the gaps. In due time, your style will EVOLVE.

-- Thomas Wollstein (thomas_wollstein@web.de), April 04, 2000.


While you're at it, get a copy of _Beyond the Zone System_ by Phil Davis. If you want a by-the-numbers approach, Phil's is good.

-- John Hicks (jbh@magicnet.net), April 04, 2000.

For what you want try Flexicon VC FB and Ilford Bromophen 1+3, followed by selenium toner, dilution 1+15 to 1+20. This combination produces the best cool blacks, without being blue, IMHO. Alternatively, try Flexicon with Agfa Neutol Plus 1+9 dilution. It is not as cool as the combination with Bromophen but it is great too.

-- Jiri Dvorak (jiri_dvorak@idx.com), April 06, 2000.

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