Who are the angels and where did they come from? Did God create them? Or were they already there, as God was, from the beginning of eternity? If God made them and they are heavenly beings, then why would they turn against Him? I know...free will. But doesn't the Bible promise us that Heaven will be a happy, joyous place? No tears, no pain, no anger...I can see free will in man. We're human and prone to vanity, etc. But angels aren't human. I know they aren't perfect but still...Did God give everyone free will before or after the fall? Why would angels need free will anyways? If they are in a happy, joyous place, then what's the point?

-- jackiea (jackiea@hotmail.com), March 16, 2000

Answers

Hi, jackiea.

God existed -- alone -- from all eternity.
"In the beginning" [not His beginning, since He had none], God created non-living, material/visible, finite things (e.g., rocks, water).
He also created living, material/visible, finite things (e.g., plants [mainly immobile], animals [mobile]).
He also created living, material/visible, infinite persons (men and women).
He also created living, immaterial/invisible, infinite persons (angels), who are pure-spirit servants of God. [The word "angel" comes from the Greek "aggelos," meaning "one sent" or "messenger."]
Ecumenical Councils of the Church, countering heresies, have declared that angels did not exist from all eternity, but were created by God before God created man. Colossians 1 tells us: "15: He [Jesus] is the image of the invisible God, the first-born of all creation; 16: for in him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible ... all things were created through him and for him."

To show forth His love, God gave men and angels memory, understanding, and free will (the ability to choose to do good or evil), when He created them. If he had not given us these gifts, especially free will, we would have been like the lower forms of creatures -- or we might seem even worse, as though we were slaves or puppets.

Our Catechism says: "(1704) The human person participates in the light and power of the divine Spirit. By his reason, he is capable of understanding the order of things established by the Creator. By free will, he is capable of directing himself toward his true good. He finds his perfection in seeking and loving what is true and good."

The same could be said of the angels before they were put to a test. Those who chose evil failed and are eternally damned. Those who chose good were perfected and remain eternally with God in heaven, never to be tested again. God has not revealed to us the nature of the angels' test. Some theologians have speculated that it was their being made aware that the Son of God, whom they were adoring, would one day take on human nature. Under this "theory," those prideful angels who could not bear the thought of paying homage to a man (a lower form of creation) rebelled and refused to serve God any more.

God bless you.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jgecik@desc.dla.mil), March 16, 2000.

Hello, John. Well, I must say, it makes much better sense now. Thank you for answering me. God Bless.

-- jackiea (jackiea@hotmail.com), March 16, 2000.

J.F.,

Thanks for all the posts BTW, I appreciate the effort you put into this forum.

Frank

-- Someone (ChimingIn@twocents.cam), March 17, 2000.

I am deeply grateful for your words, Frank. I do try very hard to be informative and correct. Sometimes I fail, especially in keeping my temper. Please pray for me to improve in that area. I love God and Jesus's Church so much that I can get quite perturbed (sometimes too perturbed) when I see a message that appears to be an unjustified attack. It is hard for me to stick to facts without letting personalities, reprimands, criticisms, etc., creep into my words.
God bless you. John

-- J. F. Gecik (jgecik@desc.dla.mil), March 17, 2000.

Dear John, jackie,
Seems like all I like to do is ''deplore'' the state of things in our modern world, even some of the very trends in Christian life. Not so, many of them can't be helped; and some of the worst are actually fulfillments of Christ's prophesies, i.e., ''wolves in sheep's clothing,'' or, ''In those days, the spirit of iniquity will abound,'' and others.

Among the sad things we see today, even among some believers, is a tendency to trivialize ANGELS. Many just act as if these were like Santa's elves, cute pictures for the tots. They are always depicted either as cherubim, lovely babies with wings, or darling ''Barbie'' look-alikes. How many even bother to pray to a guardian angel?

I don't know if this is insulting to the angels' dignity. I suppose they're not prone to these vanities. But, to think of the awesome and unbearable sight of these angel spirits on the LAST DAY-- when they are to be marshalled to the ''4 corners of the world'' , in pursuit of all the living and the dead, a heavenly host that shall allow not one soul to escape the final Judgment! It's too wonderful to really imagine.

This society loves the very thought of extra-terrestrials and aliens from other planets. They can identify with all the specious arguments about ''life'' on other worlds. But if you say someone saw an ''Angel'' (I know such people), they take you for a naive and credulous rube. The only angel they believed in was good old Michael Landon, and we all know he was acting! Angels! Ha ha! (BTW, Landon was a fine, decent man. May God love and keep him for all eternity.)

-- Eugene Chavez (rechavez@popmail.ucsd.edu), April 28, 2000.

Here is a disconcerting (at least for me) text:

"Know ye not that we shall judge angels? How much more things that pertain to this life?" ICor, 6,3

Enrique

-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), April 29, 2000.

Thank you, Enrique, for mentioning a verse that I had somehow always overlooked ===> 1 Corinthians 6:3 -- Do you not know that we are to judge angels?

You inspired me to look at what the Catechism says about the final judgment and to read all the New Testament verses (almost 200!) that refer to judging.

I'm sure that most of us think of judgment as something that will be done by Christ the King, accompanied by the angels. This is correct, according to the CCC (#1038-1041), which quotes St. Matthew 25: "Then Christ will come 'in his glory, and all the angels with him .... Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate them one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, and he will place the sheep at his right hand, but the goats at the left.... And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.'"

Even St. Paul himself, who wrote of men's judgment of angels, wrote elsewhere to the same Corinthians:
2 Corinthians 5:10 -- For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive good or evil, according to what he has done in the body.
This agrees with Jesus's own words, recorded by St. John:
John 5:22
The Father judges no one, but has given all judgment to the Son ...

So, what about our judging angels? We know that God has already judged them in a "particular" way, just as he judges us immediately after our deaths:
2 Peter 2:4 -- ... God did not spare the angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of nether gloom to be kept until the judgment ..."

But what St. Paul told the Corinthians about men judging others is confirmed by two verses:
Matthew 19:28 -- Jesus said to them, "Truly, I say to you, in the new world, when the Son of man shall sit on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel..."
Revelation 20:4 -- I [John] saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge ...

I don't feel capable of sorting all this out and predicting exactly what will happen, but perhaps it will be something like this:
1. Every irrevocable "particular judgment" has been, and will be, performed by Jesus Himself. The souls of all the just men and women who die are granted an abode in heaven with God and the good angels. 2. When the just people appear before Jesus with their glorified bodies at the end of the world, He will confirm His judgment and grant them thrones of their own.
3. As the "Mystical Body of Christ," the just will then "participate" in Christ's final judgment of all the angels and the rest of mankind.

May the mercy of God be shown to us. As I sit here, I am watching the Canonization Mass of St. (Sister) Maria Faustina of the Blessed Sacrament (Kowalska) -- the "Apostle of Divine Mercy." Jezu, ufam Tobie.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jgecik@desc.dla.mil), April 30, 2000.

Bump

-- - (.@.....), December 04, 2002.

Seems I just wonder about angels all over the place, eh? ;)

-- Jackiea (sorry@dontlikespam.com), December 04, 2002.

Thats, because you are a pretty Angel.

-- - (.@.....), December 05, 2002.

Awwwwww how sweet. Thanks for putting a smile on my face today. :)

God bless~

-- Jackiea (sorry@dontlikespam.com), December 05, 2002.

Your welcome, Pretty Angel. I have said a few prayers for you before I typed this post, and I will say some prayers for your three children before I retire to bed tonight. God bless you, and I will pray that you are treated well this Christmas. You deserve to be spoiled rotten this Christmas. I know you had a tough year, and you had the courage to hang in there. You must have a great guardian Angel.

-- - (.@.......), December 05, 2002.

Hello Jackiea!!

How are you?

Angels, oh, Jackiea how I believe in angels. I have the most miraculous angel stories to share with you...beautiful, true stories about angels.

I will post my angel poem here one day for you. Yes, Jackiea, angels are everywhere and come in all shapes and sizes. You will know, Jackiea when you have met one of God's angels because your heart will be lighter when you are in their presence....you will know when you have been touched by an angel - you will know.

Hope all is going well for you and you have a blessed, blessed, happy Christmas because you deserve to.

Love, MaryLu

-- MaryLu (mlc327@juno.com), December 05, 2002.

Jackiea,

Angels come along just when you need one (or two) :)

Angels encourage you, lift your spirits, direct you, save you from going down the wrong path, guide you, help you, listen to you, take you out of the darkness and into the light, speak softly, push you forward, hold you back, are messengers from God...think about your past year, Jackiea, reflect upon all the people who came into your life and have had the most profound affect on your life, a positive affect - yes, angels do come to us in human form, Jackiea, they most certainly do.

Think of the times when you have felt a divine glow, a divine sense of peace after an encounter with a special person - you have been touched by an angel. I could go on and on and on about angels - one of my favorite topics.

May you always have an angel at your side :)

MaryLu

-- MaryLu (mlc327@juno.com), December 05, 2002.

Well, I would definitely say that yes, there are most assuredly angels amongst us. Judging from the tears running down my face reading those responses, I'd say we're amongst two right now. :)

Thank you....from the bottom of my heart...I can't say how touched I am and how very loved I feel right now.

God loves you both. Be well and take care~

-- Jackiea (sorry@dontlikespam.com), December 05, 2002.