Food

greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread

Not to flame, but if the Faith is there, why be concerned about a human stamped expiration date on canned food? How much do you know about the food perservation of your Ancestors? They canned, salted stuff, and placed no expiration date. If they had all died off from food poison, then you wouldn't be here, would you? Most of it is another Market ploy, to send your hard earned money, to their bank. Guess walking on the water is out of the question too. No snake handler here.

-- Faith and (expir@tiondate.com), February 25, 2000

Answers

Ah, but if only 75% percent (or 99%) of them died because of a lack of an expiration date, we'd all still be here anyway, wouldn't we? But, actually, much of the issue with expiration dates deals with taste and nutrition. For the most part, if it's canned correctly it should last a very very long time. It just might not taste too good.

-- E. H. Porter (E.H. Porter@just wondering.about it), February 25, 2000.

Yep, same with apirin, acetaminophen, etc. It is good for years past exp. date. Found this out when working as a QA at an OTC drug manufacturing plant. It has been a long while so I might be wrong, but I think it has something to do with stability tests required by the FDA. And you can only claim effectiveness as far as you can prove it. But, I am sure the companies love it that way. Throw that old product out and buy new.

-- canthappen (n@ysayer.com), February 25, 2000.

Dear E.H., the font you wrote appeared to me the same stance the canning industry put on their web site. Have you had the opportunity to read the ole timers recounts in the Fox Fire series of books? Life was primitive, yet they lived. to an old age. If you have an interest , please click on the LUSENET at the top, and be introduced to "Countryside" and others of a totally different realm. They live beyond our conceived notions of the "Food Horrors", and yet they live, and laugh too. Manna from Heaven

-- Faith and (expir@tiondate.com), February 25, 2000.

Faith -- I must admit that I have no idea what you are trying to say to me. Is English your native language?

-- E. H. Porter (E.H. Porter@just wondering.about it), February 25, 2000.

Very true Mr. Porter... this last week I found a package of vanilla pudding mix...long past the expiration date, and cooked it up. The color of the pudding was rather brownish, it tasted OK. I tried some with no adverse effects. It was simply not very attractive. Ditto on a package of Noodle Ronni....very unappealing in color and texture , but no adverse effects when consumed.. (Yes, it was a test) I would not serve this stuff to my family....UNLESS it were the only option. I can only assume that the nutrition factor (the lack of) is a valid point.

-- I Realy Do HATE spam (Lurking@theEdge.Com), February 25, 2000.


Some medications lose potency after a period of time. Light and humidity affects compressed pills for example, like Tylenol etc., but won't make you sick. Some other medications like insulin and antibiotics are critical to keep fresh (if your insulin turned cloudy or discolored, throw it out.) The best thing with medications is to follow the old saying "when in doubt throw it out."

I don't follow expiration dates by the book on everything; canned goods last for years, and I use my judgement on dry packaged foods (like someone said above, usually its mostly estetic but won't poison you.)

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), February 25, 2000.


Our ancesters preserved fruits and vegies to last to the next harvest. They did not plan to save it for many years. Just the act of canning kills maybe 30% of the vitamins, and gradually the enzymes and vitamins do break down...after 6 months the loss is significant I read,and after two years you may as well forget vitamins.

Joseph stored grain for 7 years, that's another story. And the #10 cans of survival foods ( freeze dried) supposedly retain 95% of their nutritional value during processing and last much longer.

My advice is get the cans for flavor and appetite value, and get plenty of vitamin pills and rotate them...in an emergency with food shortages you'd be better off than most folks. Also get a guide to wild foods...you can at least eat wild greens every day for superb nutritional supplement.

When I called 800 numbers pre Y2k to read codes, they said as long as the can does not swell up or rust it is probably edible. And in a famine, calories with little nutritional value are better than starvation.

What does this have to do with faith anyway? If the cans were dangerous, it would be presumptuous to eat them. Don't put the Lord your God to the test, said Jesus to Satan on the pinnacle of the Temple.

-- carolyn (carolyn@luvmy.hub), February 25, 2000.


Carolyn, this is not about calling on the Lord for his faith, but upon calling upon me, for mine. I do not question his, I quiver in mine, and know his faith is just. Mine is off-target. And I know the Kings of where-ever can dine upon a table of feast tonight, and bodily die, before the morn. A drunkard and a prostitute can do same. But who believes? I kinda don't think it matters which matra you believe. As long as you believe, in a Higher. My take.

-- Faith and (expir@tiondate.com), February 25, 2000.

Not to flame, but if the Faith is there, why be concerned about a human stamped expiration date on canned food?

Two reasons:

1) - Under average storage conditions by the time that date has passed you will begin to notice deleterious changes to the color, texture and taste of that particular food. If the food isn't attractive how likely are you to want to eat it?

2) - By the time those aesthetic changes mentiond in #1 above take place the more sensitive vitamins and some other nutrients will have taken a serious fade. Nutrition is, after all, the major reason we eat food in the first place.

How much do you know about the food perservation of your Ancestors?

I wouldn't count myself as an "expert" on the subject but I do know a pretty fair amount about the way my ancestors and many other people's ancestors preserved their food.

They canned, salted stuff, and placed no expiration date. If they had all died off from food poison, then you wouldn't be here, would you? Most of it is another Market ploy, to send your hard earned money, to their bank.

Well, if you bought that food, it's yours. You can keep it for as long as you like. For myself, I prefer food to look like a reasonable approximation of that food when it's fresh. The same for the taste, the same for the texture and most assuredly for the nutrition it contains especially so in the case of my six month old daughter, and her mother while she was carrying her.

Our ancestors preserved their food with the knowledge and technology they had at hand to preserve it with. Sometimes what they had was good enough and they lived pretty well. Other times it came up short and they had to make do with what they had. Weevily flour is better than not eating at all. We have a great deal more knowledge of how to preserve food now than even my grandparents had and can do a better job of it. My grandparents did not grow up with freezers nor refrigerators (not even an icebox, ice cost cash money) and made do with what they had. If you tried to convince my grandmother to give up her freezer now she'd probably brain you with an iron skillet.

We don't know how many of our ancestors died from causes related to their food preservation. Certainly the incidence of stomach cancer is less than what it was a century ago and it seems very likely because we don't eat as much smoked meat as once we did. The incidence of botulism in the U.S. has taken a serious decline compared to what it once was. The same for waterborne disease. How many people had their lives shortened because of malnutrition resulting from unbalanced diets because they had no way to storing foods with adequate vitamin C through a long, hard winter? How many went short on protein for long periods of time because of what they had to eat? Pellagra killed tens of thousands here in the South as late as the 1920's all for the lack of niacin in the diet.

For what it's worth, there's a great deal of food on the market with no expiration date at all. The reason for this is that there is relatively little in the way of federal or state regulations requiring any expiration dating. When you do find an expiration date on a package it is nearly always predicated on the length of time that food will keep before it begins to show negative effects to its color, taste or texture. It's in the manufacturers interest to put those dates there to make it harder for the grocer to sell old food. If you open up a four year old can of Green Giant green peas and they're faded, mushy and taste nasty who is likely to get the blame - the manufacturer or the grocer? Old food is bad for business. Old food is also bad for food storage and bad for you personally.

Guess walking on the water is out of the question too.

If you'd care to demonstrate your technique?

No snake handler here.

I've handled many a snake, probably don't need any demonstrations of that.

..........Alan.

The Prudent Food Storage FAQ, v3.5

http://www.providenceco-op.com

-- A.T. Hagan (athagan@netscape.net), February 25, 2000.


A.T., I am LOL at your post. Thank you for Git up and Gumption, I think. At least you had vigor. Go there fellow/Mam.

-- Faith and (expir@tion.com), February 25, 2000.


By the way, A.T., I am curious as to which Big Company pays your salary, for sneaking the net, to debunk. You and your kind are hired hands, to lurk and spew lies/distort and to debunk any true findings we seek. I can betcha I am older than you, longer in tooth, and less to lose. Your call.

-- Faith and (expir@tiondate.com), February 25, 2000.

Geez, Faith- Did you even look at the link A.T. provided? Seemed like he/she was trying to be helpful.

-- Gia (laureltree7@hotmail.com), February 26, 2000.

Faith , carolyn , others .... Just finished 14 year old fruit cocktail yesterday . Not a great difference in taste . Vitamin content ? Who cares ... it was not the only food consumed . Ate 13 year old spinich, beets and beans last fall . NO problems , except, obviously , I have so much stored that I never used , I'll have to begin an " eat down " program of the ' outdated food ' . Basicly , cans that don't bulge , or are rusted thru are O.K. ; desen't apply to acid foods like tomatoes , pinapple , etc.

Still think we will need that food by the end of this year . Eagle

-- Hal Walker (e999eagle@FREEWWWEB.COM), February 26, 2000.


Moderation questions? read the FAQ