As far as I can tell diesel prices have been quite stable lately, even dropping, at least in France and England. I have been watching prices for several weeks and there is absolutely no movement up.

Of which I would infer that diesel prices in the US Northeast are going up for ***ANOTHER CAUSE THAN Y2K***. Price gouging, winter storms, etc. Suggestions?

-- European Diesel Price Observer (wondering@why.itisso), February 09, 2000

Answers

"suggestions"

Maybe a rethink of the sureness of your position given the refinery capacity *is* the issue with distillates. The fact that Europe is not so affected and the US is, may support the conclusion opposite of yours. More facts needed for either POV.

-- Jackson Brown (Jackson_Brown@deja.com), February 09, 2000.

Jackson is correct. It seems far more likely that the cause is Y2K related.

-- (hal@gostek.org), February 09, 2000.

I think you guys should get over it by now. The end of the world is not going to come from an oil crisis triggered by Y2K. Currently, there is no oil crisis whatsoever in the world except in a minuscule, but apparently very vocal region, namely the US Northeast.

All resources will be available to fix any pb that will show up at any number of refineries. The end of the world, it is not and will not be.

Note: I used to be a full-blown doomer, but life has resumed as normal. Provisions get eaten. Money goes back to bank. Gold goes back to bank safe. Gun is hidden somewhere in the house and will probably never be used, etc, etc. Trace inverter for sale anyone?

-- European Diesel Price Observer (wondering@why.itisso), February 09, 2000.

Great, a European troll? I specifically remember reading here a week or so ago that there were trucker strikes in countries outside the U.S. because of exorbitant diesel prices. And other articles about fuel shortages in Europe and Asia and Africa. Lots of reasons, but the shortage of output by the refineries here in the U.S. certainly suggests that y2k may be a factor, although there are clearly a number of causes involved. And I don't think any of us have cried "price gouging" - that's been the mantra of the cornered politicians and dealers instead. Perhaps Europe entered the winter with greater inventories than we did, that alone would have made a huge difference.

-- Brooks (brooksbie@hotmail.com), February 09, 2000.

Man, you guys are dense. The strikes had nothing to do with oil prices and everyting to do with the 35 hr work week.

2 weeks ago: 1 liter of diesel = 5.45FRF last week-end: 1 liter = 5.15FRF

Even I cannot say to my wife: see, I was right, look at how oil prices are moving up, there is a catastroph coming, let's stay underground in our bunker. No, no... Prices are actually coming down! This is very funny: my wife was right about y2k! And she is completely computer-illiterate, while I have been in the profession for 20 years.

Btw, remember there is far less space in Europe to store huge quantities of oil. So I doubt very seriously there were huge inventories waiting to get sucked in in January.

GET OVER IT! In most of the world, oil is flowing normally, gets refined properly and gets delivered on time. No crisis whatsoever. By the way, if there were really, really a y2k-induced oil crisis, it is starting to be late to manifest itself, don't you think?

-- European Diesel Price Observer (wondering@why.itisso), February 09, 2000.

You learned your arrogant spin well, EDPO. On the other hand, there are dozens and dozens of articles posted to this forum documenting that there are indeed fuel crises in many parts of the winter world. Only "most of the world" running ok you say? I guess that leaves only about 3 billion to worry about. Glad you're toasty, must mean there was sufficient inventory of whatever you need. Not true where I live. And to the extent there would be y2k-related oil industry problems, we're actually right on schedule.

-- Brooks (brooksbie@hotmail.com), February 09, 2000.

Seems to be a new subspecies roaming the internet -- Doomertrolls, who speak with the voice of REASON to us hypnotized Y2K addicts. Nevertheless, price gouging and market manipulation has already been suggested by some of the insider regulars (former regulars, now over at the downstreamer forum, I think) and it it might be more surpising if there were NO manipulation under these circumstances, than that strings were being pulled.

THAT SAID, however, the nubmer of refinery fires, pipeline ruptures, discontinuities of supplies, etc. reported on standard wire or industry services, have got to have a natural consequence. Refineries down to %85 percent capacity: that's the first consequence. Oil imports down 26% this January over last years levels: that's another. The product is not being created.

Add to that the diversion of diesel stocks to cover for shortages of heating oil (distributors dying theri inventories of road diesel red for use as home heating oil) and pretty soon you have a restriction on the volume of diesel and price rises.

Perhaps the situation is not comparable in Europe. Do they heat with heating oil or peat, where our Observer resides? Here in the west coast, diesel prices have only started to climb in the last week, and the remain almost in a familiar range of fluctuation: about $1.49/gal. now. Oil/gas stories are just beginning to make the local papers. Europe may be at the peripheryof this event for now, just as we seem to be in Oregon: outside looking in.

>"<

I understand one reason diesel is going through the roof -- only in the northeast -- is a shortage of heating oil

-- Squirrel Hunter (nuts@upina.cellrelaytower), February 09, 2000.

The Culprits of these manufactured Problems in the current Oil situation(Supply,Prices etc.)are the same Caliber of People that are standing knee deep in Trash on Wall Street.

-- Hosed down again (giveme@break.scum), February 09, 2000.