OT, Toledo police have proposed a $50,000 handgun buyback program ; Handgun owners confused by law of which guns are illegal

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http://www.toledoblade.com/editorial/news/0b07guns.htm

Handgun owners confused by law

February 7, 2000

BY VANESSA GEZARI BLADE STAFF WRITER

The lists of outlawed handguns were introduced last month. Then the calls started coming in.

Is my gun legal? How do I prove I've owned my weapon for years?

The Toledo police department has received hundreds of phone calls from the city's registered gun owners who have been trying to figure out whether their weapons are illegal under a handgun ban that took effect last week - and what to do if they are.

"It's very difficult for them to decipher what's what from the ordinance," said Officer Roger White, the Toledo police weapon expert who helped members of Mayor Carty Finkbeiner's administration draft the law.

"It's very confusing. What can I tell you? I don't think [the law] was very well-made."

The law, which bans the possession and sale of some small, easily concealed handguns, met with similar criticism when city council considered it in the fall.

It was introduced by Mr. Finkbeiner, an ardent gun-control advocate, and provoked extensive lobbying from pro- and anti-gun camps. Council approved it by a narrow margin.

About Jan. 10, the police department mailed copies of the law and lists of legal and illegal guns to more than 6,000 registered handgun owners.

Included in the mailings were blank documents known as handgun acknowledgement forms - and those forms have been a source of confusion, Officer White said.

The law contains a grandfather clause that protects people who owned their guns before the ban took effect. To prove prior ownership, residents had to list their guns on a handgun acknowledgement form - before Feb. 1. Then they had to get the form notarized.

Gun owners are supposed to keep the forms in case they are charged with owning a banned gun. They could then use the documents to defend themselves in court.

"The biggest question they have is, 'What do we do with these forms?' " Officer White said. He said many gun owners thought they were supposed to mail their forms to the city.

"For something that took so long to hash out, it's been handled poorly," said Councilman Rob Ludeman, a Republican who voted against the law. "I'm concerned that there are a lot of inadequacies, both with the law and the way this [notification] happened."

Mr. Ludeman last week asked the Finkbeiner administration whether it would consider extending the effective date of the law to give gun owners more time to make a record of their weapons.

John Madigan, the city's general counsel, said he cannot change the effective date. But he said council could do so.

"We gave people four months before the law went into effect," Mr. Madigan said. "We don't send out notices on many, many laws that get changed. People are responsible for knowing the law, whether or not they receive a personal copy of it."

Officer White said the gun owners who are calling the city are law-abiding citizens - and they are trying to stay that way.

"It is the kind of situation that can put what is your good citizen, who had a firearm around the house for 40 years for protection, in violation of the law," he said.

"The worst-case scenario is that they get so scared, they throw it in the creek and someone finds it, [or] they throw it in the garbage."

Toledo police have proposed a $50,000 handgun buyback program that would allow gun owners to sell their weapons to the city for $50, with a limit of two handguns per person. Council last week referred the measure to its public safety committee.

-- Hokie (Hokie_@hotmail.com), February 08, 2000

Answers

Someone please enlighten me, how can Toledo, or any other city (NYC,D.C.), ban handguns? Isn't this blatantly unconstitutional?

-- J (Y2J@home.comm), February 08, 2000.

Try "World's Smallest Self-Defense Quiz"

http://www.keepandbeararms.org/self_defense_quiz.htm

Then see what you 'think'...

-- steve (WhoCares@nymore.Right?com), February 08, 2000.


I believe I'd move to Indiana where we have some common sense and then write "Go #@$% yourself!" on the form and drop it in the mail back to the morons in charge. Just MHO of course.

-- DAG (tallon@therange.com), February 08, 2000.

2nd Amendment: "The People's right to keep and bear arms...shall not be infringed."

The Constitution 'means...what it says'.

The 2nd Amendment was "the Teeth which protect your Freedom..from enchroaching Tyrants and hordes of government clerks."

Sound familiar?

The 2nd Ammendment is what *protects* your Bill Of Rights; Without it, all the other Ammendments and Rights...have no meaning."

Check your "Supremacy Clause" (legal principle)

"No one is exercising their Rights anymore..." (Mitch Modoleski)

They are acting beyond their delegation of authority. They are violating their Oath of Office. Nail them on that. (read their Oath to them...and DEMAND they abide by it...or have them removed from office.

Here is your 'legal basis' to counter their 'arguments' and enforce *your rights*:

http://www.bashar.com/GSP/sovereign.htm

This is America...remember?

We have a Constitution...remember?

The Constitution is The Supreme Law of the Land...remember?

No man is above The Law...remember?

This is a CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC...NOT 'a democracy' (mob- ocracy)...remember?

-- steve (WhoCares@nymore.Right?com), February 08, 2000.


Steve, well said.

-- Hokie (Hokie_@hotmail.com), February 08, 2000.


The amendment number escapes me, but it is also unconstitutional for the government to confiscate anything without paying market value for it. Supposedly they have always made good on land purchases, but not so with the "assault rifles" they are confiscating in California.

Little by little, we are losing this war!

-- Longshot (longshot911@email.com), February 08, 2000.


Thanks Hokie....I enjoy your posts *immensely* - of course, along with all the other very intelligent and caring people on TB2000.

The Trolls, drooling (literally) over everything in sight - because they are not capable of an original thought? Someone who dares to share their perspective with sincerity - really scares them. They are still trying to figure out "what that is". The only satisfaction is in knowing that "Wherever Trolls go...that's where they find themself." And that's punishment enough.

Some trap...huh?

Thanks for *your* intelligent reflection on so many issues Hokie.

Much respect,

-- steve (WhoCares@nymore.Right?com), February 10, 2000.


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