Hi, gang.

Since almost everyone here agrees that the initial phase of Y2K preparations has resulted in a surplus of provisions, I've wondered if anyone of you in cyberspace has graduated to the Second Degree, that is, the next step in preparations in the Year 2000.

This message does not apply to zog and other survivalists; they have already done what they need to do. They are *ready for the worst case scenario*. Their wisdom is beyond the ken of pollies.

I am not a total nutcase extremist, but I do know that certain individuals have quit their occupations and have relocated into rural places with their guns and dogs and stored foods. I myself have not done this. I'm still residing where I was last year, and I didn't quit my job.

However, sensing that the most horrendous Y2K scenarios are not occurring, I'm quite relieved and have been much more relaxed. Maybe TOO relaxed. I've read and heard of those who are giving away provisions which they garnered last year. Why would anyone so freely give from their hard earned stockpiles? Is the worst truly over?

NO! The worst judgments ever to hammer America will occur beginning this year! There will be very bad surprises beyond the control of humans, and many will panic. Those who doubt this should quit reading this post. It won't matter a whit to you, but those who perceive the coming dangers should be willing to consider retaining their provisions. What's the worst that can happen to you? Ridicule? Hah! Ignore the mocking idiots. They will be confused when the heinous events transpire. The best you can do is pray to God for understanding. And God will answer your prayers.

Presently, I am entering Phase Two of preparations. I had accumulated bags of rice and other grains for family members, friends and neighbors who might need them for nourishment if the JIT distribution system failed immediately after the rollover; but it did not. What to do? What to do?

Because the Great Nothing has not yet destroyed America's prosperity, I ordered some food storage buckets. When I receive them, I'll store the grains with oxygen absorbers. These grains will keep well for at least three years in the new location in which I've been allowed to store them.

Have any of you entered this Second Phase of preparation? If so, what have you learned from the Great Y2K Fallout?

-- dinosaur (dinosaur@williams-net.com), January 08, 2000

Answers

Yeah I have, been eatin like a PIG!!!

-- Porky (Porky@in.cellblockD), January 08, 2000.

For the first time, some body who is speaking with a bit of intelligence. There has been so much gloom and gloating that it is sickening. You are right we have not felt the main earthquake as of yet. I am afraid everything is absolutely too smooth. Even I was almost convinced to break preps and give up till wife person spoke some wisdom. As I was draining all my tubs I had set up and down ready to catch the rain. As I started to bring in the supplies to be used. She calmly stated: If we use all this and all hell breaks loose, what will we do then? Then she said with conviction, you are giving up too soon. And this from a person who never gave me much encouragement as I was building up the supplies. Her line of thinking sure came as a surprise. From the forum here it is common, but from like her it is a very surprising shock. She never has been interested in the computer, its workings or what is gleaned from it. She does not read any of the news that pertains to world conditions. Nor does sht ever pay any attention to Tv coverage. Put me back on my heels. This person is the religious pillor of the family. What she stated was not from a spiritual perspective that I know of. However it sure made me stop and give it more thought before tearing it all down. Very seldom she ever says any thing pertainint to world conditions, but when she does it usually is pretty profound.

-- Notforlong (Fsur439@aol.com), January 08, 2000.

Dinosaur,

I guess we did the survivalist thing already. We are holding on to the provisions we have, waiting for the other shoe to drop.

We live in a subdivision of 250+ families in a highly urban area (near Gary, Indiana, by the way -- once the murder capital of the world!).

We tried to prepare for different "levels". First, of course, our five children and ourselves. Second level, my husband's five geriatric relatives near us (ages 70 to 95). Third level, my DGI sister and her family and my DGI brother and his family. Fourth level, our neighbors.

If we only have to provide for level one, we have a year's worth probably. Level two, maybe six months. Level three, maybe a month. Level four, maybe two days.

When our priest or other close friends would ask us about y2k, we would say, "we are ready for anything except a breakdown in the rule of law. In that case, we will wish we had moved." So far, we are VERY, VERY happy with the way things have turned out. If things get bad economically, but the rule of law still holds, we will be A-okay no matter what (Lord willing).

My husband owns a consumer electronics business, high on the list of targets for looters. If all hell were to break loose, we would lose all of our hard-earned capital invested in inventory. The outcome we have seen (so far) makes me float with happiness.

Regards,

Just a dumb, naive housewife,

-- J Wheel (motherof5@wellprepared.noregrets), January 08, 2000.

Hey, Porky, don't get too pudgy, dude. Walk around the latrines and guard posts in order to work off excess blubber. Ya never know when that window of escape will open. Be prepared. And take along some munchies and your favorite blankie just in case no one's lookin'...

I'll meet ya on the other side...

-- dinosaur (dinosaur@williams-net.com), January 08, 2000.

Dinosaur,

My wife and I are indeed entering into "Phase II" of preparation. In "Phase I," we had prepared for food shortages, a long series of rolling brownouts, unavailable/unreliable city water supply, and extremely expensive/scarce fuel for cooking, home heating(not too much of a problem here, as we are in Austin, Texas. Getting cool is more the problem), and refrigeration(gas/propane refrigerator for mostly medicines, some leftovers when we made too much for the family. Figured leftovers would be very rare, what with unprepared neighbors).

We planned to make a go of it here in our downtown home, and arranged things so as to be able to do so without attracting undo attention. All of our supplies are neatly stowed throughout our home; nothing is obtrusive, and nothing raises eyebrows whenever anyone comes into our home or onto our property.

Okay. We planned for about 8-12 months of fairly bad but not totally crippling interruptions(taking modern Moscow, Russia as an example). We figured that after about 8 months, if things were still fairly screwed up, our pitiful amount of preparations(considered extreme by most of our friends; they don't seem to think that having extra food, a small[550 gallons; good for about 50 days for four adults and the pets. We figured during that time we would pray and dance around for rain]backup water supply, and extra meds is worth the time ant trouble in our wonderful JIT society)would be used up, and then it would be time to punt. What to do?

Phase II - plan for long term(IMHO, 10 years to life).

In response to an earlier post("How many are in the poor house?" - http://hv.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=002Ce6 lotsa great responses to this one) I wrote:

"Plant a garden(I personally made out like a bandit in this category; hooked up with a guy that had grabbed an organic, non-hybridized seed bank from a business that went under. I bought seed packets for over two hundred types of plants that will grow in my area for $5.00!! Call me Farmer Don! Even better, my next door neighbor has a huge organic garden, and will GIVE me all the compost I will ever need. Woo Hoo!)."

I scored this seed bank on December 30, 1999(I know, I waited a little late. Then again, I was very, very lucky). For long term, I will indeed plant a garden from my seed stash here in downtown Austin, as I have and have access to all sorts of wonderful gardening tools here, as well as water. I also scored a great book about the edible and medicinal native/wild plants in Texas; bedside reading since early November(it is a big one). I will also add to my preps some of the things that I didn't get(mostly more medical stuff, along with more medical manuals; I am very fortunate, in that I can drive down to Mexico and score lotsa antibiotics and other medications for dirt cheap), especially since sales are popping up now that the "problem" is "over."

And finally, the big one. Look for land.

I didn't do this during the last two years; we couldn't afford it, and my wife has many health issues that for her would make life off the grid and away from a technological society difficult. I figure the over-valued property around here is about due for a "correction," and I could score some rural dirt pretty cheap. I'll take the bulk of my preps (and several truckloads of my neighbor's killer compost)out there, secure them, plant a Monster Truck garden, set up my cistern system(this part of Texas gets enough rainfall to do this; I'd much rather go out to West Texas, but water is a major concern there). and wait and see what happens. With the added medical stuff I think I'll be better situated to take care of my wife, and maybe getting out of a dirty, stressful city will do her some good as well.

As I have written earlier, I don't drive, but my wife still does(long story; she was the one that thought we needed to live in the inner city so we wouldn't commute. She now drives further to her job than I have ever commuted!). I've got a portable stash o' gas that I rotate out; it would certainly get us outta the city to our new home, should we need to "bug out."

If TS does not HTF, I'll have a very cool "fish camp" to vacation in, and a nice place for me and the wife to retire. We're both in our early thirties, so if things continue to be rosy I'll have plenty of time to make improvements to this place, and enter into "Phase III." "Phase III" means things didn't go belly up so we've been able to afford to add PV, wind, built a straw bale/underground home, BIG cistern system/water barn, 3-8 years of food stored if crops don't come up during really dry spells, and add a whole mess of kids into the picture. We don't have any; we believe in recycling(I was a recycled child). I'd like to adopt a bunch and help them to learn a more sustainable lifestyle; I think this is gonna be the best prep work we can do to help save this planet.

That gets us into "Phase IV."

Rebuilding our society. Showing our children how to rebuild, in the least destructive, most mutually beneficial for all life manner that we possibly can. We all have to prepare for Phase IV RIGHT NOW.

Thanks for the post; 'twas a good one, Dinosaur.

Peace to All,

Don

-- Shimoda (enlighten@me.com), January 08, 2000.

OK, so just waht is this other shoe thatis to frop? What is the coming TEOTWAWKI event lurking ahead this year? Are saying it is Y2K computer systems or is there some other great disaster ahead?

I beleive in being prepared for a few days of bad weather, etc. Just makes sense. But are you still saying that Y2K is gonna brig us down?

-- DAVID (tdavidc@arn.net), January 08, 2000.

David: From my continuing research, here are the potential problems for year 2000: 1. Depression/recession fall-out from Y2k 2. Internal war/conflict resulting from planned implementation of one world government (just ask Kofi Annan or B.C.). This may require collapse of our economy. 3. Solar flares peaking in June, 2000 - could affect grid/all electronics.

-- Y2kObserver (Y2kObserver@nowhere.com), January 08, 2000.

I'm hoping to getting some deals on solar panels as my preps continue. Thats my next premium payment for my y2k "policy." Not mandatory by law but still necessary insurance for potential problems ahead in my view. ratt

-- ratt (round@nd.round), January 09, 2000.

Other than that, I haven't heard of any fropping shoes.

-- BeerMan (frbeerman@juno.com), January 09, 2000.

OK, I will plead ignorance on the solar flare thing. But Y2K is showig itself to be the mouse that tried roar. If it was gonna be that bad, we would have already had some tangible proof. As somone said, the burned out light bulb in Cold Moose Alaska or somewhere like that is getting blamed on Y2K and these are not serious events. Nothing major has hit yet. Therefore, the economy is not likely to collapse as a result of Y2K. If that were the perception (and perception is induced reality), we wouldn't be sitting at the highest Dow average in history today.

While I am certainly not fan of B.C. I see him at this point to be a weak lame duck and if that is what plans to do, he will never get it implemented! I see that scenario as one that will be played out decades from now, not months. If it were to be tried, do you really think the Republican controlled Congress would allow that to happen? I am probably as peaceful a person as you will ever meet but I would take to the streets on that one. You can bet the mood in the country is not right for that kind of thing and it may never be right! Let's hope! THAT MY FRIEND, is a scary prospect and is as "out there" as any thing I have heard predicted for the next few months.

Like I said, I know nothing about the solar flares but are they gonna be worse than they ever have?

I just don't buy this "bunker in" philosphy. Be prepped for a few days of whatever comes along, the rest of the stuff we will all have to deal with when it happens and 99.9% of us will be in the same boat when that happens anyway.

If the nukes fall, there is not enough food for anyone and there is nothing but a vast wasteland outside my door, and 99.9% of the people are fighting over a few bags of oreo cookies, then I dont wanna live anyway! Drop that bombh on my house please! I don't wanna see it. Let's see what's next! If I were living in a bunker with all my preps and a generator laughing at the poor fools outside, that would not be an existence worth living so what is the point?

-- DAVID (tdavidc@arn.net), January 09, 2000.

No tangible effects of y2k - how many refineries have to be shut down until we have a problem? There were two announced shutdowns this week that I know about, plus serveral others went up in flames. The plans are to implement the one-world government in the year 2000. As for the Republican-controlled Congress, they had their chance to remove B.C. But most of the members are B&B, that is bribed and/or blackmailed. They chose not to, even though they know (better than we) what he is. The plan is fixed and on target. The troops/equipment to implement are in place. People more knowledgable that I are talking about it. Solar flares - worse than ever? Peak solar flares occur every eleven years. The last time we didn't have a fraction of the satellites in space that we now depend on, as part of our telecommunications infrastruction. If they are worse or as bad is not the question. The last time, they blew out the Canadian grid for 30 days. This time, we have lots more at risk.

-- Y2kObserver (Y2kObserver@nowhere.com), January 09, 2000.

I did not "quit my job" and move, but I did focus much energy on preperation. We bought a farm, on a lake, which I like so much I plan to keep it regardless.

I have a feeling that we may have been preparing for 'something'. Perhaps something other than pure y2k. I know it won't take much to topple this house of cards. TPTB know it as well, which explains why they were terrified of y2k. I don't know how bad it will be once the market breaks other than to say "bad".

I feel it is far too soon to be simply discarding the preps. No relief organization, however noble, will get this stuff for quite some time yet.

-- Me (me@me.me), January 09, 2000.

Oh for the love of CHRIST!!!

Some of you folks will fucking NEVER give it up!!!!

-- jumpoff joe a.k.a. Al K. Lloyd (jumpoff@ekoweb.net), January 09, 2000.

Mr. "Jump Off Joe" (By the way that is an actual place in my county where wagon trains were lowered down a steep trail.)

You are in Oregon, I believe. Go look at the earthquake map. Just a few days ago we had a 5.1 off punta gorda. I am glad you feel so secure that no natural disaster will ever touch you.

-- marsh (armstrng@sisqtel.net), January 09, 2000.

Marsh, I've long suspected we were neighbors. I live on Jumpoff Joe Creek. How about you? Do you live in Scott Valley? Is there really a Jumpoff Joe there? Actually, I know of LOTS of Jumpoff Joe's from here in S. Oregon to Washington. Would be nice to hear about one in California. Now all I need to know is what a jumpoff joe really is....

I'm sorry I gave the impression that I "feel so secure that no natural disaster will ever touch" me. Matter of fact, I'm a trained CERT volunteer. I'm pretty well prepared for myself, and for my neighborhood. Why are you asking me this strange question?

I'm just pretty amazed that there are still people spouting out such inanities as "David: From my continuing research, here are the potential problems for year 2000: 1. Depression/recession fall-out from Y2k 2. Internal war/conflict resulting from planned implementation of one world government (just ask Kofi Annan or B.C.). This may require collapse of our economy. 3. Solar flares peaking in June, 2000 - could affect grid/all electronics."

There are SO many things to freak out about, if you really put your mind to it...

-- jumpoff joe a.k.a. Al K. Lloyd (jumpoff@ekoweb.net), January 09, 2000.

Joe -

By local historical accounts, "Jump Off Joe" is up above Shasta Valley on a steep grade along the Emigrant trail leading from Butte Valley. According to records, a tree stump there "bore rope or chain marks from where the emigrants tied them to help the teams down the very steep grade or with heavy loads."

(I guess "Joe" jumped off before he went down with the team.)

-- marsh (armstrng@sisqtel.net), January 09, 2000.

A situation which will certainly cause no greater impact than the Baht (the what?)

http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/000108/k.html

Saturday January 8, 11:25 am Eastern Time

U.S. pledges support, calls for calm in Ecuador

BOSTON, Jan 8 (Reuters) - U.S. Treasury Secretary Lawrence Summers said on Saturday the United States would support crisis-hit Ecuador as it struggles through its worst economic crisis in decades amid mounting political instability.

``We have been following developments in Ecuador closely,'' he told reporters on the sidelines of an economic conference. ``The achievement of stability and confidence in Ecuador would be very much in the interest of the United States.''

Ecuador, a poor country of 12.4 million people, is caught in a painful economic slump. Its inflation was the highest in Latin America last year and its economy is believed to have contracted 7.3 percent in 1999.

Ecuador's sucre currency finished the first working week of 2000 down 17 percent, after diving 67 percent in 1999.

After months of negotiations, the cash-strapped country signed a letter of intent with the International Monetary Fund last September, promising bold economic reforms, higher taxes and a stronger financial sector in return for an IMF loan.

But the government has yet to fulfill the promises it made in that letter, and the IMF loan has not been finalized. The IMF said it will resume talks with Ecuador next week.

-- Me (me@me.me), January 09, 2000.

David, I believe that most of us at this forum are prepared somewhere in between the 3 day thing you spoke of and the "bunker" level. It doesn't take much of a "disaster" to need a few weeks or months of preps. I personally don't want to be in the same boat as 99% of the people- if the boat is sinking. Just my thoughts. As always, it's a personal decision. Good luck.

-- (rcarver@inacom.com), January 09, 2000.

Thanks, Marsh, BEAUTIFUL coutry down there. I helped my friend celebrate his fiftieth last year at a Methodist (?) church camp, or something down there, way up in the snow, pretty much due west of Mt. Shasta and Black Butte. Awesome, waking up and watching the colors and shadows change on the mountain, which was not in clouds for the three or four days we stayed there (great party)

I love it when I can actually see Mt. Shasta when drive down that way, or more recently, take Amtrack through the valley.

-- jumpoff joe a.k.a. Al K. Lloyd (jumpoff@ekoweb.net), January 10, 2000.